13 gr LG, CCI 450, 40 gr Tipped Varmageddon, any cases in a Miroku Low Wall Hornet. Most days under 3/4" and you can see the look of surprise in their eyes! I'm now playing w/ my 17 Rem Contender 21" carb. and 20 gr Varms. at somewhat over 17 Hornet Vel., I like to see em' get it! If anybody has a fav 3500 or so 20 gr 17 Rem load I'd be obliged to ya, I'm startin w/15 gr I-4227, it shoots a lot flatter than the 40 gr Hornet. Muddy
