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Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 20,379
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 20,379 |
You'd know it too, if you spent any time on the street!
I replace valve cover gaskets every 50K, if they don't need them sooner...
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Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 20,379
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 20,379 |
I replace valve cover gaskets every 50K, if they don't need them sooner...
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Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 18,352 Likes: 1
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 18,352 Likes: 1 |
It is people shooting again, not hunting. I agree you should not shoot anyone behind the creep but in most cases it is another creep anyway. I have no guns to carry but my hunting guns are good for 5 creeps in a row. They will shoot through a house and take out an engine block. Why would a cop put himself in the line of fire? If you'd ever spent any time on the street, you'd know there's a LOT of times when you'd have one guy directly behind a perp, purposefully or not. Chit happens on the street, it's never clinical. And when on the street, there's rarely a time where you can say "I'll never do this or that". And you have to understand, it's almost always the other guy's decision on when you start the dance, so anything can happen. do tell us more about the "street".
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Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 3,549 Likes: 3
Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 3,549 Likes: 3 |
It's a gunfight, for foooks sake. Collateral damage is going to occur and if people on either side--or no side--wander into somebody's field of fire (FOF) only dumb luck or the grace of God keeps them from eating a bullet.
It's important to remember that EACH participant has their own ideas about where their FOF is. That decision is based on a triage of perceived threats evaluated in fractions of seconds. Their FOF may rotate 360 degrees in less time than it took you to read this sentence.
Any round worth carrying is going to shoot through the torso, more often than not.
Direct Impingement is the Fart Joke of military rifle operating systems. ⓒ
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Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 115,424 Likes: 13
Campfire Sage
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Campfire Sage
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 115,424 Likes: 13 |
But Massad said I'll have a tough time in court if my bullets aren't lodged in the perp?
He also inspired me to never put reloads in my home defense guns.
And he kept me clear of those POS Glocks. Until Glock started paying him of course. Then I discovered they were A-OK!!!
Travis
Trump being classless,tasteless and clueless as usual. Sorry, trump is a no tax payin pile of shiit. My young wife decided to play the field and had moved several dudes into my house
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Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 67,830 Likes: 13
Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 67,830 Likes: 13 |
Campfire doctrine says a pistol is a poor substitute for a centerfire rifle but we don't want a pistol to penetrate as much as a centerfire rifle.
Right!!! Now you're getting it sometimes folks get side tracked though. The only reason to carry a gun for protection, is for, well protection. It only makes sense to carry the most effective weapon you can, consistant with other considerations. I'd be more inclined to err on the side of my choice being 'dammed effective', than one that was 'ok if you do everything right, and thimgs go your way'. I will deal with the specter of over penetration, if it happens, but frankly, it's an iffy thing, not all that common, and not my biggest concern.
Sam......
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Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 115,424 Likes: 13
Campfire Sage
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Campfire Sage
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 115,424 Likes: 13 |
My thoughts on the article:
Trump being classless,tasteless and clueless as usual. Sorry, trump is a no tax payin pile of shiit. My young wife decided to play the field and had moved several dudes into my house
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Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 17,222 Likes: 9
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 17,222 Likes: 9 |
Creativity at is finiest right there.
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Joined: Jan 2012
Posts: 9,416 Likes: 3
Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Jan 2012
Posts: 9,416 Likes: 3 |
Ayoob still teaches that if in a self defense shooting insisting on an attorney before making a statement aligns you w/ the criminal element in the eyes of the police.
mike r
Don't wish it were easier Wish you were better
Stab them in the taint, you can't put a tourniquet on that. Craig Douglas ECQC
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Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 115,424 Likes: 13
Campfire Sage
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Campfire Sage
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 115,424 Likes: 13 |
Ah, yes. I forgot that jewel.
Thanks miker.
Dave
Trump being classless,tasteless and clueless as usual. Sorry, trump is a no tax payin pile of shiit. My young wife decided to play the field and had moved several dudes into my house
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Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 30,998 Likes: 8
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 30,998 Likes: 8 |
My thoughts on the article: I'd say the meter is accurate, especially after this BS Ayoob wrote in the article Defense experts concurred, and the jury acquitted, as they should have. But Case Twenty-Nine probably wouldn’t have gone to trial if the defendant had loaded his gun with proper hollow points, which almost certainly would have left the mushroomed bullet embedded inside the neck and shown that the attacker was shot from the front.
I'd wager heavily that a 180 JHP in 40 cal would have exited as well. Adobo is getting really ridiculous and Kevin didn't choose a very good article to back up his position.
I got banned on another web site for a debate that happened on this site. That's a first
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Joined: May 2010
Posts: 1,487
Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
Joined: May 2010
Posts: 1,487 |
….I'd say the meter is accurate, especially after this BS Ayoob wrote in the article... …I'm not trying to defend Ayoob, nor be contentious……after reading the article, I can't figure out what you feel is objectively BS??? I don't pretend to know a lot about terminal ballistics, but on the face of it, his info seemed logical…..where am I wrong??? http://dailycaller.com/2014/02/25/m...st-defensive-ammo-for-concealed-carry/2/
Last edited by gmoats; 06/12/15.
The blindness from subjectivity is indistinguishable from the darkness of ignorance.
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Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 115,424 Likes: 13
Campfire Sage
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Campfire Sage
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 115,424 Likes: 13 |
I'd wager heavily that a 180 JHP in 40 cal would have exited as well. Adobo is getting really ridiculous
Yep and yep. Dave
Trump being classless,tasteless and clueless as usual. Sorry, trump is a no tax payin pile of shiit. My young wife decided to play the field and had moved several dudes into my house
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Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 17,222 Likes: 9
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 17,222 Likes: 9 |
Not asking to talk to an attorney? Seriously. I guess Law Sheild has it all wrong then.
Oh I get it, by talking to an attorney, the police categorize you with politians.
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Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 30,998 Likes: 8
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 30,998 Likes: 8 |
….I'd say the meter is accurate, especially after this BS Ayoob wrote in the article... …I'm not trying to defend Ayoob, nor be contentious……after reading the article, I can't figure out what you feel is objectively BS??? I don't pretend to know a lot about terminal ballistics, but on the face of it, his info seemed logical…..where am I wrong??? http://dailycaller.com/2014/02/25/m...st-defensive-ammo-for-concealed-carry/2/ His info is non logic and I laid it out very plainly if you've read all of my posts in this thread.
Last edited by jwp475; 06/12/15.
I got banned on another web site for a debate that happened on this site. That's a first
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Joined: May 2010
Posts: 1,487
Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
Joined: May 2010
Posts: 1,487 |
I'm so sorry……the cracked head and .308 non-take-down explain it all…..
The blindness from subjectivity is indistinguishable from the darkness of ignorance.
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Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 96,121 Likes: 1
Campfire Oracle
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Campfire Oracle
Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 96,121 Likes: 1 |
Problem solved
"Dear Lord, save me from Your followers"
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Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 22,276
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 22,276 |
I read Ayoob a long time ago and passed on his book to several new shooters. IMO he was one of the first people to objectively analyze what really happens in defensive shootings and clearly communicate the results - and he helped dispel a lot of dangerous myths in the process. So I think he has done many people a great service both in terms of tactics to survive dangerous encounters, and in tactics to win the legal fights afterward. But yeah, some of his tactics are questionable, and may not work all that well in all situations. And if I can't buy the most desirable defensive ammo, I'll roll my own
"...the designer of the .270 Ingwe cartridge!..."
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Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 30,998 Likes: 8
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 30,998 Likes: 8 |
D. A. "Jelly" Bryce killed quite a few criminals in gunfights and when asked if ever worried about bring them in alive his reply was that he was more worried about bringing himself in alive.
I got banned on another web site for a debate that happened on this site. That's a first
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Joined: May 2010
Posts: 1,487
Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
Joined: May 2010
Posts: 1,487 |
D. A. "Jelly" Bryce killed quite a few criminals in gunfights and when asked if ever worried about bring them in alive his reply was that he was more worried about bringing himself in alive. …..just for you, Ayoob's review of the book bout Bryce: http://backwoodshome.com/blogs/MassadAyoob/2014/06/14/a-great-novel-about-a-great-cop/
Last edited by gmoats; 06/12/15.
The blindness from subjectivity is indistinguishable from the darkness of ignorance.
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