Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Savage Collectors Steven's 75... or 29-A... or both...

Picked up an interesting Stevens branded version of the Savage Model 29, it has the barrel marked 'Model 75' and the receiver marked as a 'Model 29-A'. I have found for Stevens labeled guns those marked 'Model 29-A' to be one of the rarest, and those marked 'Model 75' the most common. This one answered some questions I had but raised many more. I have some thoughts on what it is but want to show the pictures first so I don't influence anyone's opinion, I had some preconceived ideas when I looked at it so my assessment might be biased toward what I wanted to see, or expected to see.

It's the bottom one, the top is one just marked STEVEN'S MODEL 29-A for comparison.



The receivers on both guns are marked the same but they have different actions -


Two different model markings, and a warning stamp about use of Hi-Speed ammunition -


The serial number on the stock has been X'ed out but there is enough showing to see that it matched the butt plate, which does not match the receiver, which has the very rare 'M' suffix -


The receiver does not have an inspection stamp -


(continued in next post, evidently there is a limit on the number of pictures for one post)

Close-up of the Hi-Speed warning stamp showing what looks like matching faded finish in the protected areas and raised edges, other stamps on the barrel appeared to have been done before polishing & finishing and have more finish left in protected areas-


I have seen the same warning stamp on several 1903's & 1914's and on one 1912, pictured here, all appear to have used the same roll stamp. Hi-Speed was not introduced until 1931 so this stamp could not have had to been applied to a 1912 until at least 15 years after this gun was made -


Savage/Stevens models that could not handle Hi-Speed that were still being made in 1931 and later were stamped 'REGULAR CARTRIDGES' somewhere for a warning when they left the factory, this stamp will be found on the last of the Savage Model (19) 04's and the weaker actioned Steven's models, including Visible Loaders as shown here -


My thoughts are that this gun was sent back to the factory for repair about 1940 or later and it required a new receiver, and even though it was an earlier model, for some reason they stamped the receiver with the stamp they were using about that time on the newer model, possibly it wasn't supposed to be stamped but got mixed in with the other receivers. This also would have been when they added the Hi-Speed warning stamp on the barrel.

Here are comparison pictures of two 29 actions showing why I think it might have needed a new receiver and why they added the Hi-Speed warning - the lower one shows damage to the locking surface I think was caused by Hi-Speed cartridges -


The distortion of the locking surface also starts to keep the bolt from raising to fully engage the locking surface and eventually could get to the point were the action would not close far enough to lock up. I think any play and any reduction in locking surface engagment would cause the damaged to progress very rapidly once it started. The example pictured is not the worse I have seen. You can check the locking surfaces for damage by looking through the ejection port.

According to JTC Savage made changed to the 29 action in 1931 for the use of Hi-Speed, from what I see the changes were just to better support the head of the cartridges and there were no changes to strengthen the action, unless they hardened it different or something, which I doubt, that's why I do not recommend shooting Hi-Speed loads in any 29 action.

I think the 29 was based on old expired patents for a design from 1912 and that is why it is one of the few Savage guns from the time that never had any patent information stamped on it - until they expired the patents were the property of someone else - first Sears & Roebuck and later Mossberg. Here is one of the Mossberg manufactured examples, you can see the similarities in the design to the Model 29 with all internal parts similar in form and identical in function, even down to the ball bearing cartridge release that was not in the original design but was introduced with other changes by Mossberg... and the same issues with the locking surface -


There are a couple patents for this action in the names of two brothers, but I think their father actually designed it, although there were inherent problems with this design, the father did have one earlier design that still has a very good reputation!

Have you found something that indicates that AJ and Basil had nothing to do with the rifle in question Gene? That would be neat to see.

I always love these postings. Full of good info, and someday it may not be way over my head.

This^^^
Thank the powers that be for GeneB.... the authority on these critters.

Nothing definite, a circa 1930 Mossberg ad for the Model K & M that had a note stating they were designed by Arthur W. Savage that "famous gun designer" & etc. Mossberg had to know the main design patent was in Basil's name. Was that the facts, or just advertising? Even if Arthur W. was the designer it does not rule out his sons also being involved.

I also found a 1907 newspaper article about Arthur W. suing Savage Arms for unpaid back wages, in the trial Savage Arms lawyers brought up the issue of knowing Arthur W. having another 22 designed that 'was either a new design or an improvement on a design' and that Arthur W. had a 'no competition clause' in the contract, possibly thinking that had voided the contract. I have found no firearms patents for Arthur W. that were filed after he left Savage, I think the design mentioned in the trial was for the Steven's Gallery 80 and the patents ended up in Arthur J.'s name - that would avoid legal issues with Savage Arms if it was the design mentioned.

Everything is just suggestive but I don't think it likely that Arthur W. all of a sudden just quite designing guns because of his agreement with Savage Arms and that his son's all of a sudden did, coming up with some fairly complicated first designs.

Very interesting and very much above my ability to grasp all of the information. Gene, you're the man when it comes to rimfire rifle minutia or pretty much anything for that matter. Keep it coming. I'm a slow learner but I keep re-reading the back posts.