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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
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The trick to it all is handloading. If I didn't, you couldn't give me a 260. It appears Federal stopped making their 110TTSX 270 load. I've got some stashed for my M70. If they were still plentiful, the temptation to go 23" 270 Montana 6x42 M1 and forget everything I know about 7Rm, 260, and reloading presses would be hard to pass up. Any situation where that rig failed to deliver is because a fella phuqqed something else up.
But I reckon I just ain't there yet.....
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Joined: Jan 2009
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Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
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I bought five boxes of those Fed loads at 3,400 FPS on clearance at Academy for $20 per box several years ago.
My oldest has zapped 3 WT w them at less than 100 yards. Died like they'd been shot w a .338 Lapua.
My ol' Mountain Rifle is zeroed for them, waiting for deer season. I may upgrade to a Montana 6.8-'06 this year. Need a stainless killer of everything near and far.
�When in doubt, I whip it out.� Uncle Ted ![[Linked Image]](http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v704/elrata/imagejpg1_zps585f4bbf.jpg)
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Joined: Feb 2010
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
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Big Green f'ed up what was a hell of a factory offering. Go figure.....
6.8-06, good one.
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Joined: Feb 2003
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Campfire Outfitter
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OP
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This has been a very thought provoking thread with a couple of different thoughts and associated recommendations. This is why I love this place and the people here. I thought I had an idea of where to go with this but thought I'd tap the collective experience of folks here. I can tell this is going to cost me more money than I originally thought <G>
Also note this thread hasn't turned into a pissing contest............
A left field idea that pounced on me last night. What about a 280 AI to handle double duty - elk and flat shooting? I'm also looking at a lighter weight elk rifle and was chewing on a 270 doing double duty as elk+flat shooter. I ran the numbers last night - the 280 AI recoils a little bit more than I wanted for a flat shooter but not as much as a light weight elk rifle. A 160 AB at 2900 shoots flat, bucks wind well and is up to the task for elks. A 140 AB at 3100 shoots as flat as anything mentioned plus bucks wind well. A bit more recoil than I want but not by a lot. It still recoils less than my current 300 WSM.
Adversity doesn't build character, it reveals it.
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Campfire Outfitter
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OP
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I also see that Barnes is offering a 145 gr LRX with a 0.486 BC. That might work on elks.
Adversity doesn't build character, it reveals it.
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Joined: Oct 2003
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Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
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All good suggestions here - I'll throw in my two cents. I like my 25-06 with TTSX's and also 100gr Sierra's. It's in a Weatherby fibermark which is pretty darn light and handy but lighter yet would be a Weatherby Ultra Light Weight. ONe of those chambered in 25-06 would be pretty nice. I've got other lighter weight rifles in 7/08, 308 and 270. They all work pretty darn good.
Regards,
Tom
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Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 35,900
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
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b: Either of the 270/280/280AI can be sighted and arranged for "hold on meat" to 300 yards,and even at 350 you won't be holding much more than high shoulder on a mature mule deer or elk.Bullets from 120-160 gr will do it. They all have enough case capacity to give the velocity. You can work out your own system for distances greater than that....  I know because I've used all three for exactly that. (My 280AI was labeled 7 Rem Mag). There's lots of bullets that will handle the deer,antelope,and elk. I was shooting a 22" 7# 270 the other day and could hardly feel it go off.
The 280 Remington is overbore.
The 7 Rem Mag is over bore.
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
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Mornin Mr B: Talk about opening Pandora's Box !! Asking this ? here.  Jerry A Friendly Reminder. In all this thread I've only seen a couple of cartridge recommendations that don't suit me. It's not about me, so.. I agree with YOU & BobNH - The 280AI>>>270Win would accomplish YOUR expressed goal. AGAIN -- Good Luck Jerry
jwall- *** 3100 guy***
A Flat Trajectory is Never a Handicap
Speed is Trajectory's Friend !!
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Joined: Feb 2010
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
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Assuming you hand load (and like it) 280AI would cover a lot of bases. I'd think a Montana would be pretty sharp in the recoil department. I hated my 270WSM Montana.
Handloading for me anymore is like watching paint dry, which is why I'd take a 270 over 280AI these days. Sure, you can load "for half price" or better.
All a matter of how much time you have on your hands.
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Campfire Outfitter
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OP
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I've reloaded since I was a kid. It's become second nature to me. Plus I like knowing I can run out to the garage and whip up a box of shells in less than 1/2 hour. It takes me that long to get to the store and back.
Recoil is a concern. Not necessarily the recoil energy but the recoil velocity is normally what people notice the most. Fast recoil velocity feels like a sharp punch in the shoulder. Heavier rifle mute the velocity better.
Adversity doesn't build character, it reveals it.
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
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That's how my 7# 270wsm got sold and 8# 7RM stayed.
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Joined: Nov 2013
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Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
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The key to OP's question is whether or not he hand-loads. If not that limits the choices he may have in ammunition. Nearly all if the recommendations listed above will work nicely. Obviously, the wildcats would not be suitable. Personally, I prefer to hunt big game with bullets having a Sectional Density near or above the .250 level and a B C near or above .400. Speed kills but it is largely irrelevant in 99% of big game hunting applications. I started with the .270 and have taken more game with it than anything else but have used it much longer. I would vote along with the 7mm-08 group for the SA, lighter weight rifle but I prefer a wood stock although my safe is packed with a variety of synthetics going back to Lee Six and Chet Brown. I just LIKE nice wood. IMHO the 7mm-08 will deliver the goods on about 80% of all game on the planet within the normal hunting ranges that most of us are competent. It will also allow a very wide variety of bullet selections for the reloader and yet the common factory load at 140 grains will work for most game. I think our family is up to 6 assorted 7mm-08's and I have another one on my Santa list.
Why does a man who is 50 pounds overweight complain about a 10 pound rifle being too heavy?
SCI Life Member 4**
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Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Apr 2004
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whatever rifle you like...
and chambered in a 243, 260, or 7/08....
throw in any of the Creedmoor derivatives just to make that crowd happy...
ya wanna go cheap but accurate... Ruger American..
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Campfire Member
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Campfire Member
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Another vote for a Montana in 243 with 95gr. BT's, from another older guy. I love mine.
Easy to carry, light, and accurate, with low recoil. I'm sure the 270 would work just as well, with a little more weight and recoil.
The 22" barrel on the 84M makes it a little more compact than the 84L with it's 24", but I've never had an issue with it.
Last edited by sigguy; 11/05/15.
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Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
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Bwinters, just ran numbers on 110 TTSX at 3350 at 1,100 altitude where I hunt in Cannon County. Zero 1.5 high at 100 gives ya 250 yard zero. At 400 yards its 11.4 low and zipping about 2530 w 1567 ft. Lbs. an uber macho 6.8-'06 is an elk rifle that will scrag deer and antelope with alacrity and kick less than a 130 at 3k. And they work great in the dark woods of the Highland Rim, though they Waaay Overpenetrate. , 
Last edited by ColdCase1984; 11/05/15.
�When in doubt, I whip it out.� Uncle Ted
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Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
Joined: Jan 2005
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I'm looking at re-vamping my rifles - moving more towards portability and less recoil. I'm chewing on ideas for a portable flat shooting rifle. Recoil figures into the equation – I’m looking for reduced recoil. I must be getting old. The older I get the more I gravitate to lighter rifles that recoil less.
If someone was to pick from the Kimber Montana line-up and was looking for a flat shooter for mule deer and antelope, what would your pick be and why. I’d also like to know bullet choice.
Currently I’m leaning 270 or 25-06 shooting 130PT/140AB in the 270 or 110 AB/115 PT in the 25-06. I think the 280 AI is more recoil than I want in a 7lb rifle but I’m open to all suggestions.
I shot my first mule deer and antelope in WY in 1982 with a 270 and 130 Hornady. It worked as expected. I’ve shot several deer with a 25-06 and first gen TSX’s – and wasn’t impressed with the TSX on deer. I switched to Partitions in the rifle and it was a killer but the PT didn’t group near as well as the TSX’s. I have zero experience with the 25-06 out west and would like to hear comments by those that have. My concern with 25 cal bullets is that they aren't all that slippery plus at 25-06 vels bullet integrity needs to be there when they are fairly close. Flat is fine. It does NOT solve wind drift..... rangefinders and knobs solve flat issues...
We can keep Larry Root and all his idiotic blabber and user names on here, but we can't get Ralph back..... Whiskey Tango Foxtrot, over....
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
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If you like to monkey with numbers, here's a few from a spreadsheet of about 125 loads (prospective, I don't own this much schit) that I've looked at over the years. Some like crossword puzzles, I like statistics.
Anyhoo....
Looking at BC and essentially MAX loads, you end up with the following median ranges of drift per "class" of BC. 500 yards, 10 MPH
.300 - .399 = 23"
.400 - .499 = 19"
.500 - .599 = 17"
.600 - .659 = 14"
I topped out at .659, but its as meaningful or meaningless as your ability to read wind. So 4 rifles with each class and we know the exact speed and direction, everyone hits. The difference though, would be the loss or gain in drift with uncertainty of speed and direction.
Summary: find a bullet suitable for the target you intend to engage and practice like hell.
Oops, dropped my pocket protector.....
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
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And to add to the geekdom of it all, the median load of the pile is a hypothetical 143 gr, .470 BC @3,000 FPS.
Wind speed at 90 degree angle @ 500 yards
4 mph = 7.3"
6 mph = 11"
8 mph = 14.6"
10 mph = 18.3"
12 mph = 21.9"
14 mph = 25.6"
16 mph = 29.3"
Interesting? Maybe....
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Joined: Mar 2011
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Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
Joined: Mar 2011
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definitely interesting and, given linear figures, illustrates what the challenges are of hitting where you want at 1000 yds and beyond. North and South is easy. East and West, not so much.
Nut
Experience hath shewn, that even under the best forms of government those entrusted with power have, in time, and by slow operations, perverted it into tyranny.
Thomas Jefferson
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Campfire Outfitter
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OP
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You and I are related................
I have a spreadsheet full of drops, remaining vels, and 10 mph 90 deg wind drift. Its not all about BC, initial velocity plays a big role in drop/drift.
In all the gacking have a look at the 0.284 145 LRX. Not a super BC (0.485) but when kick started at 7 mag vels its pretty impressive but the kicker to me is that you close range performance in addition to decent drop/drift. They have a 129 gr version for the 270 crowd.
Adversity doesn't build character, it reveals it.
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