Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Ask The Gunwriters Primer question for Mule Deer

Just did an inventory and I'm fairly well fixed, but now that I've got a .223 again, I need to pick up some more SRs. I'd be happy to try the Tulas, but they're just not available locally, and my limited needs make paying hazmat too pricey.

One of the older packs of CCIs had the price marked on it- $1.45!

Where does one find foreign primers? I've never seen them here in PA.

On Internet sites.

I've seen the Tula's at a gun show or two also, granted, a year or so back.

Geno

Powder Valley has not had Tula Primers for a while. I wonder what's going on with that...

John

So, in a nut shell:
--No one knows how to actually make contact with Win Ammunition and to be able to get any relief from the problems with their WLR primers.

--Everyone is just quietly going to other makers as available and letting their Win primers set or selling them off to unsuspecting users.

I was hoping that someone would actually be in the know or the loop on this.

I guess if I label primers with a disclaimer at gun show, I would them with the knowledge that their are some issues.
Not the best solution in my mind, but...
Tim

This is the place:

http://www.winchester.com/Product-Service/Pages/Contact-Us.aspx

I don't know what they'll do for you, but others have reported that they will send out a truck for defective primers, replace them, and reimburse you for repairs to your rifle. I requested information about bad lot numbers and got back a form letter. Perhaps a complaint about actual damage will do better.

There's another thread here about this with a list of lot numbers known to have issues, plus some added single lot numbers. I spent an hour or so surfing around and came up with a whole bunch more from various forums, more than I have time to type in. Gven that I've got maybe $50 worth of WLRs, none of which are from the reportedly bad lots, it's easiest to just bail on them. I'll try to sell or give them away, with full disclosure, and move on.

I've never visited their site before today. Looks like they have good prices, but seem to be out of everything everyone else is out of. It's one more place to look, though. Thanks.

In the past my local Sportsmans Warehouse has had Tula primers. But now-a-days they seem about as common there as Federal 210M's or 215M's...

One thing about Tula small-rifle primers (and some other brands) is they offer several models, which differ in cup hardness/thickness.

The Tula SR primer I'm using is their "softest," the KVB-223. Despite the model name, they don't recommend it for AR-15's, or any other cartridge where pressures are normally much over 50,000 PSI.

But I load a lot of cartridges where standard SAAMI pressures don't exceed 50,000, including the .17 Hornady Hornet and .22 Hornet, and 50,000 is the SAAMI maximum average pressure for the .222 Remington. The KVB-223 works fine in all three of those rounds, and I've also had no problems with it in the .17 Fireball (SAAMI MAP 55,000), where accuracy was as good as with any other primer, and in normal loads in bolt-action .223's. But I usually use tougher-cup primers in the .223, because I might use any of my .223 handloads in an AR-15.

If you tend to push pressures by working up loads until you encounter "pressure signs," you'll probably encounter some with the Tula KVB-223. It would not, for instance, be a primer I'd recommend for the .223 Ackley Improved, or any of the factory rounds where SAAMI pressures (and hence published loading data) exceed 55,000 PSI. The list of such cartriges might surprise you. As an example, while the .17 Fireball's SAAMI MAP is only 55,000 PSI, the .221 Fireball's is 60,000.

Some other small-rifle primers aren't recommended for higher-pressure rounds, including the Remington 6-1/2. I describe the history and reasons behind all this in my new handloading book, but thought posting a caution here would also be a good idea.

Just a note: This is of course indirect evidence, but chrono results suggest the S&B 5.3LR primer is pretty mild. In a number of tests** it has been about 25 fps behind the CCI200 with several powders.

**Ten shot strings over an Oehler 35P

Thanks Pappy348
I will put in my complaint and see what response comes back.
Tim

I need to reload some 308 ammo for an AR10. But I can’t find any CCI #34 primers around here or in Houston. I don’t want to order off the web because of the hazardous material shipping charge. What would be a safe primer for a 308 auto? I have CCI 200 & 250, Federal 210, 210M, 215 & 215M, Winchester LR and Wolf LRM in my loading room. The Winchester LR primers are older and I have had no problems loading them in 25-06 and 308 bolt guns.

Richard

I've gathered that the CCI200 is fine for avoiding slam fires in M1A loads.

I had a talk with a long-time CCI employee about the mil-spec primers a year or so ago. It turns out they don't have thicker cups, as many people believe, or even "lower" anvils. Instead they have more rounded anvils, which helps prevent slam-fires when primers are seated slightly "proud" of the case-head.

The biggie is making sure any of them are seated deeply enough, but I have run thousands of BR-4's and 450's in various AR-15's with zero slam-fires.

Dang it, now I need to swap from WLR and WLRM to Federal.

I used to be happily ignorant...




P

I know what you mean about the 6-1/2s. I was using 7-1/2s in my .222, but switched to the sixes after reading Pet Loads, even though Ken's update used the sevens. Backed 1/2 grain off my powder charge to keep the primers looking pretty after firing. May have picked up a tenth or two in accuracy, maybe not. But, I've got a brick to go through, and minute-of-Coffeemate-bottle at 300 meters is fine for me.

LOL I still have packs of primers in the CENTS range of pricing...

I have a powder can, sans powder, IIRC, somewhere, around 1.?? or 2.?? dollars...

What year did problems with Winchester primers seem to surface? All my WLR's are marked with a sharpie purchased from the 2005-2007 year range. (have a good supply)

They are all I use to load the LeverEvolution rounds for our nine 30-30 rifles.

I did once see a partial lot number list but was wondering what approximate years they were produced?

PM sent Roadkill.