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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
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I think the rest of the folks in his truck are lucky he didn't get them all shot driving at the the road block the way he did. The officer he almost hit looks to be trying to get out of the way because he thought the truck was going to ram the vehicles. Play stupid games. Win stupid prizes. I saw something completely different. I saw an officer leap to the berm, so as to block or discourage the driver from from proceeding. Wasn't that exactly the point of the road block, and the traffic stop Finicum had already fled? There was more than one officer there, and willhunt4's comment is still accurate; rounds could have very easily been fired legitimately at a vehicle approaching a road block at that rate of speed, especially when the driver has already fled another traffic stop and is known to be armed.
America needs to understand that our troops are not 'disposable'. Each represents a family; Fathers, Mothers, Sons, Daughters, Cousins, Uncles, Aunts... Our Citizens are our most valuable treasure; we waste far too many.
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Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
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People are seeing only what they want to and refusing to accept anything contrary to that even when it's right in front of them.
There's a whole lot of that these days.
The only thing worse than a liberal is a liberal that thinks they're a conservative.
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Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Jan 2010
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I reiterate my earlier post. People are seeing only what they want to and refusing to accept anything contrary to that even when it's right in front of them.
Did Finicum think that the situation would de-escalate when he hauled ass from the first stop, and then tried to run around the second road block? "hauled ass"(sic), he did not appear to be going that fast. I was surprised by this the first time I watched the video, and remarked to myself that he did not appear to be speeding. 4ager, Can I respectfully ask if you've worked in law enforcement or are close to someone who has?
If you put Taco Bell sauce in your ramen noodles it tastes just like poverty
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Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Jan 2010
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People are seeing only what they want to and refusing to accept anything contrary to that even when it's right in front of them.
There's a whole lot of that these days. If you intended to include me in these descriptions, then I don't think you're being fair to my posts.
If you put Taco Bell sauce in your ramen noodles it tastes just like poverty
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Joined: Oct 2004
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Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 50,169 Likes: 1 |
People are seeing only what they want to and refusing to accept anything contrary to that even when it's right in front of them.
There's a whole lot of that these days. If you intended to include me in these descriptions, then I don't think you're being fair to my posts. I did not. It was a general statement.
The only thing worse than a liberal is a liberal that thinks they're a conservative.
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Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
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Through his words and deeds Mr. Finicum demanded a certain level of service from the police, which they provided. End of story.....
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Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
Joined: Aug 2004
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People see what they want to see.
Not only this, but most other things as well.
Molɔ̀ːn Labé Skýla!
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Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 50,169 Likes: 1 |
People are seeing only what they want to and refusing to accept anything contrary to that even when it's right in front of them.
There's a whole lot of that these days. If you intended to include me in these descriptions, then I don't think you're being fair to my posts. I did not. It was a general statement. Unless you're a Trump disciple. 
The only thing worse than a liberal is a liberal that thinks they're a conservative.
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Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Mar 2007
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I reiterate my earlier post. People are seeing only what they want to and refusing to accept anything contrary to that even when it's right in front of them.
Did Finicum think that the situation would de-escalate when he hauled ass from the first stop, and then tried to run around the second road block? "hauled ass"(sic), he did not appear to be going that fast. I was surprised by this the first time I watched the video, and remarked to myself that he did not appear to be speeding. 4ager, Can I respectfully ask if you've worked in law enforcement or are close to someone who has? he made it 50 ish feet into a set up snow bank up hill.....my non scientific guess is he was doing around 40mph. that is not a speed you want to catch a 3/4 ton truck at. his driving could have got everyone killed.....of course, we don't know at what piont the truck started taking fire. He may well have ducked and throttled up in diving to the floor....that could have been solved by stopping before adding charges that are really tough to defend.....like resisting.
I would not buy something that runs on any kind of primer given the possibility of primer shortages and even regulations. In fact, why not buy a flintlock? Really. Rocks aren't going away anytime soon.
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Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
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I think the rest of the folks in his truck are lucky he didn't get them all shot driving at the the road block the way he did. The officer he almost hit looks to be trying to get out of the way because he thought the truck was going to ram the vehicles. Play stupid games. Win stupid prizes. I saw something completely different. I saw an officer leap to the berm, so as to block or discourage the driver from from proceeding. WTF! So a 200 pound man is going to jump in front of a 2 ton vehicle traveling at say 50 miles per hour and stop that vehicle? You can't be serious.
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Joined: Jul 2011
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Jul 2011
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I reiterate my earlier post. People are seeing only what they want to and refusing to accept anything contrary to that even when it's right in front of them.
Did Finicum think that the situation would de-escalate when he hauled ass from the first stop, and then tried to run around the second road block? "hauled ass"(sic), he did not appear to be going that fast. I was surprised by this the first time I watched the video, and remarked to myself that he did not appear to be speeding. 4ager, Can I respectfully ask if you've worked in law enforcement or are close to someone who has? Not a cop; no cops in the immediate family (it's a damned big extended family - I've got cousins I've never met). Speed in videos can be deceiving, and are also condition dependent. That ain't no KS interstate in sunny, dry, summer conditions he's on. Finicum was known to be armed, had stated that he wouldn't be taken alive, ran from the first road engagement, and was coming at the roadblock at a rate of speed sufficient to take a FS truck off the road by several feet into and through snow banks several feet deep. Every action he took to that point had escalated the situation. He exits the truck making a run, as best as possible in the deep snow, for the trees, continues to move when likely ordered to stop and keep his hands up. During that he twice reaches toward the inside pocket of his coat (loaded pistol found there). None of his actions de-escalated the situation. To think that he, or anyone else, WOULDN'T have justifiably been shot in that scenario is silly. He's damned lucky he didn't get anyone else in that truck killed.
America needs to understand that our troops are not 'disposable'. Each represents a family; Fathers, Mothers, Sons, Daughters, Cousins, Uncles, Aunts... Our Citizens are our most valuable treasure; we waste far too many.
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
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Without being too much of an "analyst" this time, its a shame that the man had to talk it up so much in advance.
I'm sure that played a part in the neurons firing there at the end.
A lot of bravado about not going quietly, and next thing you know, you're in the middle of nowhere with a gun and a bunch of cops on a felony stop.
Some stupid little lobe in the noodle saying, "Well, we said we won't go to jail...."
Good thing we aren't held to the chutzpah written out here on so many occasions, eh?
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Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
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I think the rest of the folks in his truck are lucky he didn't get them all shot driving at the the road block the way he did. The officer he almost hit looks to be trying to get out of the way because he thought the truck was going to ram the vehicles. Play stupid games. Win stupid prizes. I saw something completely different. I saw an officer leap to the berm, so as to block or discourage the driver from from proceeding. You have to be kidding. The dumbest of dumb wouldn't jump in front of a moving truck. This shows folks see want they WANT to see.
Last edited by callnum; 01/29/16.
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Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
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Canoe Having been on the receiving end of a felony stop, seven sheriff office cars surrounding me, helicopter overhead, in a case of mistaken identity.............
I can tell one thing from the video.
Mr Finicum did just about EVERYTHING wrong if one wanted to survive.
Geno
I can vouch for that also. You dudes who think he was reaching where he was "already shot" are reaching yourselves. No indication at all from the rest of his body of any trauma. He was bolt upright and scanning for a target while smoothly reaching to his waste. Even appears that he is pulling his jacket open with his left hand. Trust me on this......unless one is completely batty, that is not how one responds to a felony stop with intentions of complying and surviving.
Lunatic fringe....we all know you're out there.
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
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Has anyone ever walked in snow on a hill? I'm seeing him bust through and try to catch himself, which was probably about the time he had serious abdominal pain from getting shot.
He did enough things wrong to earn it, but I don't see him going for a piece, especially not without cover or concealment and 20 rifles trained on him.
Bad move by both sides IMO. Given his statements about not being taken alive, you still believe this? watch the others exit the car, they all had trouble walking in the snow given the grade. I am not saying the cops were not in the right to whack him, but I don't believe that he seriously though that he would stand a chance to get a shot off, even Bob Munden would be hard pressed to do so against those odd. Was it suicide by cop? a ground level tape with audio is all that can answer that. I would not be able to convict a cop for the shooting given the priors and the action leading up to the stop, but I also cannot dismiss the fact that Mr Finicum may have either slipped and been shot due to the sudden movement or been doing as told and got popped. there were a lot of guns on him and a lot of adrenaline flowing. That's the whole premise behind suicide by cop
The government plans these shootings by targeting kids from kindergarten that the government thinks they can control with drugs until the appropriate time--DerbyDude
Whatever. Tell the oompa loompa's hey for me. [/quote]. LtPPowell
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Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
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I believe that armed law enforcement officers should be held to the highest standards. Their safety should come second to preserving the rights of citizens. Being confused, angry, ignorant, stupid, mentally ill, acting out, resisting, etc. does not forfeit your rights. The only entity empowered to restrict a person's right is a court of law.
Freedom is not free. It requires sacrifice and tolerance. Preserving the freedom of speech means that we've got to allow everyone to voice their opinions, without regard for the content. Preserving the right to bear arms, means that we're going to live in a society where citizens have access to dangerous weapons and that there's no practical way to prevent accidents and tragedy from resulting from this access. It's a give and take. Preserving religious freedoms means allowing others to practice religions differing from your own.
We celebrate those who serve in law enforcement. We do so because working in law enforcement is dangerous. In a free society law enforcement officers accept these risks, not out of benefit to themselves, but for societies' benefit. Their commitment is not transitory, they can't choose when to put themselves at risk and when not to. Bless them for serving.
The last few decades has seen Law enforcement become increasingly militarized. Law enforcement is well trained, well equipped, and well compensated. I applaud their service and sacrifice, but I do so realizing that they've choose to put the job before themselves and now have a duty to do so.
I must have missed where officers are supposed to take one for the team before they can do their job.
"And for the support of this Declaration, with a firm reliance on the protection of divine Providence, we mutually pledge to each other our Lives, our Fortunes and our sacred Honor." ![[Linked Image]](http://www.rockymtnrefl.com/TetonFenceBarncd1985987.jpg)
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Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
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if you make a public statement that you won't be taken alive, you kind of lessen your chances of survival. +1 ... Finicum must have had a death wish.
"Far better it is to dare mighty things, to win glorious triumphs, even though checkered by failure, than to take rank with those poor spirits who neither enjoy much nor suffer much" Teddy Roosevelt
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Sep 2006
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Mr Finicum did just about EVERYTHING wrong if one wanted to survive.
The entire bunch of them did just about everything wrong that could have possibly been done wrong from day one. What did they expect was going to be the outcome? They set themselves up to lose from the get-go & now it's become reality. MM
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Joined: May 2002
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Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: May 2002
Posts: 10,255 |
Mr Finicum did just about EVERYTHING wrong if one wanted to survive.
The entire bunch of them did just about everything wrong that could have possibly been done wrong from day one. What did they expect was going to be the outcome? They set themselves up to lose from the get-go & now it's become reality. MM 100% correct.
Lunatic fringe....we all know you're out there.
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Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 32,130 Likes: 1
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 32,130 Likes: 1 |
I believe that armed law enforcement officers should be held to the highest standards. Their safety should come second to preserving the rights of citizens. Being confused, angry, ignorant, stupid, mentally ill, acting out, resisting, etc. does not forfeit your rights. The only entity empowered to restrict a person's right is a court of law.
Freedom is not free. It requires sacrifice and tolerance. Preserving the freedom of speech means that we've got to allow everyone to voice their opinions, without regard for the content. Preserving the right to bear arms, means that we're going to live in a society where citizens have access to dangerous weapons and that there's no practical way to prevent accidents and tragedy from resulting from this access. It's a give and take. Preserving religious freedoms means allowing others to practice religions differing from your own.
We celebrate those who serve in law enforcement. We do so because working in law enforcement is dangerous. In a free society law enforcement officers accept these risks, not out of benefit to themselves, but for societies' benefit. Their commitment is not transitory, they can't choose when to put themselves at risk and when not to. Bless them for serving.
The last few decades has seen Law enforcement become increasingly militarized. Law enforcement is well trained, well equipped, and well compensated. I applaud their service and sacrifice, but I do so realizing that they've choose to put the job before themselves and now have a duty to do so.
I must have missed where officers are supposed to take one for the team before they can do their job. Really, this is your response?
If you put Taco Bell sauce in your ramen noodles it tastes just like poverty
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