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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
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[quote=davet]There has to be a legal way to bring in migrant workers for jobs that need to be done.
Wait and see what Hillary does, or jump on Trumps plan to have them leave, and then vetted for legal entry.
It's a better system than what we have, and at least we know who is coming into the country.
Nobody has a better plan than that at this point for legal workers in the economy, or better security at the boarder. Absolutely, and Cruz knows that work permits (not necessarily immigration status) have to happen. He's from Texas, you don't think he knows the needs of agriculture?[/quote And, he has a plan identical to Trumps. Hillary wants amnesty and open borders. True. Trump wants legal status for all illegals (and the next D prez will give them amnesty). Damned lie. His plan is posted, and it's identical to that of Cruz (minus Cruz having to change part of the Constitution). Read the plans posted, Rory. You're simply wrong.
America needs to understand that our troops are not 'disposable'. Each represents a family; Fathers, Mothers, Sons, Daughters, Cousins, Uncles, Aunts... Our Citizens are our most valuable treasure; we waste far too many.
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When this country is 20% Muslim all of those things you're worrying about won't even be on people's radar.
It's not 1965 anymore. I'm done arguing about it man. I'm sick and tired of the arguing. I'm sick and tired of the news. I'm sick and tired of the whole process. Everyone here has made up their mind. You have your "facts" in your mind and other people have their "facts" in their minds. Nothing is going to change that. I am not going to change my opinion on the man, whether any of you like it or not. I know what I feel and I know what I think, and I listen to myself and answer to no one else. I am done arguing. I have given you a viable strategy to get those of us in that state of mind to cast a vote that we abhor casting, while also justifying to ourselves that something good may come from it. Like I said, take it for what it's worth. The answer to all your problems is to quit posting here and go to the whining B!tches forums.NO ONE gives a chit about your likes or dislikes. 
Its all right to be white!!
Stupidity left unattended will run rampant
Don't argue with stupid people, They will drag you down to their level and then win by experience
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Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
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Damned lie. His plan is posted, and it's identical to that of Cruz (minus Cruz having to change part of the Constitution).
Read the plans posted, Rory. You're simply wrong. Quote the part of Trump's plan where he says he'll uphold CURRENT law and deport illegal aliens. I'll wait. Here's a couple links to browse. Newsweek: Who Knew? Trump Favors Amnesty for Undocumented Immigrants CNN: Trump's immigration plan: Deport the undocumented, 'legal status' for some http://americasvoice.org/press_rele...beauty-pageant-style-readmission-policy/In an interview with CNN’s Dana Bash yesterday, Trump outlined his approach:
“[D]eport all undocumented immigrants and then allow the ‘good ones’ to reenter the country through an ‘expedited process’ and live in the U.S. legally, though not as citizens.” Etc, etc, etc, etc.
“ The Savage 99 Pocket Reference”. All models and variations of 1895’s, 1899’s and 99’s covered. Also dates, checkering, engraving.. Find at www.savagelevers.com
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Joined: Mar 2011
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Campfire Regular
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What is worse about the Cruz plan is that it leaves open the solution to an amendment that will most likely be stalled in congress, and result in no action taking place.
He's worked it in to leave the door open for the dems to block any action. That is a political move, not an oversight.
Trumps plan is the cleaner more direct plan. We need the workers fast to prevent any harm to the economy. If they self deport, and can get right back in, that is better for the businesses who rely on them, and gets the workers legal status, and a legal job, and paying taxes. The vetting process is better for boarder security than just assuming "brown people" are latino's who will work for cash at day jobs.
There is a hell of a lot more up side than down side to this plan, or the status quo. We need the "good ones", and we need a way to keep out the bad ones. That is a legit concern. Keeping criminals with records of breaking the law/violent crime out of the US.
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Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Aug 2005
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What is worse about the Cruz plan is that it leaves open the solution to an amendment that will most likely be stalled in congress, and result in no action taking place.
He's worked it in to leave the door open for the dems to block any action. That is a political move, not an oversight.
Trumps plan is the cleaner more direct plan. We need the workers fast to prevent any harm to the economy. If they self deport, and can get right back in, that is better for the businesses who rely on them, and gets the workers legal status, and a legal job, and paying taxes. The vetting process is better for boarder security than just assuming "brown people" are latino's who will work for cash at day jobs.
There is a hell of a lot more up side than down side to this plan, or the status quo. We need the "good ones", and we need a way to keep out the bad ones. That is a legit concern. Keeping criminals will records out of the US. Cruz's plan to deport illegals as stated by existing current law doesn't seem to rely on any amendment.
“ The Savage 99 Pocket Reference”. All models and variations of 1895’s, 1899’s and 99’s covered. Also dates, checkering, engraving.. Find at www.savagelevers.com
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he'll appoint somebody thats great. the greatest actually. it will be great.
My diploma is a DD214
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
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Exactly the same as Cruz's plan, Rory. Exactly. Read the plans posted, they are identical. In fact, the ONE place I was wrong is that they both call for changing the Constitution to end birthright citizenship. They are IDENTICAL PLANS, Rory. NOWHERE in Cruz's plan does he say that he will have deportation as an absolute bar to re-entry, and neither does Trump. BOTH say that the laws MUST be enforced. BOTH say build a wall, triple border patrol agents, and BOTH allow for legal immigration, with caps for population growth and economic factors. The plans are IDENTICAL, Rory; read them. You won't, of course, but others will.
America needs to understand that our troops are not 'disposable'. Each represents a family; Fathers, Mothers, Sons, Daughters, Cousins, Uncles, Aunts... Our Citizens are our most valuable treasure; we waste far too many.
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Joined: Jul 2011
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
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BTW - Cruz backed amnesty when he worked as part of W's campaign staff and advisors, when he was part of HAPI, and when he introduced amendments to the Gang of Eight debacle (Cruz quoted here from speeches on the Senate Floor - http://www.factcheck.org/2015/12/did-cruz-support-legalization/) Hell, you can watch and listen to Cruz in his own statements in Congress on this issue - http://www.ibtimes.com/did-ted-cruz...publican-presidential-challenger-2306607If you want to start pulling up what the candidates have said on this issue, you're not going to like Cruz's changing positions on it. What remains is that the immigration plans of Cruz and Trump are identical. That's simply fact, Rory, no matter how much you want to deny it. Now, your second point you've already admitted was stupid. Your third is just as stupid, and we can hash that one over pretty quickly.
America needs to understand that our troops are not 'disposable'. Each represents a family; Fathers, Mothers, Sons, Daughters, Cousins, Uncles, Aunts... Our Citizens are our most valuable treasure; we waste far too many.
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Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
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NOWHERE in Cruz's plan does he say that he will have deportation as an absolute bar to re-entry, and neither does Trump. BOTH say that the laws MUST be enforced. BOTH say build a wall, triple border patrol agents, and BOTH allow for legal immigration, with caps for population growth and economic factors.
The plans are IDENTICAL, Rory; read them. So your only defense now is that Trump's ghostwritten plan doesn't state that he'll let all 10-30 million illegals back in immediately, although he's on record for saying over and over again that he will? And his plan doesn't say that he won't do that, in fact it doesn't mention deportations of anybody except gang members. Cruz has NEVER said he'll allow any illegal an expedited re-entry. And it says law enforcement will deport and return aliens under existing law. He's on record recently saying that ALL illegals will be promptly deported. Can deported aliens apply for a work permit or re-entry later? Probably, just as stated under current law. Trump is on record for saying over and over again that he will expedite the return of all "good" illegals. He's never said anything contradicting that. Game, set, match.
“ The Savage 99 Pocket Reference”. All models and variations of 1895’s, 1899’s and 99’s covered. Also dates, checkering, engraving.. Find at www.savagelevers.com
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Joined: Jul 2011
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
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NOWHERE in Cruz's plan does he say that he will have deportation as an absolute bar to re-entry, and neither does Trump. BOTH say that the laws MUST be enforced. BOTH say build a wall, triple border patrol agents, and BOTH allow for legal immigration, with caps for population growth and economic factors.
The plans are IDENTICAL, Rory; read them. So your only defense now is that Trump's ghostwritten plan doesn't state that he'll let all 10-30 million illegals back in immediately, although he's on record for saying over and over again that he will? And his plan doesn't say that he won't do that, in fact it doesn't mention deportations of anybody except gang members. It's identical to Cruz's plan, Rory. Cruz has NEVER said he'll allow any illegal an expedited re-entry. And it says law enforcement will deport and return aliens under existing law. He's on record recently saying that ALL illegals will be promptly deported. Can deported aliens apply for a work permit or re-entry later? Probably, just as stated under current law. He's also spoken in favor of legalization for illegals already here, Rory. The video evidence has been posted. As for the "illegal allowed expedited re-entry", he's never said he wouldn't either. If you're going to try to critique Trump's plan for NOT saying something, you have to apply the same to Cruz's, since they are identical. Trump is on record for saying over and over again that he will expedite the return of all "good" illegals. He's never said anything contradicting that.
Game, set, match. Cruz is on the record pushing for legalization of illegals already here, in testimony in front of Congress. As for "game, set, match", that comes when the plans of the two are IDENTICAL. Those are facts, Rory, and you can't change them no matter how much you need to in order to defend an indefensible position.
America needs to understand that our troops are not 'disposable'. Each represents a family; Fathers, Mothers, Sons, Daughters, Cousins, Uncles, Aunts... Our Citizens are our most valuable treasure; we waste far too many.
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Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
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BTW - Cruz backed amnesty when he worked as part of W's campaign staff and advisors, when he was part of HAPI, and when he introduced amendments to the Gang of Eight debacle (Cruz quoted here from speeches on the Senate Floor - http://www.factcheck.org/2015/12/did-cruz-support-legalization/) Hell, you can watch and listen to Cruz in his own statements in Congress on this issue - http://www.ibtimes.com/did-ted-cruz...publican-presidential-challenger-2306607If you want to start pulling up what the candidates have said on this issue, you're not going to like Cruz's changing positions on it. What remains is that the immigration plans of Cruz and Trump are identical. That's simply fact, Rory, no matter how much you want to deny it. From your OWN link: Back in 2013, Cruz offered an amendment to a Senate immigration bill that would have stripped out a proposal for a path to citizenship for those currently in the country illegally. But Cruz’s amendment would have purposefully left intact the bill’s provisions to provide legal status for them. Cruz at NO time introduced legislation to grant legal status, the worst he did was leave it in the bill IF his amendment had passed. And it's obvious to anybody why he did it - should be most obvious to a lawyer. By stripping out the amnesty and leaving the legal status, he was able to prove by the backers of the bill voting against the amendment that the bill WAS about amnesty and not just legalization. You're buying into talking points that you deeply want to believe rather than looking at it objectively. Watch the videos of each of the candidates talk. I posted them.
“ The Savage 99 Pocket Reference”. All models and variations of 1895’s, 1899’s and 99’s covered. Also dates, checkering, engraving.. Find at www.savagelevers.com
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Joined: Aug 2005
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Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
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He's also spoken in favor of legalization for illegals already here, Rory. The video evidence has been posted. As for the "illegal allowed expedited re-entry", he's never said he wouldn't either. If you're going to try to critique Trump's plan for NOT saying something, you have to apply the same to Cruz's, since they are identical. The video evidence shows him arguing for his amendment and what it would and would not do to the gang of eight bill. Listen again and I doubt you'll hear him say that we NEED TO OR WANT TO introduce legislation to legalize them, I didn't hear it. Talking about what a bill will do is different than saying you're in favor of it. He did criticize Rubio and the gang of eight bill from the moment it was introduced. That's incontrovertible. He introduced a poison pill amendment that proved the bill was about amnesty and new voters and not about legalization. That amendment in NO way granted legal status, at worst it simply didn't try to remove the proposed legal status that was in the gang of eight bill. For helping to stop the gang of eight bill, he's now labelled as introducing legalization laws - which is a lie. We're not going to convince one another. You are convinced Trump will deport all illegal aliens and simply continue a work permit and legal immigration status like we've had in place - even though Trump, Trump's son and Trump's campaign all says differently. Btw, even though we disagree it's been a nice break to talk actual positions with somebody who doesn't simply throw insults.
Last edited by Calhoun; 04/27/16.
“ The Savage 99 Pocket Reference”. All models and variations of 1895’s, 1899’s and 99’s covered. Also dates, checkering, engraving.. Find at www.savagelevers.com
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Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 16,610
Campfire Ranger
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OP
Campfire Ranger
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 16,610 |
The answer to all your problems is to quit posting here and go to the whining B!tches forums.NO ONE gives a chit about your likes or dislikes. I represent a voting block of people that's probably millions in numbers. If you don't care, so be it. Good luck with that.
"Hey jackass, get your government off my freedom."
MOLON LABE
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Joined: Oct 2007
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Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Oct 2007
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The answer to all your problems is to quit posting here and go to the whining B!tches forums.NO ONE gives a chit about your likes or dislikes. I represent a voting block of people that's probably millions in numbers. If you don't care, so be it. Good luck with that. Really??I can only count about 4 here on this forum.Its over man.Get a hold of yourself.You keep making yourself look more and more foolish.You have no freaking idea what Trump will do and what ever he does it will much better than what Hildab!tch will do or anything that the Halfrican has done. 
Its all right to be white!!
Stupidity left unattended will run rampant
Don't argue with stupid people, They will drag you down to their level and then win by experience
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Joined: Oct 2009
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Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
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I represent a voting block of people that's probably millions in numbers. Dumbsh!ts. But, I gotta give you credit for bein a leader.
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Joined: Nov 2008
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Campfire Ranger
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OP
Campfire Ranger
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 16,610 |
You guys have your opinion, I respect that. I just disagree. We'll see how it plays out. If Trump wins, I'll admit I was wrong. If he gets destroyed, will you?
"Hey jackass, get your government off my freedom."
MOLON LABE
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Joined: Oct 2002
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Campfire Oracle
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Campfire Oracle
Joined: Oct 2002
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You guys have your opinion, I respect that. I just disagree. We'll see how it plays out. If Trump wins, I'll admit I was wrong. If he gets destroyed, will you? I don't need to wait to admit that you're wrong. How old are you?
"Dear Lord, save me from Your followers"
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
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Why do you hate Trump so much?
Honest question I am curious Hell I hate Trump and I've been supporting him from the beginning. Just because I don't like a person doesn't mean I can't see what they bring to the table. For Trump, I see a person who can change the direction of the Republican party . In this case that means less emphasis on social issues, more emphasis on trade and illegal immigration and a foreign policy that pushes for fair cost share. It just so happens the messenger is a horse's azz That's about where I am at this point. Just change "hate" to "amused by".
“Life is life and fun is fun, but it's all so quiet when the goldfish die.”
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Joined: Dec 2007
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 25,143 Likes: 2 |
[quote=Bristoe]When this country is 20% Muslim all of those things you're worrying about won't even be on people's radar.
It's not 1965 anymore. Washington is a soggy California with better coffee. The coffee is over rated.
“Life is life and fun is fun, but it's all so quiet when the goldfish die.”
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Joined: Oct 2007
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Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
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You guys have your opinion, I respect that. I just disagree. We'll see how it plays out. If Trump wins, I'll admit I was wrong. If he gets destroyed, will you? You support who ever you support.I have no problem with that.I will support who ever is nominated.I have held my nose and gagged the last 4 Presidential Elections because of WHO THE PARTY nominates.Not us THE PEOPLE.Finally folks are pissed enough to elect an outsider and I believe he will do just fine.If I am wrong,I will admit it.Huntz
Its all right to be white!!
Stupidity left unattended will run rampant
Don't argue with stupid people, They will drag you down to their level and then win by experience
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