Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Hunter's Campfire What cartridges is Poncho Villa carrying?

For damn sure somebody just got their ass blacked.

Thanks to everybody for the history/book references on Pancho Villa. This place is a living repository of esoteric/arcane knowledge of men and arms.

Is it true that Villa was killed by the Frito Bandito in a turf war?

well, as far as tom mix being in hollywood all those years, not so much. mix had a ranch on the today outskirts of prescott, a now housing development called yavapai estates. Their clubhouse is his old barn. He did a lot of filming in williamson valley near prescott. The old ranch has a little creek on it, perfect place to park when you are a teenager with a young lady. I saw God more than once there. He was a real cowboy tho. The road down from florence to oracle/tucson is the "tom mix" highway. Has a big sign where he augered in than gets stolen, i don't know if they put another one up. i always could kind of understand how he kilt himself on that road. large part of it is pretty straight and you can just zoom on it. Prior to the freeway being built we use to run it on our alcohol trips to mexico as teenagers.
There is an old hotel in douglas/aqua prieta, i think maybe called the gadsten. Been there since territorial days with a really good bar. Marble steps leading up to the second floor with a part of the steps being roped off, being chipped. As the story goes when villa took aqua prieta he got drunk in the bar and tried to ride his horse up those steps to the second floor. Maybe so, maybe not.
as greg knows, lot of years passed since those days, but in some ways it ain't changed much, particularly after dark. I was down in that area some years ago chasing san hill crane at about 4am in the morning. Left my damn hand gun in the truck. Never do that again. It was innocent, but i had a guy come up out of the black wanting to know what i was doing there, scared the tiddliwinks out of me that close to the border.

In very small, limited roles. And the M1 Carbine would have been a MUCH better choice. BTW, there were some US intelligence assets that used the M94 as well. That doesn't make it a military rifle.

It was fine for special purposes, but you can't expect to take a M94 SRC and drag it through 2-3 years of front line service, and have it hold up.

Hope ya'll are paying attention,....

THANK YOU for your wisdom and council, oh wisest of the wise !

GTC

Okay then, make your case. Tell me how the M94 is a military rifle.

Just an example of how the progressive element has stolen a word from the King's English.

Do tell which other WWII military rifles use very thin two piece stocks. Dovetialed in rear sights with no protection. Thin, unprotected front sights. ½ exposed thin tubular magazines (or any tubular magazines for that matter). An exposed hammer. These all sound like highly desirable features for a battle rifle.

Yo, Kevin,relax....

A.) WTF did ANY of us say it was a "Military Rifle" ?

Thanks for the inspired lecture, regardless.

...and Semper Geeking,

GTC

UHhhhhh,....we're fighting WW2 now ?

Man, this is just some oddball, completely off the wall segue in progress here.

GTC

It seems to me that in 1894 the Model '94 was pretty much state-of-the-art. And a leap ahead of what a lot of the world was still carrying.

Absolutely, PARTICULARLY when you factor in the fact that the men handling them had cut their teeth on bows and arrows, shepherd's slings, and worn out muzzle loading rubble that had ridden with Santa Ana.

GTC

So my actual point seems to have been lost thanks to crossfire-azzhat.

I never said the M94 wasn't desirable for certain jobs. What I said was it wasn't built to be a front line military rifle, and it certainly wasn't.

The mention of M94's being used in WWII is what prompted me to compare it to other WWII weapons...but you could make the same comparison to WWI or previous weapons. The design of the M94 is ideal as a sporting weapon, or general utility rifle. But those features are NOT appropriate for something that's going to serve in battlefield after battlefield, and drug around by poorly trained, often conscripted troops days on end, for years of battle. The M94 is just not going to hold up to that, because of the features I mentioned previously.

So it's NOT what any military would consider a military rifle. That doesn't mean that what it has to offer isn't desirable in certain military settings.

And the reason I mentioned that, was because someone brought up the condition of many of the M94's used in those campaigns, and the poor quality of the repairs. So I'm not sure how my comments were so inappropriate.

You can sure sling it,....even to the point of calling a little friendly and very LIGHT jibes "Azzhat"

....while in the same hour , posting in almost disgustingly apelike vein.....



You're pretty damn clueless on more than a few levels.

Us poor uninformed masses, honored by YOUR "earth shattering news"
remain humbled and honored to be blessed with your cutting edge, and never one meniscus off center bubble rantings, Gibson Girl.

Back to the REAL issue,...who's the goddam fool that didn't issue M1 Carbines to VILLA ?

GTC

The original topic of this thread was pretty interesting ,
To me at least .

Gonna get those pics this weekend I think

I'd very much like to see em', and share some pics of the repairs to the arms involved,....ranging from the Stone Age primitive, into some REAL artisan grade work.

Apologies for getting a little impatient at being unceasingly lectured about the virtues of the M1 carbine
....versus everything starting with David's sling forward.

Hint: We KNOW , Kevin,....as L Welk said, wunnerful, wunnerful,wunnerful,wunnerful,wunnerful,wunnerful,wunnerful,wunnerful,wunnerful,

Suggesting that turn bolt Springfield '03s or ' 06s were common Mexican arms during that period, or that ammo for them was AVAILABLE is just more of the stupid stuff that somebody READ somewhere, and believed. Believe me, it was NOT the actual case.

Didactically lecturing a small group of seasoned Border Arms cats that have probably repaired more tang busted '73s, '76s, '86s, '92s, and '94s,(and done that well) about the "technical design problems" of the arm is the behavior of a REAL "azzhat".

Que' Viva, la carabinas !

GTC

Ya, to me too. Blown away by the breath of knowledge around these boards.

I've read stories of lots of old treinta y trientas down in Mexico in distant decades past, so much so that ammo for the same was practically currency. Weren't they a standard up in the Alaskan bush too?

I'm wondering now what usually failed on em, seems like the design weren't all that tight mechanically to begin with.

Birdwatcher

Zero in on "Tang Busted", Mike. Wrist of the stocks,...upper tangs, lower trigger / lever plates

....pretty much covers the more common historical wrecks, encountered.
Horses rolling on rifles left in scabbards, one of the MAIN avenues of approach. Savvy cats tied, hobbled, or ground reined their horses AFTER pulling their rifles off,....out of the scabbard. Anybody with one lick of common sense will do the same, today.

...once the Mauser armed Federales started grabbing ANYTHING that they seized and publicly smashing it on a hitching post, anvil,...whatever was handy in front of locals , while the body of the fellow it had been taken off of was still cooling, ...all bets are of as to just how many of these failures / damages actually occurred in "the field".

I'm still losing sleep over what would have transpired had old Kalashnikov gotten involved.

Any IDIOT, well enough connected to even DREAM acquiring, or running .30 caliber ".gov" ammo into Mexico was not going to get any sorta' "Trial"

.45-70 was scarce as hen's teeth too,....and it's distribution weighted with the same no nonsense penalties.

GTC

seems like i remember the 94 being used pretty commonly further south too, like in argentina.