|
Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 14,488
Campfire Outfitter
|
Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 14,488 |
I'm liking 55.5 grains of Re16 under 180 Partitions. Three shots go under 3/4-inch if I do my part. Velocity is about 2750 fps out a 24-inch barrel at 60 degrees F.
Don't be the darkness.
America will perish while those who should be standing guard are satisfying their lusts.
|
|
|
|
Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 37,209 Likes: 9
Campfire 'Bwana
|
Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 37,209 Likes: 9 |
I've reached a conclusion on Re17. Even though its velocity potential can be astounding (for instance, a 180-grain Partition at 2900 fps out of a .30-06!), it just plain sucks due to temperature sensitivity.
Here's a good discussion on temp sensitivity and RL-17. http://www.24hourcampfire.com/ubbthreads/ubbthreads.php/ubb/showflat/Number/11164502DF
|
|
|
|
Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 14,488
Campfire Outfitter
|
Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 14,488 |
Interesting thread that seems to go in several different directions. All I know is what I've experienced myself with Re17, and that I've got six or seven pounds of it sitting here on my shelf but NO desire or inspiration to fiddle with it. Chronographing is central to my handloading activity, and it's entirely possible that mine has misled me due to one or more of any number of reasons, but somehow that never seems to happen when I am using other powders. Re17 is the ONE powder that just flat scares me. It has been said that a powder may show excellent temperature tolerance in one cartridge and pronounced temperature sensitivity in another. I'd go so far as to say that MAYBE a powder could look temperature tolerant with one bullet weight in a given cartridge, but misbehave with another bullet weight in the same cartridge. So many questions, and so little time...and money, components, equipment, expertise, yada yada yada. I like Re16 and have no reservations about it. I'll chronograph the load again when summer comes and I can test at 100 degrees F. I intend to see what the Hunter and .30-06 combination is all about next since I have an 8-pounder sitting there unopened.
Don't be the darkness.
America will perish while those who should be standing guard are satisfying their lusts.
|
|
|
|
Joined: Feb 2013
Posts: 2,538
Campfire Regular
|
Campfire Regular
Joined: Feb 2013
Posts: 2,538 |
Interesting thread that seems to go in several different directions. All I know is what I've experienced myself with Re17, and that I've got six or seven pounds of it sitting here on my shelf but NO desire or inspiration to fiddle with it. Chronographing is central to my handloading activity, and it's entirely possible that mine has misled me due to one or more of any number of reasons, but somehow that never seems to happen when I am using other powders. Re17 is the ONE powder that just flat scares me. It has been said that a powder may show excellent temperature tolerance in one cartridge and pronounced temperature sensitivity in another. I'd go so far as to say that MAYBE a powder could look temperature tolerant with one bullet weight in a given cartridge, but misbehave with another bullet weight in the same cartridge. So many questions, and so little time...and money, components, equipment, expertise, yada yada yada. I like Re16 and have no reservations about it. I'll chronograph the load again when summer comes and I can test at 100 degrees F. I intend to see what the Hunter and .30-06 combination is all about next since I have an 8-pounder sitting there unopened. If that Reloder 17 scares you , box it up and send it to me. I hammers out of my .260 and .243. Even works decent in 7x57. Antelope season here is early October and weather is always 45-75 degrees so temperature issues are no problems. It even works good in my .300 win mag with 130 ttsx's.
|
|
|
|
Joined: Feb 2013
Posts: 2,538
Campfire Regular
|
Campfire Regular
Joined: Feb 2013
Posts: 2,538 |
One thing i have noted though with Reloder 17 is that it hides pressure signs. Until you are WAY past high pressure. But if you use current published data in calibers it likes it is still pretty dang good. Creedmores, .260s and medium 6 mms ( 6XC,6 Creedmore , 6x47L)really like it. Just my humble opinion............
|
|
|
|
Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 37,209 Likes: 9
Campfire 'Bwana
|
Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 37,209 Likes: 9 |
One thing i have noted though with Reloder 17 is that it hides pressure signs. Until you are WAY past high pressure. But if you use current published data in calibers it likes it is still pretty dang good. Creedmores, .260s and medium 6 mms ( 6XC,6 Creedmore , 6x47L)really like it. Just my humble opinion............ Yep, that smooth pressure curve can be a double edged sword. Great performance without pressure signs. Is it a stealth powder that could be off the charts when pressure signs do show up? Some discussion, no real consensus on temp sensitivity, different answers/different applications. All said, I like RL-17. Ya just gotta understand it. DF
|
|
|
|
Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 14,488
Campfire Outfitter
|
Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 14,488 |
I'd swap it in a heartbeat but for the shipping problem.
Different strokes.
Don't be the darkness.
America will perish while those who should be standing guard are satisfying their lusts.
|
|
|
|
Joined: Mar 2017
Posts: 232
Campfire Member
|
Campfire Member
Joined: Mar 2017
Posts: 232 |
Impressive groups. Looks like you've got the right recipe.👍
My Ruger #1A is particularly fond of 165 Hornady SP's (flat base), seated .03" short of the lands, with 58 gr. of H4350 stuffed into Rem. brass & sparked by Fed. 210 match primers. Velocity from the 22" barrel averages 2838 fps. and (3-shot) groups average about 1" at 100 m. (sometimes a bit more - sometimes a bit less - depending on my 70 yr. old diabetic eyes). I've used this rifle/load combo for years and have killed a few truck loads of white tails and muleys with it.
What man, on his death bed, ever lamented, "God, I wish I had spent more time at the office."
|
|
|
|
Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 557
Campfire Regular
|
Campfire Regular
Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 557 |
Worked up a load for my Kimber Montana, 55 grains of Varget with 125 gr Nosler Accubond, 3050 fps Indiana first deer season with larger caliber rifles this combo worked great.
Blessed To be an American
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 5,173
Campfire Tracker
|
Campfire Tracker
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 5,173 |
At 300 yards today, about 53 degrees F. Prone, over the pack: 53 grains of H4350, R-P brass, CCI large rifle primers. Three shots on the 300 yard gong, spread of about 2.5" and the 200 gr Partitions were averaging 2612 fps. That first round hit, the gong rang, and I got a big ol' grin on my face. I wish I'd explored 200 gr bullets for the .30-06 long ago. My rifle & ammo did well last season with 165 grain Ballistic Tips at 2900 fps, but I think this load would have been even better, particularly on the bear and elk. JB/Mule Deer mentioned that this bullet penetrated well and worked great on a wide variety of big game, but I never anticipated such accuracy! Regards, Guy
|
|
|
|
Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 48,200 Likes: 23
Campfire 'Bwana
|
Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Aug 2010
Posts: 48,200 Likes: 23 |
At 300 yards today, about 53 degrees F. Prone, over the pack: 53 grains of H4350, R-P brass, CCI large rifle primers. Three shots on the 300 yard gong, spread of about 2.5" and the 200 gr Partitions were averaging 2612 fps. That first round hit, the gong rang, and I got a big ol' grin on my face. I wish I'd explored 200 gr bullets for the .30-06 long ago. My rifle & ammo did well last season with 165 grain Ballistic Tips at 2900 fps, but I think this load would have been even better, particularly on the bear and elk. JB/Mule Deer mentioned that this bullet penetrated well and worked great on a wide variety of big game, but I never anticipated such accuracy! Regards, Guy Great shooting Guy and beautiful rifle there. I too have been playing around with the 200gr. partition. I was low on H4350 since it hasn't been around here in a few years, so I went back to my go to powder (IMR4350). Here's how my old 1917 does with that excellent 200gr partition, sans the buck and bull I also shot with this set-up: My pre 64 model 70 fwt also loves this load...
I try to stick with the basics, they do so well. Nothing fancy mind you, just plain jane will get it done with style. You want to see an animal drop right now? Shoot him in the ear hole. BSA MAGA
|
|
|
|
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 9,212 Likes: 3
Campfire Outfitter
|
Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 9,212 Likes: 3 |
I've not run it yet, but plan to soon and someone was asking about the 26/210 lrab Cartridge : .30-06 Spring. (SAAMI)
Bullet : .308, 210, Nosler AccuBond 58317
Cartridge O.A.L. L6: 3.340 inch or 84.84 mm
Barrel Length : 24.0 inch or 609.6 mm
Powder : Alliant Reloder-26
Predicted data by increasing and decreasing the given charge,
incremented in steps of 2.0% of nominal charge.
CAUTION: Figures exceed maximum and minimum recommended loads !
Step Fill. Charge Vel. Energy Pmax Pmuz Prop.Burnt B_Time
% % Grains fps ft.lbs psi psi % ms
-20.0 87 48.00 2132 2120 28624 8401 93.0 1.692
-18.0 89 49.20 2193 2243 30771 8666 94.5 1.644
-16.0 91 50.40 2254 2369 33099 8913 95.7 1.596
-14.0 93 51.60 2315 2500 35629 9138 96.9 1.550
-12.0 96 52.80 2377 2634 38373 9340 97.8 1.500
-10.0 98 54.00 2438 2772 41381 9518 98.6 1.447
-08.0 100 55.20 2499 2913 44658 9668 99.2 1.397
-06.0 102 56.40 2561 3057 48242 9790 99.7 1.348
-04.0 104 57.60 2621 3204 52168 9882 99.9 1.301 ! Near Maximum !
-02.0 107 58.80 2682 3354 56486 9943 100.0 1.256 ! Near Maximum !
+00.0 109 60.00 2742 3505 61238 9986 100.0 1.212 !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!
+02.0 111 61.20 2801 3659 66488 10024 100.0 1.170 !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!
+04.0 113 62.40 2861 3816 72299 10057 100.0 1.129 !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!
+06.0 115 63.60 2920 3975 78761 10084 100.0 1.090 !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!
+08.0 117 64.80 2979 4138 85970 10104 100.0 1.051 !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!
+10.0 120 66.00 3038 4304 94041 10117 100.0 1.015 !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!
Results caused by ± 10% powder lot-to-lot burning rate variation using nominal charge
Data for burning rate increased by 10% relative to nominal value:
+Ba 109 60.00 2866 3831 78106 9459 100.0 1.110 !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!
Data for burning rate decreased by 10% relative to nominal value:
-Ba 109 60.00 2546 3023 47811 10294 97.0 1.349
I would not buy something that runs on any kind of primer given the possibility of primer shortages and even regulations. In fact, why not buy a flintlock? Really. Rocks aren't going away anytime soon.
|
|
|
|
Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 1,554
Campfire Regular
|
Campfire Regular
Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 1,554 |
My favorite 30-06 loads are: 1) 150 grain bullets - 52 grains of IMR 4064 2) 165-168 grain bullets - 57 grains of IMR 4350 3) 180 grain bullets - 58 grains of Hunter.
The first two loads have been quoted by several gun writers - Ken Waters, John Barsness to name two. The last comes from Barsness, and I tried it - it's a good one. It shot great in my Tikka M695 with 1 in 11" twist. I loaded the second one for two friends who don't handload. They were happy with the results. I loaded Barnes 168 grain TSXs for them.
NRA Endowment Life Member, G.O.A supporter
|
|
|
|
Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 2,339
Campfire Regular
|
Campfire Regular
Joined: Dec 2004
Posts: 2,339 |
A 165gr Nosler Accubond pushed by 58gr H4350 for a muzzle velocity of 2860 fps was always my "go to" in my custom barreled 30.06(25" Pac Nor). Accuracy has always been stellar with this load producing consistent 3/4"( or better) 3-shot groups at 100 yds.
But, difficulty finding H4350 has caused me to start experimenting with Alliant's newer RL-16. Boy am I glad I did. This past weekend I found that 57gr of RL-16 will put 3 165gr Accubonds into 0.6" at 100 yds at 2915 fps over my chronograph. 57.4gr(Alliant's Max) produced 2942 fps! First 2 shots went into 1 ragged hole! I pulled the 3rd shot an inch to the right, so I'll need to confirm accuracy again on that one. I'll add that the ES and SD on these two RL-16 recipes were in the single digits! Temp was 81 degrees while shooting.
Temperature stability and de-coppering agent to boot with RL-16!
Looks like I may not need H4350 in the future!😁
Leftybolt
Last edited by leftybolt; 04/17/17.
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2008
Posts: 1,036
Campfire Regular
|
Campfire Regular
Joined: Sep 2008
Posts: 1,036 |
Anyone got information on RL19 and 165 Nos Accubonds. Looking for information in the 57 to 59 gr range. MV and pressure mostly. Thanks Daniel
|
|
|
|
Joined: May 2017
Posts: 231
Campfire Member
|
Campfire Member
Joined: May 2017
Posts: 231 |
180gr accubonds and a 23" M700. Would like the best velocity I can manage
I have a ton of H5350, a lot of RL17, some RL19 and some RL22.
Nosler data doesn't seem to have a clear winner. Not sure I want to compress as much as the RL22 load.
Any real life experience?
|
|
|
|
Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 123
Campfire Member
|
Campfire Member
Joined: Mar 2010
Posts: 123 |
I finally chronographed my hunting load this morning, I'm getting a lot more velocity than I was expecting from my Tikka's 22 inch barrel! I might start backing down to see if the ES&SD readings improve - or maybe not, accuracy is very good! Easy extraction and rounded primers!
Handload
Bullet: Speer 165 gr. BTSP Powder: XMR-4350 58.0 grs. Primer: Wolf Large Rifle Case: Norma LOAL: 3.300 (2.691 base to ogive with Stoney Point gage) Velocity: 2870.93 fps Extreme Spread: 40.80 Standard Deviation: 17.02
Factory Load
Bullet: Federal 165 gr. Ballistic Tip (Factory Load) LOAL: 3.268 (2.647 base to ogive with Stoney Point) Velocity: 2812.50 fps Extreme Spread: 16.32 Standard Deviation: 6.92
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2008
Posts: 1,036
Campfire Regular
|
Campfire Regular
Joined: Sep 2008
Posts: 1,036 |
Found a great load for accuracy (1/2 inch) but cannot find any information as to MV! 165 Accubond and 56.5 of RL19 in a 22 inch barrel. Plan on it being my elk load this fall unless I get bad news from responses. Would be great if it's 2650 or so, 2750 would be even better. I have looked everywhere and even called Alliant Powder, but they couldn't help. Ironic for a powder that is marketed as a number one 30-06 powder.
|
|
|
|
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 44,887 Likes: 11
Campfire 'Bwana
|
Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 44,887 Likes: 11 |
A chrono will give you the info you seek.
|
|
|
|
Joined: Sep 2008
Posts: 1,036
Campfire Regular
|
Campfire Regular
Joined: Sep 2008
Posts: 1,036 |
A chrono will give you the info you seek. Mathman, I guess your response indicates you don't have a clue. LOL
|
|
|
|
675 members (10gaugemag, 007FJ, 01Foreman400, 117LBS, 10Glocks, 67 invisible),
2,899
guests, and
1,288
robots. |
Key:
Admin,
Global Mod,
Mod
|
|
Forums81
Topics1,193,641
Posts18,512,265
Members74,010
|
Most Online11,491 Jul 7th, 2023
|
|
|
|