Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Alaska Brown Bear question

For the past week, I�ve been in a class for work. One of my classmates is an Alaskan that has entertained the class with different stories about his Alaskan experiences. I�ve enjoyed his stories but today, while talking about brown bear encounters, he claimed that a .375 H&H bullet would glance off a brown bear�s skull if shot head on while charging. I laughed, and questioned this only to be called undeducated. I admitted that I have never had the opportunity or will have the opportunity to try it, but felt like a Barnes-X/TSX of any flavor would crack a bear between the blinkers and dig deep into his melon.

Any of you Alaskans ever squeezed off an X-bullet targeting a brown bears forehead? If so, did the bullet glance off or crack his melon.

You did well laughing... Bears are built with modest bone structure neither as dense nor as thick as ordinary ungulates. I posted a picture here a couple years ago of sunlight streaming through a brown bear scapula clearly showing a knife outline on the side opposite...

No rifle bullets bouncing off bear skulls... I have difficulty believing the handgun bullet stories as well...
art

I wouldn't be worried about putting one of my .375 270 TSX's in a bears mellon. Anything I've ever hit with mine has been hurt BAD!!!

Some 40 odd years ago, I was hunting with a then quite new 338 with one of the few ammos available....I think it was 200 or 225 Power Points....anyway, on returning to a moose kill I got within 150 yards and a medium grizzly stood up and looked over the willows....I shot at the head [only target] and tipped the bear over in the willows.....upon approaching closer, the bear came out of the willows toward me and it took several more body shots to dispatch the animal....the shot had hit just under the eye [face on] but had not penetrated the skull as it deflected off to the side......if you examine a bear skull you will note that unlike humans, the skull is behind the eye....
Since then I have seen bears shot in the head with complete penetration.....but there are so many variables with angles etc that I don't feel there is any definitive answer other than "maybe" or "perhaps possible"

Sure once they drown to death! <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

We're talking .375 H&H...that was 30-378 handy work, please stick to the topic at hand...

Story?

As I understand it, Matt borrowed KenaiSlayer's rifle.....and after 13 rounds downrange, managed to finish off a nice blackie. All shots were hits....

The bear ended up drowning in a lake....Matt said the gun sucked, KenaiSlayer said Matt can't shoot....

Sounds reasonable.

I once shot all 10 rounds I had with me (180 grain .30-06) at a cow caribou. Hit her 5 times, 3 of them good. It was 20 below, and I was shooting straight into a 30 knot wind at 100 yards.

That wind chill raises hell with ballistics!

I got one more caribou than the other 3 guys I was with.

That video and the "You don't belong here, get the [bleep] outta here" still make me giggle.........

Art, Ya gotta stop telling that story! That bear just had osteoporosis!

But man did it have snaggle teeth! Osteoporosis is a distinct possibility...

Bouncing bullets!?

I'd take that classmate with a grain of salt, but "bouncing bullets" do happen once in a while.

I bought my first Labrador from one of the sailors (aircrewmen) in my dad's airunit in Florida - some 33-34 years ago. Fellow's dad lived in Alaska, and Dennis (the sailor) personally saw a .30/06 bullet hit a bear in the head above [between] the eyes, and drop to the ground. Left a skin wound and piode the bear after dazing it a little, and was dispatched with more shots from a more powerful gun. Dennis' dad wasn't a logger, but worked in camp similar to a logging or work camp. Dennis also claimed he saw the metal hinges of the door the bears ripped off the cool room (like on a tractor-trailer 'trailer') to get the meat inside.

I've never even killed a black bear and certainly not a Grizz, Brownie or Polar variety either, but I'd think twice about calling the classmate a liar. I would have asked him if what he claimed was a freak thing, which I think it might have been. I'd have also asked how often such events occur.

I also once heard about a large and very muscular 'brother' who came at a highway patrolman with a knife after being pulled over. At less than 20feet the HP shot the perp after telling him to stop. The 110grn .357Mag bullet hit the perp in the deltoid (chest) muscle, but bounced/traveled under the skin and exited through the top of the shoulder. The hospital put [basically] a bandaid on the perp before sending him to jail!

I also once heard about an off-duty cop who shot a perp with a North American Arms .22 mini-revolver. Hit the bad guy in the back of the head, traveled under the skin and exited above the forehead. He probably "stopped from fright" too.

One yet another ocassion, I knew a fellow who killed a deer with a .22-250 that didn't die straight away - after being shoot in the head. An autopsy showed the bullet getting inside the skull, but traveling along the top (inside) of the skull missing the brain all together! Hemoraging eventually killed the whitetail buck, but he found it only after the meat had spoiled.

If I could've been there when the Brownie bounced the bullet off his hard head, I bet he was a 'fluke bear,' but the story has made me think several times about what I'd want to repel bears on the Alaskan coast or other locales.

StubbleDuck
"One yet another ocassion, I knew a fellow who killed a deer with a .22-250 that didn't die straight away - after being shoot in the head. An autopsy showed the bullet getting inside the skull, but traveling along the top (inside) of the skull missing the brain all together!"

While I have no doubt it seemed like that happened, it is impossible to put a bullet inside the cranium and miss the brain. The brain fills the entire space.
art

I've known exceptions to the rule.

I don't doubt that a boolit "could" skip off a bone at the right angle. Just low probability.

And a little obsteporous as well..

I have personally witnessed several folks who were shot in the head with various low energy handgun rounds where the bullet somehow struck the skull and then traversed it under the skin and then exiting. Two particular incidents that I recall involved a 22 LR and a 38 with lead round nose bullets. I have seen a WHOLE bunch more where the bulllet didn't go around but made a path directly through- the shortest distance-

No doubt, if a bear had his head back and the angle the bullet struck the skull at was shallow enough- it could conceivably happen- don't bank on it though.

Okay, I wasn't clear enough. On the deer that the .22-250 didn't bang-flop kill when hit in the cranium, what was explained to me is that the bullet traveled along the inside of the skull [bone] but not "through" the brain. In other words, the bullet traveled between the skull and the brain. Hemoraging from that wound killed the buck, just not instantly.

I have no idea how this happend, but the fellow claimed he "autopsied" the buck - maybe cutting of the horns? I don't recall that detail. I also once heard about the spinner on a B17 or other WWII aircraft propeller that had a neat even hole shot through it without hitting the gears inside that controlled pitch, etc. Only explaination is alledgedly the bullet hit at the right time at the right angle to enable it to travel "around" or through whatever gap that the bullet didn't cause damage. A genuine fluke? You bet! Would it likely happen again? I bet not in our lifetimes.

I believe "its possible" this is what happened to the deer I mentioned (a "fluke" occurred). Would I ever expect to witness such an event myself? Or ever hear of it happening again? NO! I also recall the deer was running away from him when he shot at it, which no doubt could have been a factor too.

This thread started about Brownie or Kodiak bears. I believe some bears (because of species, maturity and size) have tougher heads than others, and that ocassionally a fluke of nature or physics might occur when shooting one of them, too.

Jim Carmichael once wrote about an African Croc he shot with his trustie .338WM he's taken to Africa several times. Used the Nosler 250grn Partition in his standard load. After the croc was "dead in the boat" with a hole in its head, it came back to life! I only remember that the story was written and published, as I didn't finish reading it. Apparently the exciting outcome was in Carmichael's favor as he's still alive. Go figure.

OK - I wasn't going to admit this, but I missed my shot on the bull moose this year. I was planning on getting him in the spine, just behind the head, but I think he was ducking his head to run just as I shot. That's my story and I'm sticking to it. He was at 70 yards, I was shooting offhand, but he was in the initial stages of getting the heck out of Dodge after spotting me.

The 250 gr. Hornady RN from my .338 took him just under the left antler base, and exited the top right side of his cranium. Bang- flop, of course. When I skinned out his head prior to removing his antlers, a 4" square (more or less) chunk of his top skull came off with the hide. I reached in and scooped out his brain with my fingers. It was totally detached, just laying loose, but untouched by the bullet. From the angles of the entry/exit holes, the shock wave must have compressed the edge of thbrain out of the way of the bullet. I don't see how this is possible, but that's the only thing I can figure.

On the other hand, I once helped patch up a dog that had taken a .30-06 round through the chest cavity. After the vet reattached a ligament to her shoulder bone, trimmed up and disinfected the entry/exit wounds, she was finer than frog hair after a few weeks. I would not have believed it if I hadn't personally seen it.

Flukes happen, but shouldn't be considered to be the norm.