Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Ask The Gunwriters I poured the 6.5 Creedmoor koolaid but...

Thanks, JB.

I’ve even heard that the custom makers and at least one manufacturer are selling more rifles chambered for the 6.5 Creedmoor than they are for all other hunting cartridges combined.

That’s no gun writer fad.

"Oh, and one of my contacts at Hornady recently told me the "shortage" of H4350 these days is primarily due to demand from 6.5 Creedmoor shooters.)"

Finally, a valid reason to hate the Creedmoor!

driftless,

Well, the 6.5 Creedmoor isn't a more accurate cartridge than, say, the 6.5x457 Lapua--but in my experience (and that of many other people) it is indeed more "inherently accurate" than similar cartridges with longer powder columns and more sloping shoulders. The main reason the Creedmoor has a 30-degree shoulder is that all the evidence from several decades is that 30 degrees results in more consistent powder burn than any angle much blow OR above 30--which is why the PPC rounds have 30-degree shoulders, as well as just about any other modern "accuracy" cartridge.

Tom,

My first 6.5 Creedmoor was Ruger Hawkeye with a 26-inch barrel. With the maximum published charge of Ramshot Hunter and the 120-grain Ballistic Tip it got right around 3100 fps, with excellent accuracy. That's a great Creedmoor load for those who prefer more muzzle velocity with "conventional" bullets over moderate muzzle velocity with high-BC bullets.

I'm getting 2600 with 143gr ELD-X Hornady factory loads. I only picked up about 20-30 fps with a near max load of H4350. I tried a near max load of Ramshot Hunter and am now getting 2700 fps with very good accuracy. I don't even shoot them at 100, but I'm getting 1"-1.5" 200 yard groups with either load.

Recoil is a lot closer to 243 than 308.

Some time back in another thread about the 6.5 Creedmoor someone pointed out that if Walmart didn't carry the ammo it wasn't a common round. I've seen 3 different loads in at least 4 different Walmarts lately. 125 gr Winchester Power Points for under $19 and Federal 140 gr Fusions for $25 and Federal Match ammo with 130 gr Bergers for $28. I'd say it is a common, mainstream cartridge now.

Oh, yeah, it is.

Other good powders for bullets in the 140-grain class are IMR4451 and RL-16. With both, published loads get around 2750 from the 22" barrel of my Ruger American Predator with 143 ELD-X's. Both are very accurate but in this rifle the 4451 load shoots a little better.

Must have been the rifle I shot it in. It beat me up and I couldnt tell much if any difference in 270 or 6.5 cm.

Mule Deer, Thanks I have heard of " inherently accurate" before with the 308 win. and 222 rem. What tells us 30 degree shoulder angle and shorter powder columns burn more consistent. Will it show on the crony or paper ?

John, I'm sittin here in my easy chair looking at 3 empty cases and playing w/seating depths w/139-140gr bullets. I just can't for the life of me see how a man could get 2750fps w/140gr bullet w/that small case. I know it's being done but it baffles me after almost 40 years of reloading. powdr

I know what you mean. It doesn't look like it should be possible. I'm using the even smaller 6.5x47L case and am shooting 129gr bullets at 2,900 with a 22.5" barrel. It's a lot of pop for not much powder.

driftless,

Just several decades of experimentation with various cartridges by a lot of experimenters.

The consistency probably won't show up on most handloaders' chronographs, because their velocities are typically an approximation, though it might with a Magnetospeed. The pressure consistency of 30-degree shoulders has shown up in major pressure labs, and is partly why the 22 and 6mm PPC replaced the .222 as the primary short-range benchrest round.

Mule Deer, Thanks again for taking the time, can't beat years of experimentation.

Something I just learned recently, is that small case is about half the reason it can do it. Conventional wisdom has always been that a larger bore will drive the same weight bullet faster, but I was perplexed that it takes a .30-06 10 grains more powder to push a 150 gr bullet as fast as a 7mm-08.

A case full of R#26, fed 215, hornady brass, your favorite 140-143g bullet is FAST. Remember that it is all about the bullet and BC for mid range and longer range shooting. You are just going to have to try R#26 with a fed 215, and you will be amazed at the speed with accuracy. With the 143 eld, We were shooting bug holes at 2850 out of a 24" Brux barrel, at 2900+(I will not say how much) the groups opened to 1", no problems with primer pockets or high pressure issues. We used a 7" drop tube, crunched powder.

A 260 Rem and 260 AI with R#26 is going to be over 3000 fps, will need a wyatts mag box on a Rem 700 Short action for the 143 eldx.

So, we went to the 6.5x47 Lapua made from 22/250 Lapua cases for the larger primer, speed was unreal, bug hole accuracy. Seems as though R#26 likes a hot primer. We did not try a cci 450 or a tula small rifle mag primer in the lapua brass, the neighbor had the need for large rifle primers in the 6.5x47 that day. Small rifle primers will be tried after deer season. Extreme spreads went way down with the 215's in the Creed with 26...file that in the what ever department...your experience may vary.

Remember to get the carbon out of the neck if you try 22/250 brass or the carbon ring maybe trying to crimp your bullet causing a pressure spike.

RL16 works well with the Creedmoor as well. 2750-2770 with a 140 Partition is doable out of my 24" barrel. And it shoots the same velocity at 12deg, that it does at 70deg.

Gatogrizzly,

One thing many shooters don't realize is that any increase/decrease in powder capacity, in cartridges of the same caliber, result in only 1/4 as much difference in potential velocity, with the same bullets loaded to the same pressure. The cross-sectional area of the bore also has the same 4-to-1 effect.

Put those two together, and the .30-06 can get about 10% more velocity with the same bullet weights as the 7mm-08, everything else being equal. Often barrel length and pressure aren't. If a 7mm-08 is getting the same velocity from a 150-grain bullet as a .30-06, then something else is in the mix, whether pressure or barrel length or both.

I pretty much get 2750 fps out of a 260 Ruger with 4350... and I could push it more if I wanted to, but
see no reason...

therefore, even tho I am a 260 user over the 6.5 Creed.. 2750 fps out of it with a 140 isn't
exactly a fluke...should do it easily...

Yep, there's about two grains more powder room in the .260 over the 6.5 Creedmoor, depending on the brass. That means about 4% more powder room, which according to the 4-to-1 rule means about a 1% difference in potential velocity--around 25-30 fps with 140-grain bullets.

I'll take the Creedmoor... its advantages over the 260 completely outweigh 25-30 fps.

Especially since most chronographs and powders will show 25-30 fps difference in the same load on different days--or even the same day.

About the only real advantage of the .260 is brass can easily be made from cheap .308/7.62 cases. You can also make 6.5 CM cases from .308's, but it's more involved and time-consuming. All other advantages go to the Creedmoor, one reason they're selling so well.