Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Hunter's Campfire That Houston Couple Killed in Drug Raid...

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I had to google who Jack Handy is, I was hoping it was that other guy in those books, but that would be Jack Reacher.

it was surprising…….he seems to be an even keel type of guy...…...bob

Curdog,

You ought to go back and reread my post without such blind and prejudicial hatred.
If you actually went back and read it objectively you would see that I am 100% in favor of prosecuting the officers responsible for this. I also suggested that the investigation get completely taken out of the hands of HPD so that the “union thugs“ could not influence it in any way shape or form. That is exactly why I suggested that the investigation be handled by an agency from out of the state entirely so nobody could try to pull any favors or influence the investigation.

Somehow between you and aces you two extrapolated from that that means covering up criminal activities of other leos and “union goon”....

Maybe you were drinking when you read it the first time.

I believe this is the part of your post that has got things sideways.

The people that got killed by the cops in this case weren't thugs, and didn't deserve to be hunted down and killed like thugs.

Or even schitbirds.

Whether or not you want to excrapolate on whether that's where you meant to go, or not, up to you.

Fubar and STX,

You are both right.

I don't know the full details of the case, just the cliff notes about the seriously shady schit the lead narcotics cop did in regards to obtaining a warrant, and that is the perspective I was commenting from. Anytime some crap like what they pulled goes down, there is simply no way the department should be allowed to investigate it themselves. The fact that it resulted in a shootout with horrible results, reaffirms my belief that it needs to be independently investigated so nothing gets swept under the table. That is the whole point.

The schitbird comment derives from the fact that the whole story is from the dope world, and rarely are there any choir boys in that world. Perhaps these two are candidates for sainthood and beatification. I don't know anything about them. That comment was simply based off of years of working in that world (fortunately no more).

FWIW, the DA's office normally does the local investigation of possible police malfeasance in Texas jurisidictions of any size. Of course, there has to be an internal investigation also, as there are policies and procedures that also apply. The FBI will always be presented the case to review, as the civil rights aspect is their sole jurisdiction. The Texas Rangers are the detective division of DPS...the next step after highway patrol. They are used by small jurisdictions that typically have never investigated a real crime, much less one involving law enforcement.

Obviously, this won't appease the cop haters, but nothing will

I'm thinking the OP should change the title from "killed" to murdered.

Any law enforcement agency worth a damn will have another agency do an independent investigation.

The other shoe drops and it is bad:

"I posted a link to a video by News Now Houston (NNH), he is a youtuber who does copwatch/1st amendment audit videos. In the video he shows a map of the house and allegedly how the shootout went down.

In the video the biggest new allegations were that the husband, Tuttle, was alive and left to bleed out for 2 hours before anyone went back in. NNH claims that a neighbor heard Tuttle crying out for over two hours. The neighbor additionally claims that prior to SWAT entering the home (after the 2 hours presumably), Tuttle who was downed in the initial shootout was given an anchor shot through a window."

But still have to do their own. Why does anyone think this isn't going to be investigated elsewhere? (Cop hating regulars need not reply.)

Don't know where my element falls within the periodic table of cop-haters, but the concern is two-fold:

1- Will there be an adequate independent investigation? I agree with you that there will be any number of investigations.

But , ya gotta admit, "authorities" have investigated the hell outta any number of obvious felonies, from illegal servers on down, and nothin happens.

SO,

2- The bigger concern is whether the matter will actually result in a credible disclosure of the actual facts and circumstances of the matter, and actual punishment of those responsible for two dead people.

This case hits a nerve, cause there ain't a person on the campfire that couldn't a been kicked in on like the H/W in this case.

Fubarski,

The higher ups are all politicians and political appointees.

How much faith do you have in people like that?

I know how much I have after I spent roughly 2 decades being around them...

Thanks for that. I was trying to find out what turned this thread sideways.

Why is it now SOP to shoot the dogs first thing anymore?

It's an opportunity for "the system" to either give regular people a reason to respect the law, or a reason to not GAS when a cop, who had nothin ta do with insanity like this case, gets whacked.

Hate ta pile a giant stacka responsibility on this jurisdiction, but this one is so far off the map.

No, "regular people" don't judge everybody on the acts of another.

Needs to go nation-wide:

https://www.chron.com/news/houston-...nd-use-of-no-knock-warrants-13626158.php

Monday, February 18, 2019

Houston police to end use of no-knock warrants, chief says

The Houston Police Department will end its use of controversial no-knock warrants in most situations, Chief Art Acevedo said during a contentious town hall meeting three weeks after a deadly Pecan Park drug raid that left two people dead and five officers injured.

"The no-knock warrants are going to go away like leaded gasoline in this city," Acevedo told the crowd of activists, reformers and concerned community members gathered at Talento Bilingüe de Houston.

After the event - organized by the Greater Houston Coalition for Justice - Acevedo said any situation where a no-knock raid would be required would have to receive a special exemption from his office.

"I'm 99.9 percent sure we won't be using them," he said. "If for some reason there would be a specific case, that would come from my office."

Given the wounded officers and the two slain civilians, the chief said he didn't "see the value" in the controversial raids.

"So that's probably going to go by the wayside," he said.

The news came during the meeting late Monday after more than an hour of questions from a furious crowd that repeatedly pressed Acevedo on the conduct of his undercover officers, the use of no-knocks and inflammatory comments from Houston police union President Joe Gamaldi who recently seemed to suggest the department was surveilling law enforcement critics.

And, despite pushback earlier in the day from a defense lawyer representing the case agent at the center of the botched bust, Acevedo doubled down on his previous statements about the likelihood of charges against the police involved.

"I'm very confident we're going to have criminal charges on one or more of the officers," he said.

The crowd greeted his declaration with a chorus of angry voices demanding: "All of them."

Still, Acevedo said he wouldn't agree to let the Texas Ranger or the FBI take over the investigation.

"I feel very strongly that a police department that is not capable of investigating itself and finding malfeasance and criminal misconduct," he said, "we should just shut down -- and that's just not the case here."

Harris County District Attorney Kim Ogg also tried to assure the crowd that her office would investigate and that bad actors would not be allowed off the hook, but pushed back against "mob justice."

"There is a process - it is the justice system," she said. "What you've seen is more accountability - grand juries are returning more true-bills, and we're prosecuting them."

When asked whether he would fire Gamaldi or others allegedly surveilling or harassing activists, Acevedo said he wouldn't deal with speculation. In response, activist Shere Dore fired back with an allegation that earlier in the day police came out and took pictures of protesters gathered outside

Houston police headquarters to demand murder charges against the case agent behind the raid.

Acevedo asked for video to look into the claim.

He went on to say that he would roll out a new policy in the coming weeks to make sure that undercovers wear body cameras; the fact that they didn't in the Harding Street raid was a point of contention afterward, given the lack of evidence to counter the initial narrative.

But Acevedo's sweeping announcements weren't enough to placate some of the town hall attendees.

One member of the audience, Tomaro Bell, expressed indignation over police use of no-knock warrants.

"I do believe this officer is going to be charged with murder," she said, of Goines. "But the systemic problems that exist in the undercover narcotics division will not be resolved with this officer charged with murder."

Relatives of several people killed in no-knock raids said they believe more investigation was needed before using the raid.

Aurora Charles said her brother, 55-year-old Ponciano Montemayor Jr., was killed during a no-knock raid in September 2013.

"I just want to see change, that's it," she said. "They've got to do their homework before they go in with these warrants."

For some in the crowd, the killing of the Tuttles brough back memories of the killing of Joe Campos Torres in 1977.

"We've been down this road before," said Johnny Mata, a longtime civil rights activist. Still, he tried to assure them.

"To those who feel down and depressed, that nothing has changed, ill tell you it has," he said.

But at the same time, he called on Gamaldi to reach out to activists.

"An apology is still needed," he said, suggesting the union could recall his election. "We don't need any demagoguery."

[bleep] is hitting the fan in Houston - FTP

“The no-knock warrants are going to go away like leaded gasoline in this city”

Says the true chitbird Acevedo, the same guy who put that couple’s faces on camera and called ‘em “scumbags”, now scrambling to keep his job.

Scrambling to keep his job he takes away no-knock entries entirely. Obviously these things have a place which is why good guys like Lt Pat and McKay have done so many. So now Acevedo the prick chitbird grandstands, setting up more good Cops to get shot.