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Joined: Apr 2011
Posts: 152,640 Likes: 52
Campfire Savant
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Campfire Savant
Joined: Apr 2011
Posts: 152,640 Likes: 52 |
I used to think a hunter needed a 7 mag to kill deer, until I saw my granddaughter slay deer and pigs with a .243 Winchester. She was making the same shots, laying them out right where they stood. That opened my eyes to the smaller cartridges. I became interested in the 25-06’s, 270’s, etc. They kill as well as 7 mag with less recoil. Kids seem to knock down WT's and pigs on a regular basis with the .223. For some reason it's not an adequate "adult" round... Strange... DF The older I get, I have noticed two major truisms when it comes to hunting rifles: 1. Grown men need larger cartridges to kill game than women and children. 2. Grown men need lighter rifles to kill game than women and children. That is a fact, granddaughter has a heavy Vanguard, she weighs a whole 110 lbs. She like the weight of it.
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Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 17,478 Likes: 4
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Sep 2004
Posts: 17,478 Likes: 4 |
The older I get, I have noticed two major truisms when it comes to hunting rifles:
1. Grown men need larger cartridges to kill game than women and children.
2. Grown men need lighter rifles to kill game than women and children.
Why are "grown men" killing women and children?
Last edited by David_Walter; 05/10/19.
“Live free or die. Death is not the worst of evils.” - General John Stark.
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Joined: Sep 2010
Posts: 19,179
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Sep 2010
Posts: 19,179 |
The older I get, I have noticed two major truisms when it comes to hunting rifles:
1. Grown men need larger cartridges to kill game than women and children.
2. Grown men need lighter rifles to kill game than women and children.
Why are "grown men" killing women and children? kinda like "front shoulders" Jerry
jwall- *** 3100 guy***
A Flat Trajectory is Never a Handicap
Speed is Trajectory's Friend !!
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Joined: Nov 2010
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Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 37,249 Likes: 14 |
The older I get, I have noticed two major truisms when it comes to hunting rifles:
1. Grown men need larger cartridges to kill game than women and children.
2. Grown men need lighter rifles to kill game than women and children.
Why are "grown men" killing women and children? kinda like "front shoulders" Jerry Y'all messin with ChetAF... He's made a couple of good observations. Are kids and ladies that much better marksmen than guys? They kill critters grave yard dead with lighter ordinance, while some guys ruminate over KE, knock down power, penetration, group size, B.C., etc. While the kids and ladies put more and more meat in the freezer... DF
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Joined: Feb 2010
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 17,927 |
I need a custom rifle and handloads....my kid a $300 RAR.
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Joined: Sep 2010
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Sep 2010
Posts: 19,179 |
Y'all messin with ChetAF... He's made a couple of good observations. Are kids and ladies that much better marksmen than guys? They kill critters grave yard dead with lighter ordinance, while some guys ruminate over KE, knock down power, penetration, group size, B.C., etc. While the kids and ladies put more and more meat in the freezer... DF Of Course we are ! WE, all of us, say what we 'intend' but at times how we say it implies something else ! eg. front shoulders. Now to Chet's point, I know and agree that WT and deer in general & pigs etc. die readily with a well placed bullet from lesser cartridges than some of us want/use. For MYSELF, I prefer FAST FLAT & HARD bullet delivery >>> for flat trajectory which MAKES bullet placement easier at distance. DF, this is NOT directed at you. It doesn't matter to me what ANYONE else shoots >> WHY does it bother some WHAT I shoot ? I'm glad we have the freedom and liberty to own, hunt, shoot what we WANT to use !! If I continue I'll be in a RANT, so I'll just stop there. Jerry
jwall- *** 3100 guy***
A Flat Trajectory is Never a Handicap
Speed is Trajectory's Friend !!
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Joined: Jun 2006
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Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 46,350 Likes: 19 |
The older I get, I have noticed two major truisms when it comes to hunting rifles:
1. Grown men need larger cartridges to kill game than women and children.
2. Grown men need lighter rifles to kill game than women and children.
Why are "grown men" killing women and children? Exactly. Everybody knows it's "grown- ass men."
A wise man is frequently humbled.
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Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 1,594
Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 1,594 |
This is one tough crowd! In all seriousness though, I once had a Remington Custom Shop Alaska Wilderness Rifle. It was back when they had a custom shop barreled action with Teflon coating and a McMillan stock. I killed a sheep and a couple of grizzlies with it, then decided I needed something lighter, because it was too heavy for me at 6' 1" and 190 pounds. Posted it for sale in Alaska and a 5' 6" 130 pound woman bought it. She has used it to kill all manner of beasts ever since. It's amazing what you can do it you don't know any better.
The first great thing is to find yourself and for that you need solitude and contemplation. I can tell you deliverance will not come from the rushing noisy centers of civilization. It will come from the lonely places. Fridtjof Nansen
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Joined: Apr 2011
Posts: 152,640 Likes: 52
Campfire Savant
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Campfire Savant
Joined: Apr 2011
Posts: 152,640 Likes: 52 |
I think I’m going to get out my 270’s and fondle them!!!
Last edited by hanco; 05/11/19.
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Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 1,508 |
Boddington did a great job with rewriting about the old super cartridge 270 Winchester ,just look at the replies on this post plus reads just on this 24 hr campfire. Boddington sure got the campfire stirred up with negative and positive replies. i would say yes Boddington did do a great job ! And maybe that was his main goal all along.
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Joined: Jun 2006
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Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 2,342 |
This is one tough crowd! It's amazing what you can do it you don't know any better. From about 1973 into the late 80's. I used a stock Rem 700 BDL 270 topped with a 3x9 Redfield Widefield using mostly 130 gr Parttions pushed by a case full of WW785 ($24 for an 8# keg). I took that rifle on a wide variety of shoestring budget hunts around the country for a lot of big game. It never failed to get the job done. I didn't know any better.
Imagine your grave on a windy winter night. You've been dead for 70 years. It's been 50 since a visitor last paused at your tombstone..... Now explain why you're in a pissy mood today.
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Joined: Jul 2001
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Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
Joined: Jul 2001
Posts: 60,264 Likes: 42 |
Chet,
Years ago Eileen had the opportunity to ask a fairly well-known gun writer a pointed question. He was of the generation of rifle loonies that tended to believe in the O'Connor or Keith school, and was definitely a Keithian. He lived in the metropolitan East but often hunted in Montana, usually with a friend of ours,where we'd often join them. He usually brought a .338 Winchester Magnum or .340 Weatherby Magnum.
One year he asked me, "John, will a .270 Winchester really kill an elk?"
Eileen snorted, possibly because a little of the glass of wine she was drinking got up her nose. She'd not only killed several elk with the .270, but a bull moose, so asked, "Why do men need larger cartridges than women do to kill the same animals?"
He also once asked me if a .243 will actually kill mule deer, despite the fact that the wife on an outfitter he sometimes hunted with had killed a bunch of deer (both mule and whitetails) with her .243.
“Montana seems to me to be what a small boy would think Texas is like from hearing Texans.” John Steinbeck
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Feb 2010
Posts: 17,927 |
Women and kid rifles are certainly effective.
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Joined: Sep 2010
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Sep 2010
Posts: 19,179 |
From about 1973 into the late 80's. I used a stock Rem 700 BDL 270 topped with a 3x9 Redfield Widefield using mostly 130 gr Parttions pushed by a case full of WW785 ($24 for an 8# keg). I took that rifle on a wide variety of shoestring budget hunts around the country for a lot of big game. It never failed to get the job done. I didn't know any better.
Here too Fish. THE BEST looking rifle I've ever owned was a S-W 1500 (aka Howa) in 270 W had a 'scrumptious' Walnut stock --- our own 'WHITEBIRD" has a Custom 6.5-06 with a VERY similar stock -- The VERY FIRST time I laid eyes on this pic --- my mind went to my S W , 270 -- NOT identical but similar:!! >> Here's whitebird's 6.5-06 >>>> on P 72 in Thread "Let's See Some Big Bucks -- BobinNH started ! I hunted it in N Ark., La., Miss, & Al.. I 'ruined' myself by getting a Ruger 77 UL, then a Win 70 XTR FTWT. The S-W then BECAME so heavy that I moved it. *!*! I just remembered who has that rifle -- I'll try to get it back *!*! Jerry
jwall- *** 3100 guy***
A Flat Trajectory is Never a Handicap
Speed is Trajectory's Friend !!
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Joined: Jul 2001
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Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
Joined: Jul 2001
Posts: 60,264 Likes: 42 |
Jerry, My present .270 has pretty nice wood too--but nice wood does weigh more. This rifle went eight pounds with scope when I took its first big game animal, a "cull" mule deer with it in eastern Montana.
“Montana seems to me to be what a small boy would think Texas is like from hearing Texans.” John Steinbeck
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Joined: Sep 2010
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Sep 2010
Posts: 19,179 |
Yes, Indeed MD that's sweet. My S-W had a gloss finish & Monte Carlo and don't remember if it had a cheek piece or not. I've looked thru a bunch of OLD paper pix and can't find one of it. JRS had an article entitled, "Little Misses I've Known" --> about rifles. That is one of mine. Jerry
jwall- *** 3100 guy***
A Flat Trajectory is Never a Handicap
Speed is Trajectory's Friend !!
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Joined: May 2005
Posts: 7,128 Likes: 10
Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
Joined: May 2005
Posts: 7,128 Likes: 10 |
From about 1973 into the late 80's. I used a stock Rem 700 BDL 270 topped with a 3x9 Redfield Widefield using mostly 130 gr Parttions pushed by a case full of WW785 ($24 for an 8# keg). I took that rifle on a wide variety of shoestring budget hunts around the country for a lot of big game. It never failed to get the job done. I didn't know any better.
Here too Fish. THE BEST looking rifle I've ever owned was a S-W 1500 (aka Howa) in 270 W had a 'scrumptious' Walnut stock --- our own 'WHITEBIRD" has a Custom 6.5-06 with a VERY similar stock -- The VERY FIRST time I laid eyes on this pic --- my mind went to my S W , 270 -- NOT identical but similar:!! >> Here's whitebird's 6.5-06 >>>> on P 72 in Thread "Let's See Some Big Bucks -- BobinNH started ! I hunted it in N Ark., La., Miss, & Al.. I 'ruined' myself by getting a Ruger 77 UL, then a Win 70 XTR FTWT. The S-W then BECAME so heavy that I moved it. *!*! I just remembered who has that rifle -- I'll try to get it back *!*! Jerry Jerry, If I saw a rifle like that for sale I probably wouldn't care what the chambering was. I have bought rifles before based on judging by "the cover only, without reading the content" and found it can be a sound practice as their isn't much else that cannot be fixed. My only criteria is no short actions. Never, ever. John
When truth is ignored, it does not change an untruth from remaining a lie.
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Joined: Sep 2010
Posts: 19,179
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Sep 2010
Posts: 19,179 |
A G W YES and actually I can quote from that thread that I told 'Whitebird', it didn't matter the caliber/cartridge that I'd buy it. TOO. We are a LOONY bunch!! Jerry
jwall- *** 3100 guy***
A Flat Trajectory is Never a Handicap
Speed is Trajectory's Friend !!
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Joined: Nov 2018
Posts: 1,490
Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
Joined: Nov 2018
Posts: 1,490 |
But then, the longer I hunt, the less difference I see in "killing power" between most cartridges.
Same here. When a hit from a little ol' 6mm Rem or 243 Win produces instant death on a chest-shot mule deer... It's hard to imagine improvement from some other cartridge. We all likely have our favorite cartridges. I've never had a 270 Win, but respect it tremendously as a general purpose hunting cartridge. Regards, Guy
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Joined: Sep 2010
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Sep 2010
Posts: 19,179 |
My S-W had a gloss finish & Monte Carlo and don't remember if it had a cheek piece or not. I've looked thru a bunch of OLD paper pix and can't find one of it. Jerry ADDENDUM - I just found 1 old pic from 1983 of myself with the S-W and a coyote I'd killed with it. The pic itself is MORE of the yote than the rifle. Snow was on the ground, I had a mustache and long hair. I don't know how well it might copy/paste to imgur---- might not be worth the effort. The rifle DID have a M C and Cheek piece. I'm still looking for a better pic Jerry
jwall- *** 3100 guy***
A Flat Trajectory is Never a Handicap
Speed is Trajectory's Friend !!
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