Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Ask The Gunwriters 280Rem vs 280ai

My cousin said the 300 Weatherby recoil was severe too. I think he had shot a slim barreled Weatherby??? I don’t know but the Remington 700 Classic recoil with 200 grain bullets seems a lot easier on the shoulder than the 338 with 250 grain bullets.
I’m in my 70’s with arthritis and bursitis and my 300 Weatherby’s recoil isn’t an issue.

Comparing the 280 Rem to the 280 AI is like comparing the 300 Savage to the 308 Win or the 260 Rem to the 6.5 C or the 7mm-08 Rem to the 284 Win.

Under field conditions and as it regards shooting at game, they are the same to each other.

Those comparisons just give guys that are bored and have way too much time on their hands something to argue about.

Yep!

But what else do rifle loonies have to do between hunting seasons?

This month, I am building a 280ai.

I was building rifles in September and shooting deer in October, but then the covid lockdown... the supply chain..... the theme of the last 3 rifles is "use up spare parts".

B : just throwing shade on the big 300’s with their sharp recoil impulse.
I think it’s more about stock fit and shape, after rifle weight, and balance.

One of my first 338s was an Abolt Stainless Stalker, nice wide butt pad, full grip, and the muzzle blast was 26” away ; All of which contributed to recoil management.

Probably would’ve been good in a 300 mag too, but I had a 338 Win Mag

Let's say you do run your .280 AI at slightly higher pressure than you would a .280 as many AI owners do. So instead of just getting around 40 to 50 fps more due solely to the increased capacity, you get perhaps 100 fps more with maybe 40-50 fps of that increase due to higher pressure. How much of a risk is this realistically?

Book loads for the 280AI are at 65 Kpsi.

The time honoured tradition of loading up until primers loosen, and then backing-off a “couple” grains, probably puts you into 70-72 Kpsi territory or higher. Might test the action some, if only one lug is bearing.

What does your Chrono say ? No free lunch

Around 3100 fps with 140s with H4831

Nosler shows 62.5 grains H4831 @ 3177 FPS in a 26” barrel

It also lists 57 grains H4831@ 3005 FPS with the ordinary .280 in a 26" barrel. That's a difference of 172 FPS. So I suppose in a .280 with a 26" barrel at similar pressure to the 280 AI, the velocity would be around 3100 FPS...perhaps around 3000 FPS in a 22" barrel.

It's pretty easy to tell how much influence the AI case and the higher SAAMI pressure have on the "extra" velocity of the .280 AI, using some basic ballistic formulas. It's just about half extra case capacity, and half extra pressure. Added together they amount to at most around 100 fps , about as much velocity is lost by even a pretty high-BC bullet loses in around 40-50 yards.

Of course, any handloader is free to push any cartridge balls-to-the-wall. Whether that makes any discernible difference in "killing power." trajectory or wind drift is another question.

Now that this has been clearly settled. How about the vast killing-power difference between the 7-08 and the 7x57?

This is what I want to see, need to know how much I am giving up to my wife and her 7x57.

Classic rifle looney discussion/argument here. LOL

It seems all agree that the 280AI does offer a little more velocity than the standard 280. The question is whether or not it is enough to matter. My take is that I’d not pay any money to convert a 280 to a 280AI. However, when starting with a blank slate, so to speak, I don’t see any reason to not choose the AI now that brass for it is offered by some manufacturers. I have Lilja barreled 280AI on stainless M70 put together by Redneck. It feeds flawlessly and shoots accurately. 3100 fps with RL26 under 150 ELDX and 3200 fps with RL22 or RL23 under 140 Ballistic Tips. I’m sure I’d be just as happy if it were a standard 280.

I have a standard 280 Rem MR that I'm getting 2940 fps with RL23 under 150 BT. I looked at building a 280 AI even bought an action to get started and changed my mind when I purchased the 280 Rem MR. Don't really need the AI version.

Nosler lists the 140 gr 7mm/08 at 2825fps, the 280 Rem 140 grain at 3000 fps and 280 AI 140 grain at 3200 all with a 24 inch barrel. I gather most think the 200 fps difference is really closer to 100 fps, but I'm more curious how these three would compare if all shot from a 22 barrel. My guess is it would have the smallest effect on the 7mm/08 and the biggest on the AI and would close the gap even further between the 280 and the AI Does that sound right?

I ask this because I'm looking for one of these three for my son and except for a Ruger No. 1 I think for how and where he hunts he would prefer a 22 inch in a bolt gun and I think the old 77 tangers in 280 were 22 inch which is ideally what I would like to find him or No. 1

Heavens, what an outstanding voice of reason! Having two .280 Rem rifles, I'm not remotely interested in AI unless my quarry obtains Kevlar.

I load my 24" 280 with a load I found right in the Nosler manual #4, 160-162g at 2930 fps with IMR 7828 with a fed 210. In my 26" 280 AI, I run the 175g-180g at 2980.

You are a leg up if you form brass for either case from Lapua 30/06 brass, fire forming with 14-14.6g of Bullseye and cream of wheat. The neck will be a tad shorter, keep the carbon out of the neck with a pistol bronze bristle brush. You will wear a rifle barrel out with 100 Lapua cases....this brass is Tough! Peterson does make a run of 280 Brass from time to time.

This past year, I ran the std 280 with 180g ELD-M at 2700 with R#17 with a fed 215, Lapua brass. This load is very impressive in ballistic and accuracy.

Accuracy node with my 280 with a 140g is 3000 where it shoots 1.5" at 300. Accuracy node with the 140 in the AI is 3165 with it's 2" longer barrel.

I would take the 280 over the 270 due to the load with the 160g at 2930, it just works in several Remingtons...hands down winner with little load development...dumb butt simple.

Some of the New powders can bump the velocities with accuracy, over the loads I have listed above.

If you start off with Lapua brass in either case, work up your load, listen to what your rifle tells you in pressure. By starting off with good brass, you will be shocked at the velocity with accuracy in the extreme. The AI really shines with 175-180g bullets.

Yeah, I handload for both, near max loads. The ai will get maybe 40-50fps over the standard .280. Not enough to make a big difference, but the ai has more " cool factor" IMO.

280: my experience mirrors yours. I was just trying to understand XBOLT's comment that the 280 can't hold a candle to the AI. Seems to me that would indicate much more than a 50fps advantage. Still waiting on XBOLT. Thinking that his silence says a lot.