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OP
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Are they the same design other than the AWR had checkering and the KS did not? I'm only asking about the McMillan stocks and not worried about the difference in the barrel channel dimensions.
Rick
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Campfire Ranger
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Same/same; no difference. If there is checkering it’s not a McMillan.
There was never a ks factory stocked with a B&C. AWR II was B&C.
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Joined: Feb 2004
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OP
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I hope you are wrong as i have a stock sold to me by a long time member here as a AWR that has checkering. It was supposedly sold to him by Ric Bin back when he was painting stocks. One of my favorite stocks to date.
Just to be clear this is not a post about someone selling something it is not. I'm just trying to figure out what I've got.
Rick
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
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My response was with regard to factory offerings from Remington. The ks and awr share the same McMillan stock and it did not leave the factory with checkering.*
The AWR came out long after the transition from Brown to McMillan, so there will be no Brown manufactured AWR stocks.
There have now been three iterations of the AWR - the awr i (McMillan) awr II (fluted; b&c) and the awr III - AMERICAN WR with grayboe.
After Remington stopped making the KS McMillan started offering the stock. I have no idea if Rick had some made with checkering or not. Certainly a possibility, as that situation existed with the Winchester featherweight pattern. After the winlites stopped, and McMillan began offering that pattern, you could obtain it with checkering. No factory winlite ever had checkering.
*safari ks excluded - safari ks did have checkering.
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Joined: Sep 2006
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
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The Michigan Man has it right.
The KS is my all time favorite synthetic stock............it fits & feels perfect to me.
I really wish McM still had it available & I also wish it could have been had in a short action version..........the Model 7 KS is just not the same.
MM
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Thanks guys! I appreciate the info
Rick
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Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
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The Michigan Man has it right.
The KS is my all time favorite synthetic stock............it fits & feels perfect to me.
I really wish McM still had it available & I also wish it could have been had in a short action version..........the Model 7 KS is just not the same.
MM Absolutely! I have a KS on my .338-06. Best stock ever, IMO.
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I have an early KS in .280 Rem and it has a Brown Precision stock.
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I think Rick had some with checkering back in the day from mcmillan
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I think, everyone who has used, the KS stock on their rifles, are a fan.
I have, 3 KS Remington rifles. They all work great as they should.
Randy
NRA
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So the AWR “Alaskan wilderness rifle” is a Kevlar stock? Is this correct?
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Campfire Ranger
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So the AWR “Alaskan wilderness rifle” is a Kevlar stock? Is this correct? If it’s the first generation awr yes; it’s a McMillan ks (kevlar stock) in black. Second generation (AWRII) is a B&C
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Campfire Outfitter
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I hope you are wrong as i have a stock sold to me by a long time member here as a AWR that has checkering. It was supposedly sold to him by Ric Bin back when he was painting stocks. One of my favorite stocks to date.
Just to be clear this is not a post about someone selling something it is not. I'm just trying to figure out what I've got. You MAY have a MHKS - Mountain Hunter Kevlar Special. It was a pattern exclusive to the Remington Custom Shop, and I got a bunch of them years ago when I bought out a big stash of McMillans. I still have two specimens. Does the recoil pad say Remington?
"What we obtain too cheap, we esteem too lightly: it is dearness only that gives every thing its value. Heaven knows how to put a proper price upon its goods; and it would be strange indeed if so celestial an article as freedom should not be highly rated." Thomas Paine
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"I still have two specimens"
Selling any?
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Campfire Outfitter
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They’re on rifles.  . Looking for pictures. ![[Linked Image]]( https://www.24hourcampfire.com/images/Ti.jpg) Here is one before paint on a 700 Ti. The bondo is McMillan’s.
Last edited by RickBin; 01/20/24. Reason: Add picture.
"What we obtain too cheap, we esteem too lightly: it is dearness only that gives every thing its value. Heaven knows how to put a proper price upon its goods; and it would be strange indeed if so celestial an article as freedom should not be highly rated." Thomas Paine
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Campfire Member
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I had a Remington 700 AWR 300 Win Mag, Alaskan Wilderness Rifle, that I got from the custom shop in the late 90’s, IIRC. It had a McMillan stock without a floor plate. Its stock was uncheckered.
The original McMillan stock eventually split between the action screws in 2016. I replaced it with a HS Precision. It shot great with both stocks but was much heavier with the HS so I traded it.
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Campfire Ranger
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They’re on rifles. . Looking for pictures. Here is one before paint on a 700 Ti. The bondo is McMillan’s. That’s a nice pattern. CP? Thanks for weighing in!!!
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Campfire Ranger
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So the AWR “Alaskan wilderness rifle” is a Kevlar stock? Is this correct? Another thing to keep in mind - when the KS was introduced in 1986, Remington was using Brown as the supplier of that stock. The Brown absolutely had Kevlar in the shell very much like their pounder. Once the transition to McMillan occurred around 1990-1991, I’m not sure how much Kevlar was actually being used in the shell. Perhaps Rick knows. There is a long post somewhere here in the Campfire from Dick at McMillan re: KS “fill.”
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Found it: Guys,
This is not a change in procedures, this is the way it always has been. We make all our stocks as light as we think we can and not have a lot of failures with broken out recoil lugs or fore-ends broken off trying to get the barreled action out of the stock after a bedding job.
We have always gotten a lot of orders requesting "light fill" or "light as possible fill" or "KS" fill or "mountain rifle fill" or "upside-down left-hand Vulcan fill", and we have always filled the stocks with our standard fill. That is "light as possible". We have always gotten a small weight variation in our stocks, one or two or three ounces. It is not the exact science you may think. Molded in colors weigh an ounce or two more than a painted stock. The resin is warmer in the summer than in the winter and may have a bit more bleed out of the mold when it's under pressure,etc. There are a lot of little variables.
When we mix in interior fill for the stocks it is mixed in big Hobart bread mixers in batches of 10 lbs or 20 lbs. Each batch has a certain receipe for that fill. When we started doing the KS stocks for Remington we needed to take about one, repeat one, ounce off the stocks to make their weight, so we added one extra cup of microbaloons to the standard fill to make KS fill. It saved about one ounce per stock. We only mixed it when we had a batch of KS stocks to fill. We have never mixed up a batch to use 3/4 of a pound to fill one stock and then thrown the other 9+ lbs away just to save one ounce on a single stock. Since Remington is discontinuing the "KS" rifles after a 25 year run due to lack of sales we will not be mixing KS fill again.
Doesn't matter, we never did it anyway except for the KS stocks and there is more that one ounce variation in the stocks anyway.
So, nothing has changed. The stocks will not be any heavier than they have ever been. We are not making them any different that we have for the last 10 or 15 years. We will still accept orders with any terminology of fill you want to say, and we will still make them the way we have always made them "as light as possible". It's just that now you know how it's really done. Magnum fill is just a more solid glass (more glass fibers in the resin)in the action area, and adds about 4 to 6 ounces to the stock. It's used for anything from the big .338's and up. Standard fill seems to be fine for all the calibers up thru the big .30's. "Sniper fill" is just "magnum fill" with the butt filled with the same light weight solid mixture we use in the fore-end so that it will support some of the hareware options.
The only reason I decided to bring this subject up is because my e-mail volume is way up (I'm not complaining) but so I didn't have to answer so many e-mail about the weight difference between "light fill", "light as possible fill", "KS fill" and "mountain rifle fill". The answer is "none at all"
Regards to all, Dick D.
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