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I was at the 1970 NRA Convention in New Orleans, saw Elmer, JOC and the Col.
I was at the entrance of the Hilton, which was the NRA Headquarters, saw the Col leaving the hotel, walking towards the French Quarter, alone at night. My thought, don't think I'd want to do that. Had I been closer, I'd have warned him, but he was too far ahead and I wasn't gonna run after him.
After learning more about him, reading "Unrepentant Sinner", I think he was OK. If the ghetto thugs wanted to get him, I think he'd have had them windrowed, lined up for the NOPD to sort out and toe tag. Don't ya know he was packing.
The area between the Quarter and the Hilton was dark, wasn't a good place to be walking at night, especially alone, unless you were Col. Askins. In that case, it would be more than OK.
DF I've read this same exact scenario before,except the star was Col. Rex Applegate. Must have been a popular walk way....
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Molon Labe
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Read the parts about Rex Applegate in the SGW link. The Askins and Rex weren’t necessarily friends. Reportedly Rex bought the Col’s match pistol, had the Col’s name and championship title engraved on it.
Col Askins thought that was presumptuous, not his style. I’m not sure what Rex was trying to accomplish.
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I think, Elmer bought both the 10 and 16 ga. Ithaca's from the Major. Both were Ithaca's. The major did get involved in a shooting scrap in the Philippines. He emptyed his .38 into a Morrow soldier, and I think finally hit him over the head. The guy died. He wasn't as deadly as his son. I like both of them for different reasons. Condeming his actions with crooks, is why we are in the mess we are today. Elmer said he bought the Ithaca 10 from the Major when he became too old to handle it; however, the Col. wrote, "His wife finally sold the gun to Elmer Keith." There was also a discrepancy between Elmer saying a 30-'06 case blew up the Major's .276 Dubiel and the Col. stating it was a .275 H&H case. Major Askins was the father of most of our mod- ern magnum shotgun loads. He was directly re- sponsible for the big magnum 10 gauge. Ithaca made the first magnum 10 for Major Askins. and Western loaded the ammunition. His test and his write-ups of it are still an epic in shotgun devel- opment. When he became too old to handle the big magnum ten bore, I bought it from him. I've shot that big gun now for over 25 years, and it is still my favorite duck and goose gun.As far as my Old Man was concerned with magnum guns, though, it was Lou Smith at Ithaca who took the blue ribbon. He got up a 3 1/2-inch 10-gauge for his good friend Major Askins. The Western Cartridge Co., under the watchful eye of John Olin, came up with the 3 1/2-inch 10-gauge cases. The Old Man loaded them and when the big Magnum 10 was finally pronounced ready, it digested the big shells which were filled with 1 1/2 ounces of No. 2 shot; later, he favored 3s. The Old Man shot geese with it along the Cimarron River in Oklahoma for years. His wife finally sold the gun to Elmer Keith.
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The Major and Bill Weaver were both in El Paso, were good friends. My SGW link has a good bit of stuff on Bill Weaver and his ultimate demise.
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Read the parts about Rex Applegate in the SGW link. The Askins and Rex weren’t necessarily friends. Reportedly Rex bought the Col’s match pistol, had the Col’s name and championship title engraved on it.
Col Askins thought that was presumptuous, not his style. I’m not sure what Rex was trying to accomplish.
DF Here's the Applegate engraved Askins pistol. DF
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Come on Mr Prairie Goat...none of are saying we want/would if we could, vote in the Col for our next Pastor, ha. He was just a man, and I probably should have said "as far as I know, he was a good man". ha In combat and in LE work, the "line" can get very "blurred" between "killing and murdering"...and I wasn't there. Agreed, but a lot of times the line is clear. The deeds he describes in "Unrepentant Sinner" neatly meet the definition of a serial killer. Okie John
If Montana had a standing army, a 270 Win with Federal Blue Box 130's would be the standard issue.
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I never read the book, so that's hard for me to reconcile that image with the one of the man whose Gun Articles I read, as a young man. Now, I'm not saying the accounts you speak of didn't happen, only that I am ignorant of them. If "the line" is ever crossed, well, that's a non-negotiable, for me. However, I have questions; were these killings ever reported? Why weren't charges brought? I need more information is all.
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Man! I tried to find a copy to read....$145 for a Paperback! I wasn't able to download in the couple PDF free websites for some reason. I don't want to read about him that bad, lol!
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I never read the book, so that's hard for me to reconcile that image with the one of the man whose Gun Articles I read, as a young man. Now, I'm not saying the accounts you speak of didn't happen, only that I am ignorant of them. If "the line" is ever crossed, well, that's a non-negotiable, for me. However, I have questions; were these killings ever reported? Why weren't charges brought? I need more information is all. Other than Germans and VC he killed Mexicans on the border and Africans in Africa. That's why it was allowed. Now he could've been arrested in Mexico because he'd follow the Mexicans into Mexico and ambush them at their campsites. But he never was
Last edited by moosemike; 02/21/24.
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Thanks for posting that article DF. Great to read that this morning.
Semper Fi
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Man! I tried to find a copy to read....$145 for a Paperback! I wasn't able to download in the couple PDF free websites for some reason. I don't want to read about him that bad, lol! The book shouldn’t be a problem to find through your local library, whether they have a copy or are able to find one through inter-library loan.
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You forget where I live PG...Salt lake Valley...not as "Conservative" as you would think. Some books I read from the Library back in '90 have been purged. I will make a stab at it, see what's out there, you guys have me curious now! Thanks for the Tip!
Last edited by Jim_Knight; 02/21/24.
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I was at the 1970 NRA Convention in New Orleans, saw Elmer, JOC and the Col.
I was at the entrance of the Hilton, which was the NRA Headquarters, saw the Col leaving the hotel, walking towards the French Quarter, alone at night. My thought, don't think I'd want to do that. Had I been closer, I'd have warned him, but he was too far ahead and I wasn't gonna run after him.
After learning more about him, reading "Unrepentant Sinner", I think he was OK. If the ghetto thugs wanted to get him, I think he'd have had them windrowed, lined up for the NOPD to sort out and toe tag. Don't ya know he was packing.
The area between the Quarter and the Hilton was dark, wasn't a good place to be walking at night, especially alone, unless you were Col. Askins. In that case, it would be more than OK.
DF I've read this same exact scenario before,except the star was Col. Rex Applegate. Must have been a popular walk way.... I find that interesting as well as Rex going to the trouble of acquiring and engraving Charley's famous Camp Perry pistol. What was Charley to Rex. Anyone know? Kinda makes one wonder who actually was the "star" as you noted, or maybe a wanna be? I don't know, but it is a tad curious. And, yeah that was a rather dark and scary late night walk, at least in my mind. But I wasn't Charley and I wasn't packing. Even if I was packing, think I'd have stayed at the Hilton, at least till morning. That walk, first thing in the morning, is a piece of cake. The perps aren't up yet. The Goblins come out at night. The more I've thought about it, Charley wasn't naïve, I think he knew what he was doing. His history of not only not avoiding a fight, but maybe even looking for one. Seems that was his nature and I don't think he was ever in a fight that he wasn't more than prepared for. So, guess we'll never know, can only speculate. DF
Last edited by Dirtfarmer; 02/21/24.
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Oh yeah! Have a hold on it in the "Interlibrary" somewhere in the dark web...must be as it is not in the State of Utah "at all". lol
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I think you will find the shootings mentioned in his book were not a problem in his time. Maybe some but times as they say were different. Shooting a fleeing felon was ok, running was a sign of guilt. I think it should be reversed, but it was changed during the 1960s and the black riots. Until then felons could be shot when running away.
If you have trouble with Charlie look into the 30s. Dellinger was shot in the back with out any warning. Frank Hamer's shooting of Bonnie and Clyde was a classic I think a thousand rounds were drill thorugh that vehicle. Look at it in the old photos. Now, wow.. "You can't serve papers on a rat, Baby sister. You got to kill 'em or leave him be." The only problem with that is the crooked lawyers can make money on a dead crook.
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I grew up around of bunch of hard men in SE Texas. They were oilfield workers mostly, and over half of them veterans of WW2, a few from Korea but lots of Nam vets. Come to think of it, almost everybody worked in some kind of oil industry related back then. I heard my dad talking with some men at the beer joints as a kid, as you can imagine I heard of all kinds of killings, etc. Was around all kinds of killers (many Cons) when I later worked in the oilfields. In fact, at times, I had to be prepared to be a killer! ha It was just a common fact back then (mid 60's to mid 80's) Its got to be bad before I call a man a killer in a derogative way, it quite possibly was justified but you rarely get all the facts. Just saying.
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