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I just noticed cci makes a 357 mag shot shell loaded with #4 shot…. I’ve only ever used the 38 version that has 8’s or 9’s. I’ve only shot gophers and beer cans with them, but do carry a few when I’m around rattle snakes….. would the 4’s be better or not enough shot to be an effective pattern?

Best way to find out is buy some and pattern them in your gun.

Unless you go down to #9, #10 or #11 shot in CCI shot capsules, there’s just not enough room for a lot of shot and those with #4 shot make your patterns pretty sparse. I don’t know what the #4 loads are for…

Only way to really know is to buy some and try 'em. I suspect you'll find patterns are pretty thin pretty quickly.

I looked up that load on the CCI website, they're showing 84 grains of #4 shot. A little calculating shows that to be right about 26 pellets.

Here's a patterning test I did some four years ago with CCI .38 Spl/357 Mag shot shells that are advertised as containing 135 pellets of #9 shot, 5 times more shot. Beyond five feet patterns get sparse very quickly. I'd stick with #9 and if you read further down in the thread some folks recommend making your own loads out of #12 shot.

.38 shotshell patterning

Never shot shotshells much in 357. I used to load mine in 44 mag for a 4" N frame or 4 5/8" SBH. Bigger the shot the patterns went way downhill. I preferred #10 and 11s if I could find them. Couldn't push them fast either. Light loads around 8.5 -9 grains of unique worked best in my experience. I've tried the factory CCI loads in 9mm and 45. Wasn't overly impressed with either

For the folks that have used or tested pistol ss on snakes it's the finer the better, hands down. # 10-12 preferred. Mike Venturino has tested & written an article or 3 on his findings.

The #4 shot is more of self defense type thing for 2 legged shakes.

IIRC that article also said to not try to load them to max

While I haven’t yet tested on game or vermin…..I’m using #8 shot in my 460 S&W. In my thoughts, it offers a decent compromise between pellet weight for penetration and pellet count for pattern density.

I actually use full-length 444 Marlin Mag. brass, slightly reduced the case neck to clear the cylinder throat, put a powder charge fir a 2 1/2” 410, insert a 410 gauge 2 1/2” plastic shot cup, pour in 1/2 oz of #8’s, invert a 44 caliber gas check over the shot, seal end with either wax or hot glue. Gives pretty decent shot patterns out to 20/25 feet.

I may drop the powder charge a bit, to see if patterns improve at longer ranges!

Really looking forward to testing them on rabbits or other small game. In a perfect world we’d have some snakes to test them on! 😉 me

I make cylinder length shotshells for my Ruger and S&W .44 mag pistols. I make these cases from .303 British rifle cases that I cut to a length just short of the length of my pistol cylinders, and file the thickness and diameter of the case rim to match .44 mag cases.

When fired, the straight wall rifle case fireforms to the inside of the .44 mag pistol cylinder and is a slight bottleneck. 40 some years ago when I first made these I got a ".44 shot size die" from RCBS to resize these cases.

To load these shells, I use 7 grains of Universal, a .410 shotshell wad cut 1/4" shorter, fill to the top with #8 shot, then cover with a top wad made from heavy paper cut with a large 3-hole paper punch, and seal the top with fingernail polish.

At 10 yds they have a pattern about the width of a 55 gal barrel, but at snake range of 6 ft they pretty well cover an aluminium can. I also sometimes use them to break Skeet station 8 high and low targets.

Darn impressive! However I’m really distraught……I thought that I was a creative genius when I came up with my 460 shot shell idea! I guess that now, I’ll be look’n for some .303 Brit brass! 😁 memtb

I have some .410 shotcups and over shot card wads and have plans to try making some shot loads for .41 magnum.

Sounds like a plan……..Good Luck! 👍 memtb

Good looking pattern, but probably too much work for my lazy butt. I tried cutting & necking down 444 Marlin brass but with cardboard under & over wad & a heavy roll crimp for 44 cyl. length shells. Finally pressed easy button with speer capsules & loading #10, a lot mor effective on rattlers than 8. A funny thing, a rattler won't twist & writhe with a good hit of 10 or 12. They just go limp. I have some now discontinued Rem 45 acp with 12 shot, instant kills.

Venturino mentions heavy powder charges blow the pattern apart, & it makes perfect sense. An old Speer manual I have has shot capsule data. Recommended loads are never heavy. Without looking, remember it might be like 7 gr. Unique in a 44 mag case.

I’ve got a box or two of the .45 ACP crimped loads Remington made about 20 years ago, #12 shot covers a sheet of paper thoroughly and they function in our 1911’s. Not for revolvers. We loaded the Speer capsules years ago with #11 for the .38 Spl. A manufacturer made some cups top and bottom for shot in .38 but I don’t recall who, they were flush with the case so didn’t hold much shot.

I’ve tried about all the factory loads, the .22 LR is pretty feeble unless you’re close. The .22 Magnum kills larger snakes better.

Another reason to own .45 Colt, larger case holds more shot.

Coincidentally, just yesterday I discovered the same thing. I looked for a place online to purchase some, but they were all out of stock. I guess they're popular.

I watched a YouTube video about it yesterday, and he patterned them, and they pattern just fine. Best patterns were achieved from short barreled handguns, perhaps because the shot has less time in contact with rifling.

I just used a CCI .38 Special shot load (not the #4) the other day for dispatching a sick chick. I used my old Colt Model 357. Very effective. Put the poor creature out of its suffering instantly.

No, companies make products that sell not something few will buy. Frankly i do not know what is more stupid concept .357 loaded with #4 or shotshell cartridges marketed to be used in autoloaders. The only rationale for birdshot handgun shells is for farmers or farmhands to use against snakes. S&W and Taurus produce revolvers for that purpose called Governor and Judge respectfully. Any avid outdoorsman using trails where poisenous snakes are common can buy snake boots, snake gators and or snake pants, problem solved.

I've shot several prairie rattlers with the Remington ACP #12's. The snakes just go limp, instant death.