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Joined: Dec 2012
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Campfire Tracker
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OP
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John (and anyone else with tested experience):
There are basically two opinions (and seemingly no real consensus) regarding the switch from common cup and core bullets to monolithics, with particular reference to bore cleaning.
1. Clean to bare metal when switching from C&C to monolithics; 2. Don't worry about it and just shoot.
When it comes to accuracy, have you (or anyone else) tested the two opinions in order to verify whether or not it makes any real difference? If you've already written about it, perhaps you can point me to an article or book chapter.
Thanks, as always.
Mike
"An archer sees how far he can be from a target and still hit it, a bowhunter sees how close he can get before he shoots." It is certainly easy to use that same line of thinking with firearms. -- Unknown
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Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 23,085
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 23,085 |
Have you tried it? Did they shoot as hoped/expected?
"You can lead a man to logic, but you cannot make him think." Joe Harz "Always certain, often right." Keith McCafferty
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Joined: Jul 2001
Posts: 60,105
Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
Joined: Jul 2001
Posts: 60,105 |
Mike,
I have tested it plenty. There was some truth to it with the early X-Bullets, because they usually fouled bores pretty, uh, solidly. But since the TSX and other grooved-shank bullets, both from Barnes and other manufacturers, I haven't seen much problem. A good example might be my Sisk 6.5 PRC, which I've used alternately with 127-grain LRXs and 129 Nosler Accubond Long-Range bullets. Groups very well with both without any cleaning, they shoot to the same point of impact.
John
“Montana seems to me to be what a small boy would think Texas is like from hearing Texans.” John Steinbeck
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Joined: Sep 2021
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Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
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MD, that has been my experience, too. I loaded some of the old Barnes X and the blue coated ones for a friend's 300 WBY way back when, and he got significant fouling from them.
I shoot a fair amount of modern monos now (Barnes TTSX and TAC-TC, Hornady MFX, a smattering of Lehighs and Hammers, and formerly some ETips as well, back before Nosler decided they were more valuable than gold) and never encountered issues with fouling or accuracy issues going back and forth between them, c&c, and cast in the same rifles. I work up and shoot both mono and traditional bullet loads for everything I have.
I'm not much of a bore scrubber, either. Usually I run a couple patches through them to clear the powder leftovers and call it a day.
TLDR summary... my answer is #2
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Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 14,488
Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 14,488 |
I'll just add that even where this is a problem, DBC seems to mitigate the effects.
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Joined: Jul 2001
Posts: 60,105
Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
Joined: Jul 2001
Posts: 60,105 |
My experience as well....
“Montana seems to me to be what a small boy would think Texas is like from hearing Texans.” John Steinbeck
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Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 7,423
Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
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I'll just add that even where this is a problem, DBC seems to mitigate the effects. 👆👆👆
You only live once, but...if you do it right, once is enough.
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Joined: Jul 2001
Posts: 60,105
Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
Joined: Jul 2001
Posts: 60,105 |
Though I will also add that the Lilja barrel on my 6.5 PRC has never been DBC'd. But Dan makes very smooth barrels....
“Montana seems to me to be what a small boy would think Texas is like from hearing Texans.” John Steinbeck
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Joined: Nov 2002
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Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 33,694 |
Have you tried it? Did they shoot as hoped/expected? The posts below answered his question without a round fired...
Conduct is the best proof of character.
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Nov 2013
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I shoot 95gr LRXs and NBTs interchangeably in my 6CM, different powders, but very nearly same POI and group sizes. I wipe out the bore at the end of the season and that’s it so far. Next time out, I’ll run the Garmin and see what I’m getting just for grins, but ignorance has been blissful so far.
What fresh Hell is this?
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Joined: Dec 2012
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Campfire Tracker
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OP
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Have you tried it? Did they shoot as hoped/expected? The posts below answered his question without a round fired... I'm hoping, so we shall see...
"An archer sees how far he can be from a target and still hit it, a bowhunter sees how close he can get before he shoots." It is certainly easy to use that same line of thinking with firearms. -- Unknown
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Joined: Aug 2022
Posts: 1,931
Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
Joined: Aug 2022
Posts: 1,931 |
I have been interchanging between Partitions, TTSX, and Federal TA in my .270 Winchester without any ill-affects.
"Full time night woman? I never could find no tracks on a woman's heart. I packed me a squaw for ten year, Pilgrim. Cheyenne, she were, and the meanest bitch that ever balled for beads."
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Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 860
Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
Joined: Aug 2006
Posts: 860 |
I use various bullets that would include Barnes and Hammer monos, never had any problems going from C&C bullets to the monos and back again. I clean the bore periodically but never do it because I'm switching bullets.
Last edited by John55; 03/25/24.
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Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 10,922
Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 10,922 |
While my experience falls far short of many here, I did start using the Barnes X Bullet in ‘91 in my rifle, and soon after in other rifles.
They indeed had a reputation for badly fouling bores, and accuracy seemed to suffer badly if the bore was not thoroughly cleaned from previously shooting cup and core bullets.
However, this didn’t seem to be a problem for my rifle……I strongly suspect that it was because it was a match grade barrel with a much better bore than conventional factory barrels. After realizing this, I began to hand lap all rifle bores that I planned to shoot the X Bullets in. I also convinced a friend to do likewise. While it didn’t make “target rifles” of the other rifles it reduced fouling and improved accuracy!
The newer productions from Barnes …..TSX, TTSX, and LRX (all grooved bullets) seem to have ended the fouling issues!
If fact, whether needed or not, after those experiences I now hand lap the bore of any new rifle we get….even did the bore on our 14” Contender! I figured that it couldn’t hurt! memtb
Last edited by memtb; 03/25/24.
You should not use a rifle that will kill an animal when everything goes right; you should use one that will do the job when everything goes wrong." -Bob Hagel
“I’d like to be a good rifleman…..but, I prefer to be a good hunter”! memtb 2024
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Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 37,100
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 37,100 |
Agree with those swapping between C&C and Mono's. Maybe with the older mono's, but with the newer ones, no problem, IME.
I've used CEB, Hammer, Barnes and various C&C's interchangeably without noticing a fouling issue.
Most of my barrels are DBC and don't seem to have problems with excessive fouling regardless of bullet type.
DF
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Joined: Apr 2003
Posts: 6,825
Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
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I give up… could someone decode and tell me what DBC is? thanks!
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Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 37,100
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 37,100 |
I give up… could someone decode and tell me what DBC is? thanks! Dyna Bore Coat. Works really well. Some say it's getting hard to find. I have a couple bottles in my shop fridge, not sure of the shelf life, but reportedly better if kept cool. DF
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Joined: Apr 2003
Posts: 6,825
Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
Joined: Apr 2003
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Joined: Apr 2003
Posts: 6,825
Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
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Next dumb question is where does one find this stuff?
I went to Midway, Midsouth, Graf, and Blue Collar and did a search without results. Thanks!
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Joined: Jul 2001
Posts: 60,105
Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
Joined: Jul 2001
Posts: 60,105 |
As has been mentioned recently on this forum, DBC is pretty much unavailable. But apparently one of the guys who developed it for Dyna-Tek, Chet Fish, is making and selling a similar product, under the Jen-Tek name, in Polson, Montana. Google it, but be aware there are two companies named Jen-Tek. The Montana company is the one you want to contact.
“Montana seems to me to be what a small boy would think Texas is like from hearing Texans.” John Steinbeck
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