Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Express Rifles and Big Bores Only info needed on the 416's

hi all, i was wondering about the 416 rem mag. and/or the 416 rigby. what kind of recoil step up are they compared to the 375 hh? i know they are more, but i don't have any real world experience or have anybody that has one to try out. i am able to handle full house loads from a 375 out of a 8lb. rifle no probs. also, what rifle should i look at? i have thought about a rem. 700 safari ks i could get used for 800.00 or a cz safari in the rigby. which rifle and caliber would you get?

I have never shot a 375, but everyone who tries my CZ 550 416 Rigby shoots it again. It does push, but my Vanguard in 300 Weatherby "kicked" harder.

Remember get it sighted in and then stand up or kneel to shoot it. You have to rock with it. Also, I shot a lot of cast bullets at about 1600 fps for a while to get used to it, and I believe the euro style stock is less abusive to the shooter because the rifle reciols up instead of back to some degree.

An 8 pound 375 probably feels much worse than the factory CZ 416.

skip the Rem KS (IMO). I refused delivery on two of these in 375 due to mfg defects. Unless their QC has improved radically since 2000 it's a poor value for the $$.

Go with the CZ.

In terms of recoil, the Rigby is well above the 375 H&H but very shootable (and more importantly VERY SCALABLE). You can load from light 375 level to 416 WBY level. My current hunt load is 102-104gr H4831 with 400 TSX. You can load down to low 90s with H4831 and down to the 50-60gr range with AA5744 for practice.

I personally like the 470 and 458 more than the 416 for recoil but I do shoot my rigby a fair amount.

my rec:

get the CZ, tune it up. then play with loads.

This past spring my buddy brought a ruger african in 416 rigby to bear camp. That rifle was nice and easy to shoot. I was real impressed. That being said, I went with the 416rem to be built on my 1917 win. Kinda kicking myself for not going with the rigby, but the rem will work.

I dont think the 416's are all that bad for recoil. My 338 knocked the snot out of me worse than the 416's or my Lott.

I like the push vs the slap any day of the week.

I shoot a 375 H&H ruger RSM and its a great gun. I Really want to add somthing bigger someday, and the 416 rem keeps calling my name.

Local shop has 2 of them in a model 700 (not the KS) they have had for quite some time. Really nice wood, barrel band swivel stud, etc. All set up for hunting. if interested, let me know and I will post info for contact.

I would go with the 416 rigby in the CZ. Mainly because of tradition. And you might consider ruger #1. If you'er not set on a bolt.

The 416 Remington won't give away much to a 416 Rigby performance wise. But the Remington brass will be about $1.50 cheaper each!

but at twice the pressure and half the case life!

I have a Ruger RSM in 416 Rigby and a 375 H&H in a Whitworth Mauser. The best way I can characterize the difference is shooting on the bench. My 375, with a good recoil pad, is no big deal off the bench, you can shoot a number of rounds off the bench and not be beat up. With the Rigby and 400 grain bullets at 2300-2400 the bench is much more challenging than the 375. I shoot only as many as I need to check zero, sitting as upright as possible. Then I go to off-hand, sticks, kneeling etc. It is just easier for me to handle the Rigby in those positions. I am in progress of installing a decellerator pad on my 416 to replace the hard rubber Ruger pad, that should help. I also shoot both with a Past Vest (field weight) as well. All that said, both are lots of fun to shoot.

As far as rifle selection don't shy away from some weight I am glad I have the weight of the Ruger in my Rigby, but I wouldn't need that much weight in the 375. I wouldn't hesitate to go with the CZ, from what I have seen they are a very good value, great starting place for a big-bore. I can also recommend the Ruger, don't have any first hand experience with the Remington.

Just my two cents, hope that helps.

Eric

Are you telling us the Rigby with a 400 to Max has under 30,000 C.U.P.? Isn't the Rigby cup more like in the low 40,000 C.U.P. range?

Because the Remington with a 400 to Max has a C.U.P. of 52,500.

being a little facetious there (but not too much)

"pressure issues" with the Rem are persistent -- and come from too many sources to dismiss outright.

The Rigby CAN be loaded to 54-55 CUP but almost never is. Loaded to equal velocities, the Rigby will usually come in about 12,000-14,000 CUP lower pressure than the Rem.

I'm eagerly awaiting JB's experiment this summer on the very subject!

and it really as been my experience that the cost of brass is a wash - the Rigby cases really do last significantly longer.

Well that may be interesting. But is it to sell the Rigby or get facts.

Here's my 416 Remington load

Bullet 400 Nos 90.0 Gr of RL19 Vel 2370 + or - C.U.P. 44500
You can verify the load data in Hodgdon 26th Edition.

I have a Sako in .375 and another in .416 Rem. I also have a Ruger M77 .416 Rigby which is quite heavey as it is one of the first made and has the heavey contour.

I don't find any of these rifles very punishing in the recoil and the .416's are not a quick recoil, they are more of a puch. The .375 isn't a quick slap either but maybe more so than the .416's but not as great of a 'push'.

Hornady now has .416 Rigby brass which are fairly resonable to shoot.

Yah I see that $26 and some chump change for 20 pieces.

Oh it's out of stock?

And also don't forget that the 416 Rigby is infinitely cooler than the Remington. Just like the 350 Chev is way cooler than the 5.4l Chev. Both do the same thing but the Rigby is much cooler.

Gentlemen, we don't buy Rigby Brass, we have Rigby Brass. Which is why it is out of stock.

Actually, it takes some dedicated shopping but brass can be found below retail. And, you can use the traditional approach by buying Hornady and Quality Cartridge loaded rounds, shoot them, and then you have brass. This is the way I got mine. Both companies products can be found at resonable prices considering the fact that your shooting an elephant gun.

We definately don't worry about the cost either or else we would still be shooting our 30-30 loaded with cast bullets.

The one advantage the Rigby has over the Remington, is that you can load the Rigby at or near the Weatherby velocities. With lighter bullets this makes it flatter shooting which is handy for large plains game, or large mountain game like elk.

We know for a fact that the animals don't know which 416 hit them. Rigby, Remington, Weatherby, Taylor, it really doesn't matter all that much.

Personally ... the best of the lot is the 416Taylor. Of the two choices above my first instinct if I carried the rifle a lot would be the Rem700 ... but tradition and the nicer shooter will be the CZ. Both will need work to make them 110% ultra relaible for their life.
Cheers...
Con

I have my hopes pinned on a 416 Ruger. Neck up the 375, its probably already been done by some one. HMM, I guess I need to start a new thread.