24hourcampfire.com
24hourcampfire.com
-->
Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
Hop To
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 34,231
Likes: 2
S
Campfire 'Bwana
OP Offline
Campfire 'Bwana
S
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 34,231
Likes: 2
After ISIS claimed responsibility for the attack on the Moscow Concert Hall killing 144+ people, Putin has begun rounding up Muslims and deporting their jihad asses out of Russian.


Give a man a fish and he eats for a day. Give a man a welfare check, a forty ounce malt liquor, a crack pipe, an Obama phone, free health insurance. and some Air Jordan's and he votes Democrat for a lifetime.

Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 10,010
B
Campfire Outfitter
Offline
Campfire Outfitter
B
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 10,010
He could probably get Biden to pay for their flights here.

Bb

Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 11,774
D
Campfire Outfitter
Online Content
Campfire Outfitter
D
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 11,774
The massacre in Russia sure has gone quiet since 3-4 days after it occurred.
I wonder what’s happening in the background.


NRA Patron
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 28,251
Likes: 6
J
Campfire Ranger
Offline
Campfire Ranger
J
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 28,251
Likes: 6
Minnesota will probably take them all.


It is irrelevant what you think. What matters is the TRUTH.
Joined: Oct 2013
Posts: 1,495
T
Campfire Regular
Offline
Campfire Regular
T
Joined: Oct 2013
Posts: 1,495
then Putler would take the southern border regions into war, which is something he cannot do. he has a hard time dealing with Ukraine.

https://americanmilitarynews.com/20...oncert-hall-attack-on-kyiv-and-the-west/

Why Putin is trying to pin the concert hall attack on Kyiv and the West

MARCH 31, 2024 RADIO FREE EUROPE/RADIO LIBERTY
This article was originally published by Radio Free Europe/Radio Liberty and is reprinted with permission.

In his first remarks following the assault on a concert hall outside Moscow on March 22, more than 18 hours after gunmen killed at least 139 people in the deadliest terror attack in Russia in 20 years, President Vladimir Putin made no mention of the extremist group Islamic State, which had already claimed responsibility.

He did mention Ukraine, however, stating that Kyiv had provided a “window” on the border between the two countries to enable the attackers to try to escape. He did not provide evidence.

In subsequent comments late on March 25, Putin said that “radical Islamists” had carried out the attack, for which the United States has said Islamic State-Khorasan, an affiliate of the extremist group Islamic State (IS), bore sole responsibility. But he also doubled down on intimations that Ukraine played a role — and also pointed a finger at the United States and the West.

Among other wording clearly meant to convey to Russians that Ukraine and the West were behind the attack, Putin said that the United States was “using every channel to try to convince its satellites and other countries…that there is supposedly no indication of involvement by Kyiv.” And he suggested that the attack was part of what he described as efforts by Ukraine, “carrying out the orders of its Western handlers,” to “sow panic” in Russia as Moscow’s forces make gains in the invasion of its neighbor.

Meanwhile, state-run media in Russia have avidly played up the idea that Ukraine and the West were behind the attack, as have senior officials and lawmakers. In a brief exchange posted on Telegram, a reporter asked Security Council Secretary and close Putin ally Nikolai Patrushev, “[IS] or Ukraine?” and Patrushev replied, “Of course, Ukraine.”

Placing blame abroad for things that happen in Russia — from terror attacks to peaceful opposition protests — is nothing new for Putin. He has been doing it since at least 2004, after the hostage crisis that left more than 330 people dead at a school in the southern town of Beslan, insinuating that Washington and the West were supporting Islamic militants in the North Caucasus in an effort to weaken Russia.

But the stakes this time may be particularly high: Putin has just secured a new six-year term in an election marred by evidence of wide-scale fraud, and his decision to launch an all-out invasion of Ukraine has led to a long, grueling war and hundreds of thousands of Russian casualties instead of the speedy subjugation of Kyiv that he apparently expected.

Here are some of the reasons Putin is pointing the finger at Kyiv and the West in the Crocus City Hall attack.

The Narrative
Since the start of the full-scale invasion in February 2022, Putin has tried to turn Russia into a country where a war footing is a matter of course, a fact of life, and to use it to tighten his grip on the country. His spokesman, Dmitry Peskov, recently called for “internal mobilization,” suggesting Russians should not just back the war outwardly but believe in it as something like a matter of faith — a striking suggestion given that, for most Russians, support for the war is passive and without personal enthusiasm.

Increasingly, Putin has sought to convince citizens that the country is fighting not a war of aggression against Ukraine but rather an existentially crucial defensive war in which Ukraine is just a tool in the hands of Washington and the West, which are bent on dominating or destroying Russia. This view is enforced through laws that the state has been using to silence Russians who criticize or question the war on Ukraine.

In that narrative, there’s little room for a deadly attack by Islamic extremists. The Crocus City Hall attack could suggest that Putin has taken his eye off threats that are more imminent, or more real, than those he says are posed by the West.

The ‘Failure’
Against that backdrop, suggesting the attack was ultimately the work of the West may be a bid to soften the blow, symbolic as it may be, from what Alexander Vershbow, a fellow at the Atlantic Council think tank and a former U.S. ambassador to Moscow, said was a “serious intelligence failure.”

Missing such a threat would be particularly hard to explain in light of the fact that earlier in March, the United States had warned Russia of intelligence indicating extremists had “imminent plans” for an attack — and the fact that Putin, three days before it happened, had publicly dismissed the warning as a “provocative” effort “to intimidate and destabilize our society.”

So one motive for suggesting that the United States may have had a role in the attack could have been to fit the U.S. warning — which came ahead of the March 15-17 presidential election — into the broader narrative of a war in which Russia’s adversaries would stop at nothing to get the upper hand.

Ukraine has denied any role in the attack, and U.S. National Security Council spokeswoman Adrienne Watson said on March 24 that there was “no Ukrainian involvement whatsoever.”

The Dilemma
While there’s no visible evidence of a connection with Ukraine, there is an apparent link with Central Asia: Russian authorities have detained at least 11 people and ordered eight of them held in pretrial detention, including four citizens of Tajikistan who are accused of carrying out the shooting.

Because Russia relies substantially on labor migrants from Tajikistan and other Central Asian countries, the identity of the alleged suspects poses “a serious policy dilemma” for Putin, said Mark Galeotti, an analyst of Russian politics and security issues.

“If he says, ‘Yes, this was Islamic State, operating through the medium of Central Asian residents and guest workers,’ then, firstly, it aggravates racial tensions, which actually is a problematic issue in a multiethnic, multi-confessional state like the Russian Federation where 10 percent of the population is Muslim. But it also actually then begs the question: What are you going to do about it?

“The inevitable corollary would be some kind of crackdown on Central Asians, which as we know from past experience would be handled in a fairly thuggish and insensitive way,” he said. “At the moment, Russia cannot afford to alienate and drive out these Central Asian workers — it needs them…. Between the impact of the war and the need to have the defense factories running at full pelt, there is actually a shortage of labor.”

The attack has worsened ethnic tensions, and the public display of graphic footage appearing to show Russian security officers abusing the detainees could be designed to slake any thirst for revenge. But Putin may be hoping to avoid broad steps such as placing heavier restrictions on entry to Russia for citizens of Tajikistan and its neighbors, Galeotti said, because it would “damage the Russian economy and damage Russia’s standing with its crucial Central Asian allies.”


"Russia sucks."
---- Me, US Army (retired) 12B & 51B

Russian Admiral said, after the Moskva sank, "we have the world's worst navy but we aren't as bad as our army".

IC B2

Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 1,110
L
Campfire Regular
Offline
Campfire Regular
L
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 1,110
Originally Posted by tdoyka
then Putler would take the southern border regions into war, which is something he cannot do. he has a hard time dealing with Ukraine.

https://americanmilitarynews.com/20...oncert-hall-attack-on-kyiv-and-the-west/

Why Putin is trying to pin the concert hall attack on Kyiv and the West

MARCH 31, 2024 RADIO FREE EUROPE/RADIO LIBERTY
This article was originally published by Radio Free Europe/Radio Liberty and is reprinted with permission.

In his first remarks following the assault on a concert hall outside Moscow on March 22, more than 18 hours after gunmen killed at least 139 people in the deadliest terror attack in Russia in 20 years, President Vladimir Putin made no mention of the extremist group Islamic State, which had already claimed responsibility.

He did mention Ukraine, however, stating that Kyiv had provided a “window” on the border between the two countries to enable the attackers to try to escape. He did not provide evidence.

In subsequent comments late on March 25, Putin said that “radical Islamists” had carried out the attack, for which the United States has said Islamic State-Khorasan, an affiliate of the extremist group Islamic State (IS), bore sole responsibility. But he also doubled down on intimations that Ukraine played a role — and also pointed a finger at the United States and the West.

Among other wording clearly meant to convey to Russians that Ukraine and the West were behind the attack, Putin said that the United States was “using every channel to try to convince its satellites and other countries…that there is supposedly no indication of involvement by Kyiv.” And he suggested that the attack was part of what he described as efforts by Ukraine, “carrying out the orders of its Western handlers,” to “sow panic” in Russia as Moscow’s forces make gains in the invasion of its neighbor.

Meanwhile, state-run media in Russia have avidly played up the idea that Ukraine and the West were behind the attack, as have senior officials and lawmakers. In a brief exchange posted on Telegram, a reporter asked Security Council Secretary and close Putin ally Nikolai Patrushev, “[IS] or Ukraine?” and Patrushev replied, “Of course, Ukraine.”

Placing blame abroad for things that happen in Russia — from terror attacks to peaceful opposition protests — is nothing new for Putin. He has been doing it since at least 2004, after the hostage crisis that left more than 330 people dead at a school in the southern town of Beslan, insinuating that Washington and the West were supporting Islamic militants in the North Caucasus in an effort to weaken Russia.

But the stakes this time may be particularly high: Putin has just secured a new six-year term in an election marred by evidence of wide-scale fraud, and his decision to launch an all-out invasion of Ukraine has led to a long, grueling war and hundreds of thousands of Russian casualties instead of the speedy subjugation of Kyiv that he apparently expected.

Here are some of the reasons Putin is pointing the finger at Kyiv and the West in the Crocus City Hall attack.

The Narrative
Since the start of the full-scale invasion in February 2022, Putin has tried to turn Russia into a country where a war footing is a matter of course, a fact of life, and to use it to tighten his grip on the country. His spokesman, Dmitry Peskov, recently called for “internal mobilization,” suggesting Russians should not just back the war outwardly but believe in it as something like a matter of faith — a striking suggestion given that, for most Russians, support for the war is passive and without personal enthusiasm.

Increasingly, Putin has sought to convince citizens that the country is fighting not a war of aggression against Ukraine but rather an existentially crucial defensive war in which Ukraine is just a tool in the hands of Washington and the West, which are bent on dominating or destroying Russia. This view is enforced through laws that the state has been using to silence Russians who criticize or question the war on Ukraine.

In that narrative, there’s little room for a deadly attack by Islamic extremists. The Crocus City Hall attack could suggest that Putin has taken his eye off threats that are more imminent, or more real, than those he says are posed by the West.

The ‘Failure’
Against that backdrop, suggesting the attack was ultimately the work of the West may be a bid to soften the blow, symbolic as it may be, from what Alexander Vershbow, a fellow at the Atlantic Council think tank and a former U.S. ambassador to Moscow, said was a “serious intelligence failure.”

Missing such a threat would be particularly hard to explain in light of the fact that earlier in March, the United States had warned Russia of intelligence indicating extremists had “imminent plans” for an attack — and the fact that Putin, three days before it happened, had publicly dismissed the warning as a “provocative” effort “to intimidate and destabilize our society.”

So one motive for suggesting that the United States may have had a role in the attack could have been to fit the U.S. warning — which came ahead of the March 15-17 presidential election — into the broader narrative of a war in which Russia’s adversaries would stop at nothing to get the upper hand.

Ukraine has denied any role in the attack, and U.S. National Security Council spokeswoman Adrienne Watson said on March 24 that there was “no Ukrainian involvement whatsoever.”

The Dilemma
While there’s no visible evidence of a connection with Ukraine, there is an apparent link with Central Asia: Russian authorities have detained at least 11 people and ordered eight of them held in pretrial detention, including four citizens of Tajikistan who are accused of carrying out the shooting.

Because Russia relies substantially on labor migrants from Tajikistan and other Central Asian countries, the identity of the alleged suspects poses “a serious policy dilemma” for Putin, said Mark Galeotti, an analyst of Russian politics and security issues.

“If he says, ‘Yes, this was Islamic State, operating through the medium of Central Asian residents and guest workers,’ then, firstly, it aggravates racial tensions, which actually is a problematic issue in a multiethnic, multi-confessional state like the Russian Federation where 10 percent of the population is Muslim. But it also actually then begs the question: What are you going to do about it?

“The inevitable corollary would be some kind of crackdown on Central Asians, which as we know from past experience would be handled in a fairly thuggish and insensitive way,” he said. “At the moment, Russia cannot afford to alienate and drive out these Central Asian workers — it needs them…. Between the impact of the war and the need to have the defense factories running at full pelt, there is actually a shortage of labor.”

The attack has worsened ethnic tensions, and the public display of graphic footage appearing to show Russian security officers abusing the detainees could be designed to slake any thirst for revenge. But Putin may be hoping to avoid broad steps such as placing heavier restrictions on entry to Russia for citizens of Tajikistan and its neighbors, Galeotti said, because it would “damage the Russian economy and damage Russia’s standing with its crucial Central Asian allies.”


Sure sounds familiar to our situation here in the good 'ol USA...

"Coddling" the bad guys sure has not been a winning strategy for Biden and his crew. Playing both sides of the fence isn't working either as we now see in the Middle East. Finally, being dependant on migrant workers in general has its own set of issues and that one is kind of on all of us... the "American Dream" has kind of softened all of us relative to our forefathers who sacrificed in so many ways to get us here.

The other end of the extreme as to dealing with this problem is not good either. It is tough to deal with religious radical extremists who value "martyrdom" more than life... try to just make examples of the perpetrators for their deeds and someone will always be there to fill their shoes! Cultures collide... no good answers anymore.

It will be interesting to see if Putin can be more successful than we have been. Funny that we can have so much at stake and in common with the Ruskies and yet cannot seem to get along. Another example of Trump's wisdom??? Imagine that!


Moderated by  RickBin 

Link Copied to Clipboard
AX24

489 members (1234, 12344mag, 10gaugeman, 160user, 17CalFan, 10ring1, 37 invisible), 2,158 guests, and 1,136 robots.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Forum Statistics
Forums81
Topics1,192,125
Posts18,483,808
Members73,966
Most Online11,491
Jul 7th, 2023


 


Fish & Game Departments | Solunar Tables | Mission Statement | Privacy Policy | Contact Us | DMCA
Hunting | Fishing | Camping | Backpacking | Reloading | Campfire Forums | Gear Shop
Copyright © 2000-2024 24hourcampfire.com, Inc. All Rights Reserved.



Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.7.5
(Release build 20201027)
Responsive Width:

PHP: 7.3.33 Page Time: 0.192s Queries: 26 (0.004s) Memory: 0.8319 MB (Peak: 0.8781 MB) Data Comp: Zlib Server Time: 2024-05-02 12:25:24 UTC
Valid HTML 5 and Valid CSS