Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Hunter's Campfire New Russian Fighter We Simply Cannot Compete With...yet

Rocky
The name Magnet Ass remind you of anybody?

Yeah Foxbat..I may have screwed that story up a tad I heard it a long time ago.
I thot it was a Berlin checkpoint put your prolly right. Apparently they drove quite a ways with the winder's ass sticking like 3 feet out the the rear side window and no one even batted an eye till they got to the crossing.

Well, I guess it is a good thing that the Sukhoi can only do airshow maneuvers and that they don't teach Russian pilots about conserving energy and all that good stuff. Obviously, some half trained dune coon in broke dick Mig is a more worthy opponent.

I enjoy getting to read about the experiences of the jet drivers on this site.
Very interesting!




Oh yeah-
And the prop pilots too, Rocky!

Perhaps someone covered the original Soviet acqusition of a Sidewinder in 1958, but if not I'll inculude it here.

A Sidewinder (AIM-9B) was fired by a Taiwanese F-86 Sabrejet. The missle struck its target, a Chinese MiG 17, and did not explode, but lodged in the fuselage. The missle was turned over to the Soviets who copied it. Several advancements and updatings later it is now the Atoll AA-2 air-to-air missle.

** Pucara of FAA Grupo 3 shot down near Darwin by Cmdr Ward RN in one of three Sea Harriers of No.801 NAS using 30mm cannon (12.10 pm). Major Tomba ejected.

**A-4Q Skyhawk of CANA 3 Esc also shot down near Swan Island in Falkland Sound in same incident by Flt Lt Leeming RAF in No.800 Sea Harrier using 30mm cannon (3.12 pm). Lt Marquez was killed.

Well they did get a few gun kills..but as jorge said all the Mirages were aim-9L.
The Aim-9L came as a nasty surprise to the Argies as jorge or pugs will tell you.
The viffing thing was a bit of a red herring I think..somewhat like the Su's flying displays.
As far as I know they did not use it in actual combat or at least not that they admit.

DJS
Thanx for that story..well thats one way to collect intel..but I'll pass on that honour!

This is really an enjoyable thread. My thanks to those who have responded.

May I ask a question,

There are those here who fly and have flown different types of military aircraft.

What worst case combat scenario and non-comabat scenario would send your pucker factor off the charts.

I've heard it said a Navy pilot's heartbeat on a stormy night carrier landing is as much as being in a close dogfight.
Any truth to that?

Further to.. Djs.. post re the Soviets stealing the Winders technology.

According to Ron Westrum in his book "Sidewinder", the Soviets obtained the plans for Sidewinder from a Swedish Colonel, Stig Wennerstr�m, and rushed their version into service by 1961 copying it so closely that even the parts numbers were duplicated. Years later, Soviet engineers would admit that the captured Sidewinder served as a "university course" in missile design and substantially improved Soviet and allied air-to-air capabilities

Why would anybody think stalling and wallowing all over the air is a good characteristic? You take a muti-million dollar piece of eqpmt and turn it into a Cessna 150....Wonderful intelligence.

Mike

Interesting thread to be sure.

That guy may be the baddest dude to ever strap on a jet for all I know. The point is he won't be using any of that airshow fluff in combat if he wants to stay alive.

I'm basing what I tell you on alot of hours flying front line fighters against other front line fighters flown by pilots from 10 or so countries. (None of which are from the middle east)
It amazes me that someone can watch a 30 second youtube clip and become an expert on air to air in modern fighters. The govt wasted many millions doing it the hard way on me.

Jeff

Missing the "Cold War" are we? Anybody who knows anything about the technologies the US and the Russians have esp. when it comes to aircraft know this is thread is BS.

I understand that a lot the airshow stuff won't work. But airshow stuff is meant to display the capabilities of an aircraft. Those Russian aircraft display extreme maneuverability. Are you saying that such maneuverability is not useful in a up close situation? And if you are, then why do the latest American designs have thrust vectoring?

Noncombat:

We had one of our birds shot out of the sky courtesy of our own Navy while we were TDY to play war games with the Saratoga back in 86. RF-4C had just come off the tanker and got jumped by a Tomcat (might have been a Hornet, memory fades) Tomcat thought he had dummy sidewinders but actually had live. Tomcat driver quickly called for them to bail immediately after firing which they both did just before the Rhino took one up the exhaust fully laden with JP-4. Crew survived though the wisso broke his arm.

Back in the day, it would take a lot to surprise you on the German autobahns. Wasn't unusual to be driving next to an M-1 or a Pershing or a GLCM launcher on the autobahn.

Someone probably thought the sidewinder was a Fasching joke.

I spent last summer trying to teach Indian's how to fly. I had one student that was a Mechanical Engineer so he said, he could not add and subtract multiply and divide. Simple weight and balance problem. And I am suppose to sit here a shake in my boots about the Indians and the Chinese, a friend was teaching the chinese same dam drill. Way back when the said the F-15 was to expensive. Well they always say that about the Weapons the US Developes and deploys. Nothing new, Peyor Usemsev the phyicist that that wrote the paper that became the Rosseta Stone for Steath, Teaches at Cal Tech and works for Lockeed. The Russians were always top rate in the hard things like Medicine Physics and the like stuff. But they are more good simple nuts and bolts kind of guys, we will never go to war with them, they are friends of ours in more ways than one. As for the Chinese well, First thing you do is, take out the "Three Gorges" A B-2 say a flight of four with some stand off weapons and well the footings are gone and a third of the country is flooded and well I may not be the quickest light blub in the room, but it would be a major problem for them, take out a good chunk of the industrial output with one strike. As for rifles and small arm's well the guns have gone as far as they are going to go as we know them to be. They are not spending a whole lot of R+D on it because they don't know what direction to go in.

I don't think that just because we are in a little shooting war with Iran, via Iraq and Afganistan, means that we are asleep at the light switch, not by a long shot. Its the toys we don't even know about.

Hey
ALL of you have beat this thread all to Hell. For those that think this airshow skit will blow anything out of the air that we have will still believe in santa. I have seen the junk that ruskies and third world wantabe nations have and the Idiots that fly them and that is scary. USA has the best aircraft, avionics, construction methods hands down. We set the pace, we raise the bar, we flat out kick but when it comes to aerospace. I teach this stuff and why in the hell does the foreign people want to train their pilot and mechanics with us??? Dah!! If it wasnt for the USA and our technology the rest of the world would still be looking up an animals hind end as they travel. The only thing the ruskies did right is to invent the AK47.
my.02 and 36 years of Aviation experiance
Bearbeater

I have seen the F-22 fly many times and it is brutal---you would not believe what it will do when it is performing a demonstration----kind of makes the video of the Russian AC look silly. I will look for it tomorrow and see if someone can post it!

BTW the most advanced aircraft that would be in service today with respect to RAM/RAS would have been the A-12(Very Long Story about why Cheney terminated it). On the radar screen made the F-117 look like a buzzard compared to a hummingbird. The smallest signature by orders of magnitude of any manned aircraft.

Busa,

Are you talking about the Dorito?