24hourcampfire.com
24hourcampfire.com
-->
Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
Hop To
Page 16 of 20 1 2 14 15 16 17 18 19 20
Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 18,485
Campfire Ranger
Offline
Campfire Ranger
Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 18,485
Originally Posted by Qtip
"Remember the moronic look on his face when he first learned of the 9/11 attacks?"

To the best of my memory when George Bush was informed of the attacks(saw a clip on TV) he was sitting in on a grammar school class and gave all the appearance of a man trying to hold back a river of tears. For you to call that "a moronic look" releases me from any guilt in refering to you as a sub-human organism. The more you post the more your true colors come out. Maybe I let my emotions take sway too often but when YOU are the one that demands honest discussion and then makes statements like that it just strenghtens my opinion of your reason for being here and any regrets I may have had for flying off the handle just went out the window. You are a zero, and that's about the kindest thing I can say about you at this time. I'm done wasting PC time with you and your ilk. You really remind me of a guy named Frostbite.

Qtip
Soli Deo Gloria!


My, my...lots of indignant blathering going on here...YAWN. Obviously our perceptions of this event are quite different. He sat there with that moronic look on his face for, what, 17 minutes? And did absolutely nothing! Such a huge tragedy for America, and 'our leader' was at a complete loss. More insults from you, as opposed to just being critical of the post itself...'how original'...and 'what a surprise'.


Every day on this side of the ground is a win.
GB1

Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 18,485
Campfire Ranger
Offline
Campfire Ranger
Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 18,485
Originally Posted by Ethan Edwards
Antlers, welcome to the fire. I apologize for some of the moronic insults you have endured here already. Most of the forums here are very polite and informative. You just happened to step into a political discussion where you were outnumbered. I had stuff to do today and long ago I quit letting internet pisssing matches pull me in to the point that I neglected business. At any rate, I agreed with a lot of what you said in the first twenty or so pages that I read before deciding I didn't have time to catch up. Please don't let a few here drive you off. There are plenty of posters here who share your disdain for big government/big business and the stranglehold it has on our fair country.

Be advised that most of these old boys are fairly decent on the other forums. They just step into some phonebooth somewhere when they see a political thread and wallah! Suddenly they emerge as Super Assclown, defender of all that is big business and big government. Of course some of them are just in love with Bush and that's as far as it goes. laugh

At any rate...party on.


I appreciate your thoughtful and well stated post. And I agree with what you are saying. Politics and religion are Pandora's Boxes...probably better left alone...but rarely are. Emotions run high on these topics...from BOTH sides.


Every day on this side of the ground is a win.
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 48,411
Campfire 'Bwana
Offline
Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 48,411
Antlers, when you make the day shift there at Blockbuster, I'll maybe care about your opinions on world leaders and their facial expressions. Because, I'm sure, you've accomplished so much.


Proudly representing oil companies, defense contractors, and firearms manufacturers since 1980. Because merchants of death need lawyers, too.
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 48,411
Campfire 'Bwana
Offline
Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 48,411
Fly....no, I wasn't. As I said earlier, the government shouldn't be in the business of subsidizing failure. Or protecting favored groups from economic reality.

Deposit insurance is paid for by member banks, not by taxpayers. That system was overpowered by the massive failures of the 80s.


Proudly representing oil companies, defense contractors, and firearms manufacturers since 1980. Because merchants of death need lawyers, too.
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 48,411
Campfire 'Bwana
Offline
Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 48,411
Originally Posted by Ethan Edwards
Dude, this is a family site. It just ain't the place for such like that. frown


I threw up a little in my mouth when I saw it. wink


Proudly representing oil companies, defense contractors, and firearms manufacturers since 1980. Because merchants of death need lawyers, too.
IC B2

Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 18,485
Campfire Ranger
Offline
Campfire Ranger
Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 18,485
Originally Posted by nemesis
Originally Posted by Ethan Edwards
Antlers, welcome to the fire. I apologize for some of the moronic insults you have endured here already. Most of the forums here are very polite and informative. You just happened to step into a political discussion where you were outnumbered. I had stuff to do today and long ago I quit letting internet pisssing matches pull me in to the point that I neglected business. At any rate, I agreed with a lot of what you said in the first twenty or so pages that I read before deciding I didn't have time to catch up. Please don't let a few here drive you off. There are plenty of posters here who share your disdain for big government/big business and the stranglehold it has on our fair country.
Be advised that most of these old boys are fairly decent on the other forums. They just step into some phonebooth somewhere when they see a political thread and wallah! Suddenly they emerge as Super Assclown, defender of all that is big business and big government. Of course some of them are just in love with Bush and that's as far as it goes. laugh

At any rate...party on.


Mr. Allen,

I have no idea what your credentials are, but I think I can fairly say that reading comprehension is not one of your strongest suits.

Throughout all of his venomous, hateful and completely unfounded rantings about the President of the United States, Mr. Antlers rarely indicated a (as you put it) "disdain for big government/big business."

Had this been his central premise, I'm confident that both he and his opinions would have been treated respectfully by most of the contributors on this site.

May I remind you that Mr. Antlers initial reply on this thread (shown below)was nothing more than a regurgitation of the Code Pink/Cindy Sheehan talking points and was responded to as such by some of the more astute members of the Campfire forum.

Now Mr.Allen will you please enlighten us with regard to what YOU "agreed with" in the following remarks by Mr. Antlers?


Mr. Antlers speaking:

"With all due respect, ALL politicians are worthless, self-serving rat bastards. But one thing is certain, in my opinion...our LYING president has led our country into a war for oil which profits ultra-wealthy robber barrons and corporate kingpins so they can live lives of opulent luxury, and leave the wealth to their children, tax free, so their lives too can be one of sickening narcissism...all at the expense of the people of our country, and the blood of our soldiers. We have spent nearly a TRILLION dollars on this war that has made our citizens NO SAFER from terrorists; a war that has probably killed over a hundred thousand people. It was misrepresented from the beginning, and has only 'riled up' the radical muslims even more. Life in Iraq is worse now, not better, than before. We survived a sneak attack, mobilized for war, and WON the war against our enemies in World War II in less time than we have been in Iraq.
This 'conservative' president took a fiscal surplus, that was left to him by a 'liberal' president, and has spent more money than any administration in history. He has widened the gap between the 'haves' and 'have nots' more than at any time in our history, except during the 'Great Depression'. He has rewarded those that contributed so much to his campain coffers (Big Oil), and we have seen oil go from $12 dollars a barrel...to over $130 dollars a barrel during his terms. Our economy is so far in the tank because of him, and his administration, that people are now having to decide between heating/cooling their homes and buying gasoline so they can drive to work...or, instead, buying food and medicine for their families. Before this president Bush, much of the world admired America and aspired to much of what it represented...now, after 5 years of death, destruction, and occupation in Iraq, and his disasterous fiscal and foreign policies in general...he will go down as one of the worst presidents, if not 'the worst', in our history. The legacy of the current Bush is no different than the legacy of organized crime. A country that was run by, and ruined by, corporations, special interests, and money...that's his legacy."





I know this post wasn't directed at me, but since you mentioned me, I will respond accordingly. "A country that was run by, and ruined by, CORPORATIONS, special interests, and money...that's his legacy". And "he has rewarded those that contributed so much to his campaign coffers (Big Oil) and we have seen oil go from $12 dollars a barrel...to over $130 dollars a barrel during his terms". And 'you' criticize someone else for 'their' reading comprehension? No...that's not a "disdain" for big business at all...is it? "Venemous, hateful"? You've just described many of the reasponses that I've received from my posts. "Completely unfounded rantings"...well 'you' sure haven't disproven anything that I've said...that's for sure...and neither has anyone else here.


Every day on this side of the ground is a win.
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 48,411
Campfire 'Bwana
Offline
Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 48,411
Will, do you have a cite for this, because you're the first person I've heard make that claim, and if it had any substance I would think it would be shouted from the mountaintops by the MSM....who have had a hard time ignoring years of unprecedented low unemployment......so how about a real world cite for this statement, compadre?

"We have had 'historically low' unemployment rates since they last changed the way unemployment was calculated under the Clinton administration. Right now we are running a little over 12% unemployment if you use the 'historical method', which is not a 'historically low' number."


Proudly representing oil companies, defense contractors, and firearms manufacturers since 1980. Because merchants of death need lawyers, too.
Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 18,485
Campfire Ranger
Offline
Campfire Ranger
Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 18,485
Originally Posted by Steve_NO
Antlers, when you make the day shift there at Blockbuster, I'll maybe care about your opinions on world leaders and their facial expressions. Because, I'm sure, you've accomplished so much.


Do 'you' have ANYTHING substantive to add to discussions with me? Or are personal insults and attacks directed at me the 'best' that 'you' can do?


Every day on this side of the ground is a win.
Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 7,906
Campfire Outfitter
Online Confused
Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 7,906
antlers is a Homo lalalalalala smile best i can do frown


GOA
Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 5,687
Campfire Tracker
Offline
Campfire Tracker
Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 5,687
Originally Posted by Steve_NO
Will, do you have a cite for this, because you're the first person I've heard make that claim, and if it had any substance I would think it would be shouted from the mountaintops by the MSM....who have had a hard time ignoring years of unprecedented low unemployment......so how about a real world cite for this statement, compadre?



Sure why not. It isn't like it is a big secret or anything.

The change was made in 1994. The change has been adhered to since that time. Shadowstats.com has made a living out of following the original calculations versus the changes made since that time. While the numbers they put out are not without some level of controversy, they are generally believed by most economists to be in the ball park.

Even by BLS's broadest number of unemployed we are at around 9%. And this is after the change in 94 to the number of discouraged workers.

http://www.shadowstats.com/article/54

QUOTE: Up until the Clinton administration, a discouraged worker was one who was willing, able and ready to work but had given up looking because there were no jobs to be had. The Clinton administration dismissed to the non-reporting netherworld about five million discouraged workers who had been so categorized for more than a year. As of July 2004, the less-than-a-year discouraged workers total 504,000. Adding in the netherworld takes the unemployment rate up to about 12.5%.
END QUOTE

CPI, inflation, was also changed under the Clinton administration. A change was made as of January to the seasonal adjustment made to CPI. Kind of fits don't it?

I mean you didn't actually believe that Q1 2008 had the lowest core inflation of any Q1 in the last 5 years? Did you?

The fact that these changes have been made to the calculation procedure is not debatable. Neither is the fact these changes paint a far rosier picture than is warranted. You may argue, as some economists do, that the shadowstats numbers slightly exaggerate them. But not by a lot. Like I said, they are generally believed to be 'in the ballpark'.

Will

EDIT: I should add that a previous change in the unemployment calculation was made in 1983 at the behest of the Reagan administration. One of the changes was to count military personnel as 'employed' rather than leaving them out completely. This helped to juice the numbers as well.


Smellin' a lot of 'if' coming off this plan.
IC B3

Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 13,234
T
Campfire Outfitter
Offline
Campfire Outfitter
T
Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 13,234

This is a pretty good thread.

It would be a better thread if some of you guys - and you know who you are - would stop feeding the troll.

- Tom

Joined: May 2003
Posts: 48,411
Campfire 'Bwana
Offline
Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 48,411
If the change was made in 94, that means Bush's boom has had lower unemployment rates than Clinton's...measured by the same standards. Right?

The rest of that article, much as I like Walter Williams, is basically pulled directly out of...well, thin air. The netherworld, by definition, is unknown. And do we count the millions employed illegally, or in the crime business?

Comparing apples with apples, the rate is lower than during the late 90s, when everybody was raving about the wonderful economy. You can use whatever index blows up your skirt, but I'll stick to the standard one that economists and the media use.....with all due respect to you and Walter.


Proudly representing oil companies, defense contractors, and firearms manufacturers since 1980. Because merchants of death need lawyers, too.
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 48,411
Campfire 'Bwana
Offline
Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 48,411
EDIT: I should add that a previous change in the unemployment calculation was made in 1983 at the behest of the Reagan administration. One of the changes was to count military personnel as 'employed' rather than leaving them out completely. This helped to juice the numbers as well.

Will, I remember when that was done. Since they are, demonstrably, employed...that change seemed then and still does now to more accurately reflect the economic situation. Don't you agree? I mean it does reflect a higher number, but isn't it a more reflective number of the real situation? Seems to me it is.


Proudly representing oil companies, defense contractors, and firearms manufacturers since 1980. Because merchants of death need lawyers, too.
Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 5,687
Campfire Tracker
Offline
Campfire Tracker
Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 5,687
Well unemployment flirted with 4% under this new method when Clinton was experiencing his 'boom'. So we have remained a tad over this during the Bush 'boom'.

But comparing Bush to Clinton is one thing. Comparing Bush to anyone before Clinton is impossible because of the change to the calc method. Which is exactly what so many Bush backers like Larry Kudlow do. Even when he knows damned well that it is an apples oranges calc.

Same with CPI. It has been defined away.

Will


Smellin' a lot of 'if' coming off this plan.
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 48,411
Campfire 'Bwana
Offline
Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 48,411
Originally Posted by antlers
Originally Posted by Steve_NO
Antlers, when you make the day shift there at Blockbuster, I'll maybe care about your opinions on world leaders and their facial expressions. Because, I'm sure, you've accomplished so much.


Do 'you' have ANYTHING substantive to add to discussions with me? Or are personal insults and attacks directed at me the 'best' that 'you' can do?


Its all you get, kid, unless you got something better than recycled MoveOn Code Pink quotes.


Proudly representing oil companies, defense contractors, and firearms manufacturers since 1980. Because merchants of death need lawyers, too.
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 48,411
Campfire 'Bwana
Offline
Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 48,411
CPI calculations make my head hurt, let's don't go there. wink


Proudly representing oil companies, defense contractors, and firearms manufacturers since 1980. Because merchants of death need lawyers, too.
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 48,411
Campfire 'Bwana
Offline
Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 48,411
Will, this site looks to be right up your alley....mostly beyond me. You may already have it:

http://www.nowandfutures.com/index.html

they recreate some of the old indices, and have lots of historical data, current financials, etc. Pretty dedicated doom'n'gloomers too.....you'll love the Weimar Germany comparisons wink

Last edited by Steve_NO; 06/03/08.

Proudly representing oil companies, defense contractors, and firearms manufacturers since 1980. Because merchants of death need lawyers, too.
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 48,411
Campfire 'Bwana
Offline
Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 48,411
attached chart....bar graph scale distorts difference....shows Bush average rate slightly lower than Clinton but not by a whole lot. The difference, of course, is how the media covered it. Bush's performance was either ignored, or caveated with "but experts say" and then downplayed. Clinton's was cited as evidence of the man's genius, and a reason to overlook his other, uh, issues.

http://gatewaypundit.blogspot.com/2008/01/bush-unemployment-at-50-bad-clinton.html


Proudly representing oil companies, defense contractors, and firearms manufacturers since 1980. Because merchants of death need lawyers, too.
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 3,119
Campfire Tracker
Offline
Campfire Tracker
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 3,119
Was out of town yesterday and missed some of this fun.

For the "W" detractors I offer this reminder. All the "good" legislation that bubba signed off on, (reluctantly), was initiated by the Republican Congress. He gets credit for it only because of his position, certainly not his brains or politics.

Bubba also held sway over the biggest loss in the history of the NASDAQ after he and "butch" Reno attacked Microsoft and the technology industry. "W" did not lie, (as in a klintoon, lie), but was as ill-informed as everyone else, by the raggedy remnants of the prior Dem administration who were still holding their misbegotten positions.

You can try to twist history but you cannot change the TRUTH.


[Linked Image]
Joined: May 2007
Posts: 3,945
Campfire Tracker
Offline
Campfire Tracker
Joined: May 2007
Posts: 3,945

And don't forget that Bubba did what he could to advance the cause of sodomy in the military making us safer I'm sure. Don't ask.....

Phase Two is in the works open homosexuality in the military is a given with a deomocrat in the white house and their support in congress,Barney Franks is thrilled.

Maybe soon the VA will provide much needed sex change therapy to deserving vets,don't laugh it's coming.

Bush had the good sense to stand up for the Judeo-Christian traditional family,it's precisely why the left dominated by gays and socialist atheists hate him so profoundly. This is their motivation to try to turn every victory into defeat.

Antlers is mainsteam leftism in all its socialist prosodomy glory. It's good such losers surface from time to time to motivate many of us to send another check to McCain.

Page 16 of 20 1 2 14 15 16 17 18 19 20

Moderated by  RickBin 

Link Copied to Clipboard
AX24

541 members (1936M71, 17CalFan, 1badf350, 160user, 22250rem, 47 invisible), 2,578 guests, and 1,391 robots.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Forum Statistics
Forums81
Topics1,191,709
Posts18,475,378
Members73,941
Most Online11,491
Jul 7th, 2023


 


Fish & Game Departments | Solunar Tables | Mission Statement | Privacy Policy | Contact Us | DMCA
Hunting | Fishing | Camping | Backpacking | Reloading | Campfire Forums | Gear Shop
Copyright © 2000-2024 24hourcampfire.com, Inc. All Rights Reserved.



Powered by UBB.threads™ PHP Forum Software 7.7.5
(Release build 20201027)
Responsive Width:

PHP: 7.3.33 Page Time: 0.147s Queries: 15 (0.006s) Memory: 0.9268 MB (Peak: 1.1085 MB) Data Comp: Zlib Server Time: 2024-04-28 21:23:31 UTC
Valid HTML 5 and Valid CSS