Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Long Range Hunting 300 Win Mag or 7mm Rem Mag for LR deer

are ya saying those wounds are accubombs? I gotta know cause I'm wanting to try something other than a tsx for some reason on deer, but I don't want more than caliber entry and double exit, not wasted hamburger like those!

Jeff

Mostly 178gr AMAX's with just enough 190, and 220gr SMK's for spice.... Closet was less than twenty yards, farthest was over 700......

The 30cal 178gr AMAX is the best "killing" bullet for deer, and easily the choice when something HAS to die. Keep it out of bone and your fine. Don't and.........




Thats about one seasons worth.... maybe. My computers being a butt right now, when I get it fixed I'd be happy to hang 30 or 40 more since I'm a "paper ballistic expert Idiot"......

When I competed 1K BR between 2005 and 2007 in Tucson, the 30s spanked the 7s pretty consistently. The 7 WSM does show the most promise, but the 180 Berger may not be as good as the 168 Berger accuracy wise. Also, Bergers BCs seem overly optimistic. I shot metplat uniformed 220 SMKs (Initial BC over .6) from a 300 WSM and likely still hold the club light gun agg record, that I set and broke and set again--though I do expect that record to be soon broken, my bet is on the guy shooting the Partiot (short fat 30 cal) and 210 JLKs. the Tucson range has an almost constantly gusty quartering tailwind. If there ever is an Eastern style calm wind day, a 6.5 might spank everyone.............

I don't care what the drop is, but my combination of bullet and velocity yeilded abut 60" of drift at 1000 yds in a 10 mph crosswind. Extreme spreads of 11 fps didn't hurt anything either..........

To the OP, I'd pick the 300 Win mag over any 7 any day for long range animals.

Don't and what?

So which is it? The 28 cal. 162 or the 30 cal 178?

And your good enough to place bullets out of bone at 1000?



So when did 240 SMK's come on the scene?

I thought we were comparing 7mm/162's/625BC to 30/208's/648BC

Ok, 46 grains.




I do appreciate your enthusiasm.

Jeff, I have no idea if those were Accubond wounds. I just was passing along some good bullets at $15/50!

Wow, ok no damn amax or smks then this year. Info much appreciated, I really wanted to run a heavy high BC 7mm... may have to default back to the tsx 150s unfortunately.

Jeff

From what I've seen of Accubond wounds (one deer at 80 yards, two elk at 300 yards), they don't do ANYTHING like that kind of destruction. I agree, that was kind of appalling.

Rost I would seriously give the Accu's a try. I have never EVER seen an accubond hole like that. My brother in law shot a 140 pound buck last year at 80 yards with one, with about a half inch entry and a 1 iinch exit, that was a 140 accubond. or 150 not sure. I know it was federal ammo though.

-By the way HOLY BLOOD SHOT MEAT BATMAN!

Congrats though!

Ill stick to my slow .45-70 on the other hand. Holy smokes...

FMP

I wish I'd realized, before I thought to sign up on the Campfire, how much everyone loves PICTURES. I shot a big blacktail buck right through the shoulder with an Accubond at the abovementioned 80 yards or so, and meat damage and bloodshot were completely reasonable, as was the exit hole after almost 2 feet of penetration.

I have a pic of me and buck, but I should have gone in the house, washed my hands, got out my camera, and taken a pic of the carcass when I had it all peeled out in my shop...

Oh well. They are great bullets in my opinion; they work really well. Not gonna blow up and wreck meat, and the terminal performance from a .338 at 300+ yards is impressive too- two bangflops for my pard Jerry.

Blaine, I understand that, though for discussion, what is the max range accuracy difference between 30cal and 7mm's, and what caliber holds the mile record right now?

Apparently you suffer from the same comprehenson problem as DDP. However if you look at the top of a post, just right of center you can see who the post is addressed to......





Because of that comprehension problem, I'll make this one easy. Remembering what I wrote to your above question- rost495 asked what bullets were used to kill the deer in the pictures, and commented about the damage. My answer- 178gr AMAX, miss bone and your fine, hit bone and lots of tissue damage will occur. I could care less about hitting bone at 1,000 yards or 1 yard. 100% weight retention doesn't kill... Tissue damage does. AMAX's create a lot of tissue damage.





That reading comprehension thing again.... Reread the thread.

OTOH, I do like that you point out that it takes the same make 30cal bullet around 40gr more to match the 7mm's.....




Really? I guess you did prove that a same/same 30cal bullet outflies a 7mm.... Or not. That 30cals- burn less powder, have less recoil, and better barrel life when loaded to match 7mm's flight..... Or not.

Feel free to hang a couple dozen pics of deer you've killed at LR.....














[img]http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v609/CharlesArbuckle/img009.jpg[/img]

[img]http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v609/CharlesArbuckle/img007.jpg[/img]

[img]http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v609/CharlesArbuckle/img006.jpg[/img]

[img]http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v609/CharlesArbuckle/img004.jpg[/img]

[img]http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v609/CharlesArbuckle/Charles200710pt218yds178grA-MAX22.jpg[/img]

[img]http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v609/CharlesArbuckle/Charles200710pt218yds178grA-MAX21.jpg[/img]

[img]http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v609/CharlesArbuckle/Charles20078ptatStacys2.jpg[/img]

[img]http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v609/CharlesArbuckle/Charles2006doeat70yds178grA-MAX2.jpg[/img]

[img]http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v609/CharlesArbuckle/Charles2006doeat40yds178grA-MAX1.jpg[/img]

[img]http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v609/CharlesArbuckle/Charles2006doe402yds178grA-MAX2.jpg[/img]

[img]http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v609/CharlesArbuckle/Amber2005Stacys220grSMK5.jpg[/img]

[img]http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v609/CharlesArbuckle/Amber2005200yds175grSMK3.jpg[/img]

[img]http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v609/CharlesArbuckle/Amber2005200yds175grSMK.jpg[/img]

[img]http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v609/CharlesArbuckle/2006SpikeOpeningDay2.jpg[/img]

[img]http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v609/CharlesArbuckle/175grSMK100ydsBen.jpg[/img]



Those are some of the more interesting ones.....

Should add, not a single one was via a 7mm....

rost, those aren't really average. Average with no large bones hit is probably around a 3in exit. If you want to shoot a bullet with a better BC then the Barnes, try the Bergers. They consistently penetrate 2-3 inches before upset, regardless of what the hit, then come unhinged. Very, very little lost meat.

Thanks for the showing the photo's, now I know what bullet not to use.

Looks like your screwed up a lot of doe's and fawns all about the size of a dog. Well done.

Anything with horns?

About 50% of the above, though kiling is killing, and the bullet doesn't know the difference. Of course one would have to do enough of it, to know that....

That last photo looks like a nice gut shot and then the next to last shows destroyed backstraps. Impressive and i take the norm for you.

I don't think the max accuracy ranges will be that much different between the two, though I imagine something like a 240 SMK (BC .711) launched from a 30-378 would have the best chance if the load was found before the barrel wore out. It's competition would be what, a 180 Berger (BC .684) from a 7 RUM?

In 2005, I think the 7 WSM held the mile record--I am not sure who holds it now. Rgardless, a better test would be what round most consitently wins matches at 1 mile, and that will likely be the 408 CheyTac, or one of the other similar chamberings.

Before a 1K BR match, we had a 12" square piece of tractor blade painted bright green that we'd set up against a dirt bank just shy of 1000 yds. We called this the "gong" and it was for gettng guys close before they went to paper. At the club level, it could take a new shooter, or even an old shooter with a new combo, a LONG time to find paper without the gong.

I'd guess that 70% of the time my first shot was within a foot (horizontally) of the gong, and that would have been with the scope setting used at the last match. Vertical was usually within 6" of point of aim. In 1K BR you are constantly cranking the crosshairs during the sighter period to figure out the wind, and then the scope stays set for the record group, usually shot as rapidly as one can single feed the ammo.

However, 30% of the time the shot could be off horizontally by as much as 2 feet. Now if this happens when shooting from a bench at a known distance, in a field condition that problem would be greatly amplified. Point is that ANY first round hit at 1000 yds on a deer is a decent shot.

I think that is something a guy has to be prepared to accept when shooting deer at very long ranges. You don't have any wind flags and reading mirage--if there is even any mirage, is a fine art. Fortunately, deer are easy to kill and don't require perfect shot placement to take them down.

Those are exits, as insertions come from a variety of angles.... All but three were DRT's and the farthest one traveled less then 40yds. Again, feel free to put up 2 or 3 dozen pics of your deer killed at LR.....

Since pics are being used as a way to establish credibility: