Home Forums Reloading Big Game Rifles Loose primer pockets ?

G'day fellas!

This poor old aussie has a problem with his Federal Rem .260 once fired brass (and possibly Fed 7mm08 brass though I havent started reloading that..) I bought the brass from some good 'ol boys in the US of A !

When seating primers they are very loose.... one or two even fell out, I think I was using Rem 9 1/2 primers.....

Is this a chronic problem with Federal brass?? I've heard the .223 stuff has this problem....Do Federal load their ammo red hot ...plus have max spec primer pockets?

Before anyone says junk the brass ....
1)It is definately only once fired..
2)I have at least 600 x .260 Rem cases and about the same in 7mm08 (all Federal) so a considerable investment was made as I had them sent to the UK when I was working there.... then had to get an import permit for Australia...then carted them across the other side of the world !!!
C)'just use Remington brass' ?? I have a bit of Rem brass....it's just that I have 2 x .260 rifles and 2 x 7mm08's !! so I wanted the keep each rifle with separate headstamp brass to avoid confusion !!!

I have seen from posts here that 'Midway' sell a.... 'Hart' primer pocket swager ...but....Midway dont ship internationally !!

Do any of you knowledgeable blokes know which primer brands are the 'fattest' (or maximum spec in width ?? this is my first option!!)

Regards
Peter

In recent years Federal brass has become notorious for being soft. I've fired factory 223s and checked the velocity over the chrono and found it normal, yet the primer pockets were loose when I tried to reload them.

Try Federal or CCI plated primers, when being seated they feel tighter than unplated Remingtons and Winchesters.

Can't answer your question which is the fattest, but my experience with enlarged pockets has always been the result of too hot of a load. It is risky because I have had them come loose from recoil in the magazine and of course you get a misfire when you chamber the round with the now missing primer.

I suspect that if 1 brand is falling out that any brand will not ultimately be reliable enough for field handling.

Loose pockets are often the result of trying to find the edge of pressure limits without taking measurements.

Thanks Mathman,

Federal primers are very popular in Oz...I have been using Rem 9 1/2's but I'll try the Fed 210's and even some CCI's ..

I was hoping some avid reloader might reply "oh RWS, Vit's ro some other obscure brand are really maximum spec" so that might solve the problem...

...been reloading since 1980 and have never struck this problem on new or newish brass !!!!

Try the Federal primers. They should be a little more snup as noter above. Even if they work, your brass will have a shorter that normal use life. You may want to get a .210" pin gage. If I have pockets getting large on me, I use the pin gage to sort before I put a primer in and then I use the Fed 210Match primers on the brass I save.
JMHO
Tim

Tundra.....Ta 4 the reply,
Well I agree about the usual cause of loose primers being hot loads....but this is once fired brass from factory loads and after FLS, trimming, chamfering the mouths and cleaning the primer pockets i found the pockets loose before my first load...(so it was B4 the brass's second)...the primer pockets were enlarged after the factory loads were shot..of course the rifle that they were shot in could also be 'dodgey' !!!

BTW I never hot rod (my friends reckon my loads are blackpowder loads !!) only time in 28 years that I blew primers is when I left my Win 760 reloaded ammo in the boot of the car....on a summer day when it was 43C inside our huntin hut !! car boot must have been 50-60C !!! even in our hut our rifles were hot to touch !!! that'l do it !!!

Yep Tim, sounds like using the nickle plated primers is only a temporay fix ...will have to 'bite the bullet' so to speak & buy that 'Hart' Primer pocket device....most aussie shooters reload and to get only one reload out of brass that has come from US to the UK then taken in my bags all the way to Australia seems a waste of money !!!

cheers

I have the same problem with my 243 winchester brass. I fired once and tried the winchester primers and they fit very loose. I switched to the CCIs and am still loading the same brass. Some of the brass is in the upwards of 10 reloadings. I havent had a problem with the CCIs as of yet. HAPPY HUNTING

I had the same problem with Fed. 223 & 30-06 once fired brass from factory ammo. I had good luck using CCI benchrest primers for a snug fit.

There probably isn't a sure way to tell if this is true or not, but there is the possiblity that the primer pockets were slightly oversize when they were made at the factory.

Do they have the fired primers still in them? If so, decap a few and measure the primer diameter.

I don't know exactly what this measurement will tell you, if anything.

Someone makes, or did make some type of sealant to put around a primer to water proof it. I don't know where to get it, but some of the other readers on here might know something about it.

That should at least prevent the primers from falling out, and seal them, too.

I have some recently made Federal brass that I can reseat the old primer in with my thumb. I don't intend to try reloading it. At the same time I have some made at least 15 years ago that can be reloaded up to 10 times.
Sounds like you are just going to have to bite the bullet and sell the stuff as scrap metal.

Thanks guys for all the info,

It seems like Fed or better, CCI primers are the way to go for a while...

I saw on another website that 'Wolf' primers were max spec...so that may be tried after the CCI's !!! ('Wolf' arent they a Russian ammo company ??)....

If all else fails its the 'R W Hart case saver swage' !!

Good huntin fellas and greetings from Australia !

pete

I have the same problem with 25.06 factory FC brass.

I got some once fired 308 brass that was fired in an M14, I think it was Fed. Anyway after reloading it for my M1A some of the primers would fall out from being carried around in my pockets or magazine.

I just figured the chamber was "bigger" in the M14, now after reading these comments I wonder if is not the Fed brass.

On another note, I was wondering about your countries firearms laws. I thought the gov. took most of the guns away a few years away. Anyway I am glad that Assies can still hunt and shoot

Yep Viking,

After all the comments here (and on other forums) me thinks that the current Federal brass isnt the best reloading proposition.

Maybe Federal is saving a few bucks in the manufacturing process...!!!! I guess they rationalise it as a great many US shooters dont reload, just buy a box or two for deer hunting season....come to think of it...in Spain where I am at the moment...I've never met a hunter that reloads..(one reason is you need to have a special license here !!)

Back in Oz (Australia) everyone I know reloads... most of my friends when they buy a new rifle, they just buy a few hundred empty cases and reload right from the word go...I do that too!!

Oh btw the Aust Govt. did basically ban all semi-auto long arms (military & sporting) in centrefire, shotgun and even .22LR...but they had to buy them off us (and boy did they get taken for a ride!) most guys just when out and bought new bolt & lever action rifles with the cash !!!

Also since we didnt have universal gun registration before.. they never knew how many were out there !!!

For example they did know that at least 300,000 Chinese SKK's (an SKS adapted to use detachable 30 rnd AK mags..made especially for Australia I think) were imported into Australia....but only about 30,000 were handed in to the Govt...!!!!

If you jump through the necessary hoops you still can get a special license for semi autos even military ones but there are various restrictions...

Compared to the UK and Europe, Oz is still a good country for shooters ...I think of the 'developed world' the US is still the ultimate shooters haven then maybe New Zealand/Canada and then OZ...

All firearms are registered there now but it's no big deal to get a permit for yet another one...I have 20 rifles...

We can even still have pistols (not like the UK !) they are licensed & registered here tho ..we can have semi autos and revolvers but the semi autos must have a 5inch barrel and revolvers a 4 inch (so no snubbies/compacts) mag capacity is also limited to 10 shots in semi autos (sound familiar?!)

(A collectors license however lets you 'collect' them tho)

Also calibres over 9mm or 357 were sort of banned, but then they made exceptions for M/S so theres a heap of guys that shoot M/S with their 1911 45's or 4inch Mod 29's !!!!!!...mmm they never seem to win matches tho !!!!!

well there it is ! a brief guide to shootin irons in OZ

happy huntin'

Oh I forgot....in my home State (New South Wales)..we even have two politicians elected to the Upper House (Senate)..from a political party called 'The Shooters Party'..!! and I believe that they are the only elected politicians of this type in the world.......

I find Aussieland very gun friendly compared to almost any other country, maybe even Canada. Argentina is pretty good too. Got my gun permit through the mail very easily. I cleared customs by myself in Melbourne, no help needed, flew with it to Darwin and kept it with me in the hotel until I flew to Katherine a few days later to meet my guide. No issues at any point. Thought it was interesting that even though the Darwin-Katherine flight is a commercial flight there was no security check whatsoever and I think Katherine may be a military base. Anyway I remember seeing fighters taking off.

On a previous separate trip I bought an Anschutz in Adelaide and brought it home. Not too far from Ozzie's neck of the woods.

Tundra,
good to hear you had no hassles....Actually Victoria (Melbourne) is one of the stricter states...they had long gun registration well before my home state of NSW.... the Northern Territory was/is a bit more relaxed....strangely the biggest, most desolate state Western Australia had/has the strictest laws...

Not surprising that there was no security at the smaller airports...who would want to hijack anything there !!
remember both the Spanish and the Dutch landed on North Western Australia (well before Capt Cook) were suitably unimpressed and promptly left.... even the French found OZ unappealing...only the English saw the long term hunting prospects of the place.. ..

Did you get a big Buff ?? also did you have a good 'blaze up' on some big boars(wild piggies)???

cheers
peter

PS So it was you that gazumped me on that Anschutz !!!

I had a good hunt.




No pigs, only a few tracks. Passed on an exceptionally large and nicely colored scrub bull the 1st day saying I wasn't interested. Regretted that decision shortly after making it and still today. Looked for him the rest of the hunt but no luck. Took a dingo and a calf scrub bull for meat for a remote abo village on the gulf.

You might find this video interesting:

http://sports.webshots.com/video/3029227620039751215bhBEDU?vhost=sports

The New Jersey High Power Rifle Website has a nice table comparing dimensions for both small and large rifle primers. It shows the Federal 210 to have the largest diameter. I'm sure these dimensions are a "snapshot in time" but the table has been useful to me. Here is a link to the table:

http://www.njhighpower.com/
click on "Reloading Stuph" and scroll down

Best Regards,
PA

well done Tundra !!!

Whilst Ive been to Darwin NT I wasnt shooting ....so you've shot one more buff, dingo & scrub bull more than me !!!! (havent got any of those !!)

Truckloads of wild pigs though !!! I'm surprised you didnt get any boars...generally hunting here is a bit of a lottery (not trophy hunting but general weekend hunts on friends properties)...you can bump into pigs, goats, foxes, hares, bunnies...maybe dingoes..all deemed pests here so usually its free....we dont have the quality you have in the US (Elk, Whitetail, bears etc ...but what we do have is quantity !!!!