Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Ask The Gunwriters Which gun and cartridge for a young hunter that wants to start hunting deer and elk?

Good thread as I am considering the same as my oldest son turns 11 this year. He is also left eye dominant which threw another wrench into it so I went out a bought him a Savage LH bolt action 22(he already had a RH bolt gun 22 which went to son2). I figure after shooting this all summer a Rem SPS Youth LH Centerfire will be next. For lefties the choices are limited but was happy to see that it was offered in 7mm-08. As a handloader, I will start him with light 120's not for overall accuracy but to get him used to the gun and as he approaches 12, will begin to stoke them hotter until the recoil tolerance level is hit.

In the meantime, i'll keep him shooting the 22 over and over to develop shooting skills.

If the 260 was also offered, I would be very comfortable with choosing that cartridge, starting with 100 gr loads and working up to the 125 Nosler Partition for big game.

I just went through this scenario with my 12-year-old son last summer. He had been shooting the 22 rf for several years and had graduated up to the 22-250. Things were going great and he loved shooting the 22-250 and more importantly he shot it accurately.

I then started him on a 7 lb. Rem M7 in .260 and 125 Partitions that I had planned on him using for big game. Even though he did not complain I could tell he just didn't like shooting the .260 as much and was ready to hang it up earlier than normal. We backed down to the 6.5 100 grain NBT's and he started enjoying shooting again and more importantly he shot better with less recoil. Like was said previously, every kid is different and now with some experience under his belt I think he could be ready for some heavier bullets and more recoil.

A co-worker threw his son(with little shooting experience) into a 7-08 and 140 grain bullets and the poor kid was scared as heck of the rifle. This is not a knock on the 7-08 as it would be the best choice for elk, but depending on your son I'd start out small and see how he handles it.

I also recommend a .223, then a 7mm-08.

You can get rifles in both calibers in:

* Remington Model 7 ( great size and weight). CDL has open sights.
* Ruger 77
* Ruger 77 Hawkeye
* Browning A-Bolt II
* Browning X-Bolt
* Tikka T3
* CZ 527 and CZ 550 (or a 7x57mm). 527 is great size!
* Howa 1500 ( heavier)

My son was same as ChipM's son ---left eye dominate. I acquired a LH Rem 788 in 308 for him. I cut down the stock a little, mounted a compact scope on it, and started him on light loads. At 12 he wacked a white tail, mule deer and a cow elk with it using 165 gr NPs.

If possible I would start a youth with a smaller framed weapon such as the Ruger RL77, Rem Mod 7, etc. Either 7-08 or 308. A lot of 22 shooting is in order also.

A Ruger RL77 in 308 is my "go to" gun when humping, sneaking and peaking, or climbing. It is an elk wacker with 180 Solid Bases.

JMHO
Tim

.260, 7mm-08, .270, or .308 are all good choices. I started one of my sons on the .270 and the other on the .308. I used the "sneaky" approach, whereby they only shot a 22LR at the range and then went straight to the .270/.308 on game (they did do a lot of dry-firing at home with the bigger guns). I believe that the skills learned with the 22 are transferable to the bigger gun w/o having them shoot the big gun at the range, and in the field when shooting at game they never noticed the difference in recoil at all.

As "proof," my youngest shot a bull moose at 150 yards with his .308 when he was only 11 - one shot and the bull dropped right there. My eldest shot his first game animal - a wild hog - with his .270. The hog was running sideways to him at about 50 yard; my son (about 14) plopped down into a sitting position, swung with the pig and whacked him once in the shoulder. The piggy did a somersault and pitched in the dirt. Admittedly, only a sample of two, but it worked.

Now that they're bigger, they can shoot their big game rifles at the range w/o a problem.

I'm not saying that that's the smartest way to go, but it worked for me.

That's the same year I killed my first Deer in my home state of Pennsylvania. I used a 300 Savage in a Rem 722.
You gotta be one of the good guys shooting a 257 Roberts!!!!
When my Step Dad got home from WW II in 1945, the first rifle he had built was a 257 Roberts!!!
The 257 has a special meaning in my life as I imagine it does in your life too....

Don

What I'd do is first find a rifle that he likes. Something that fits him and one he can shoot well.
If you don't handload, I'd make sure that there is some sort of managed recoil ammo out there in case it's needed.
If you hand load, then I'd start him out with say a 7-08 with a mild load of 4895, say 35 grs. and something like the Speer 130 gr. 7mm bullet. That load does something like 2500 fps. and is very similar to the 150 gr. .30/30 load.
Alot will depend on just what he is comforatable with and what he can shoot. I can recall shooting my dad's old .30/30 at age 11. I thought that old M64 Winchester was going to kick my brains out. One shot, and I was done. Steel butt plate, etc.
But the very next year, I discovered I could shoot my grandfather's M721 Remington 30'06 quite well. Full power loads and a muzzle break. While I had grown a little, basically it was the fit of the rifle and the break that made the big difference. So find what he likes and can shoot well first. E

Great feedback guys and thanks to all for the sound advice. I have heard more than one person say jump from the 22 to a centerfire 22 and then up to a 7mm-08, etc. I like that idea and I may be able to kill two birds with one stone. Specifically, I have been kicking around the idea of building a 204 ruger for me. Maybe I should get a rem 700 in 204 Ruger, but in a sporter weight barrel (not varmint contour) and also buy a youth stock for it. That way I can shoot it and my kids can enjoy it as well. Once they get comfortable with the 204, I can then buy another Remington in 7mm-08 and use the same youth stock on that gun. That way, dad gets two new guns, the boys get two new guns and we all get to shoot two new guns.�����������sure hope my wife buys this logic

Ted

I like the Ruger Compact Rifles for little guys and big guys.

You can get a matched set in .223/.260 or 7/08 (or 6.8 Rem SPC! Love it). You can do it in ss/lam or blu/wal.

Put the same scopes on both them and a Ruger 10/22.

Coach your kids while burning thousands of rounds of .22LR, hundreds of .223 and dozens of .260 handloads between now and big game season.

To be better field shots we should all be doing a regimen like this all the time as shooting is a highly degradable skill.

Ted....FWIW my son started with a lot of different .22s, graduated to the M1 carbine for fun and a TC Contender youth carbine in .22 Hornet. Took the Hornet to Africa and killed six head of plains game with seven shots when he was 11. Then got him a youth model 7 in .223 with which he killed a couple of deer. He outgrew it and his grandfather gave him a Mauser sporter in 7 x57 which will do him for everything in the lower 48. He's bigger than me now, so he can use anything in the safe he wants.

That little Model 7 was handed down to his sister...who's almost 14 and has now outgrown it. She will be getting a leftie 700 in .257 Roberts for her birthday when Mickey finishes it....she was in on every design decision, and I expect that will be her deer rifle for decades to come.

And I am waiting on a take off stock from one of the campfire brethren which I will stick on that little model 7, have the whole thing OD painted and cerrakoted, and have me a nifty little walking coyote rifle.

Which is a long way of saying, I'd not skip that .223 step to get them familiar with centerfire shooting....ammo is cheap, no amount of shooting will make them flinch, and you build the confidence which makes all the difference when they step up to the next step.

For that step, there are certainly no flies on the 7-08.

Hi Steve,
I just bought a rem 700 sps stainless in 204 ruger tonight and I am getting a youth sps stock for it. I think the boys are going to rack up the miles on it this summer!! I agree, I think spending lots of time with a small centerfire is a great idea.

Here are two of my three at the range two years ago with the 22mag.

Good counsel on the 7mm's...recommend the 7x57 especially, though it's pretty academic between it and the 7mm/08.

A good way with a youngster, and one I've done with my daughter, is to handload reduced loads (done this both w/ .270 and 7x57) at about 2000 to 2100 fps. This lets the kid get satisfaction and confidence with the rifle, and these loads are fine for deer sized game out to about 150 yards. I use the same bullets in these as for higher velocity loads, standard primers, IMR 4198. Zero, of course, is significantly different.

great pics....here's my daughter at the deer camp range last year, wearing out my .257 Roy:

There are lots of good possibilities, but I would think .308 WIN or .270 WIN would easily cover the game you mentioned (all most others in the US) with easy to find commercial ammo. I would buy it in a rifle (REM M700 & Ruger M77 come to mind) that offers the rifle with a youth stock for now, but has a good offering of aftermarket full size stocks to switch to when he is older and bigger. The 7mm08 and .257 RBTS are also good candidates.

I did just the same thing recently, buying a Weatherby Vanguard in 223 that came with two stocks, a youth stock and an adult stock. The rifle is unique among Weatherby Vanguard rifles as it has a short 20" barrel and a 1-12 twist, along with solid black fiberglass stocks. It's a blued finish too. The neat part about the rifle is that is hugely easy to carry, even with the adult stock, and the rifle has delivered many 3 shot, 3/8" groups at 100 yards. It is among the leaders in my safe for accuracy. It also came glass bedded at the recoil lug from the factory. Can't say enough good things about the rifle.
FWIW,
Don

Now there are two real Americans! Patriots hard at work learning their skills! Congrats to you!

I am surprised that the 260 wasn't mentioned more, I guess I shouldn't be given the general success of any 6.5 round. To me it is the ideal first big game cartridge and good for all shooters for deer sized game. The 6.5s are well proven on Elg (Moose in Finnish) and with the right bullet would sure take an eating size Elk. Even when the shooter is ready for something bigger the 260 will cover about 80% of any stateside hunters needs.

Recoil is less than anything over the 257 Roberts in size, yet it is not marginal in the least as a 6mm can be.

Mine started at 11 yrs also! Skinny kid with no meat on his bones. 140 partitions has been his load!! Big time killer.

120 tsx and 150 e-tips or the partion and all is covered.

I had a 260 once that put 125and 140 partitions into the same nice tight group at 100yds. That could also work! 125's for deer. And 140's for elk!

As you probably already know, 6mm is minimum caliber for Colorado big game hunting.....

In recent times, I've been using a 243 with 100 Partitions to kill elk without drama. That's what my 10 year old son will be starting out with in the next few years........

A premium bullet out of any bottleneck cartridge, shoot them in the front half, and that's all that is needed......



Casey

This is what I have done for my 9 year old. He started on 223 REM at 7, killed his first whitetail with it last season. I have a Model 70 in 308 with a youth length and full lenght stock for him, that he will start shooting in another year or two with managed recoil loads. When he is around 14 or 15 he can start using full house loads, and will be able to use the same rifle the rest of his life.