Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Handguns .45 ACP = .45 SUPER.........??

Quick inguiry for those in the know.......

A neighbor brought over a baggie of equal amounts of factory stamped .45 ACP XTP's and factory cases stamped ".45 SUPER", both loaded ammo. The cases/brass from both batches of ACP's and SUPER's are seemingly of the exact same dimensions, but the SUPER's could be factory reloaded ammo and the cases resized and trimmed so they could be used as .45 ACP brass......I just don't know. But they now seem to be the exact same dimensions as the .45 ACP cases, whether they were purposefully trimmed and sized to .45 ACP dimensions or not.

I don't know anything about a .45 SUPER, so I don't want to be using these in my .45 ACP without having the definitive answer as to how to proceed.....IF at all in shooting the loaded "SUPER" cased ammo.

My 'puter went south on me and I'm using my wife's work PC, so I'm not as able to respond as readily as I'd like, so I appreciate any info that you guys might have and I'll say that up front as I don't know when I'll be able to use it again to thank you for your help. I will grab any opportunity to read your responses however, whenever I can steal a moment on my wife's work PC.

Thanks again for any help/info that you can share......

the super has a thicker wall at the base.As far as using the cases for reloading i believe you are fine but DO NOT FIRE 45 super in your standard 45 acp.I converted my colt gov't model to 45 super and really enjoy it.for one thing you need a lot stiffer spring the 45 super is 1200-1300 fps while the 45acp is under 1000

One of the main things that's different between a .45ACP and a .45 Super is that the barrel of the .45 Super fully supports the case head. The barrel of the .45ACP does not. If you shoot a .45 Super in a .45 ACP chamber you will probably have gun parts every where because of the higher pressure and the un-supported chamber of .45ACP.

If you are unsure of the loading, DO NOT FIRE THEM in a gun chambered in ACP. It is a sure way to severely damage the gun and your own body! As was stated above, the unsupported chamber of the ACP will let the case blow out and down into the grip portion of the frame. This can result in anything from stinging fingers to pieces of shrapnel & grip embedded in you hand and face.

Doing an Internet search turned up that Ace gunsmith out of Texas is alive and well and now has the trademark and patent rights to the .45 Super for whatever it's worth.

There is now some factory loaded .45 Super and Starlite makes the .45 Super brass. Strarlite brass is specially made for use in un-supported barrel without blowing out the bottom. Must be some brass.


www.acecustom45s.com

What about .45 super in the S&W 625? Any issues here?

Just be aware that the "45 Super" generates 28,000 CUP in pressure as opposed to the 11,000 CUP of the .45 ACP.

Doesn't seem worth the trouble to me. Besides 1911s get squirrely with hot loads. The recoil isn't obnoxious but I have a hard time shooting it quickly.

Case capacity is different in the Super. You will need to modify your load if you use the Super brass for 45 loads.

On the Ace web site there is an S&W auto converted to .45 Super. Check the site to see if it is yours.

A properly set-up 1911 will let one shoot the .45ACP in a .45 Super. For self-defense and fun shooting shoot the .45ACP. For hunting shoot the .45 Super. A 230 grain .45 Super load is ballistically similar to a .41 mag.

S&W 625 is a wheel gun.

.45acp is 21,000 operating pressure +P is 23,000 , and .45 Super is 28,000. .460 Rowland is much higher, and James Clark reams 625s to accept it.

OOPS, I did mean 21,000 not 11,000. SORRY ABOUT THAT

We just got a new 'puter today......fast, waaaay too much $, but I'm back in the saddle again!!!

Thanks to all the responses I received concerning the .45ACP/45 Super inquiry I asked somtime ago. Lots of good info there and I learnd quit a bit about the Super of which I knew zilch about.......

I had already sorted the ACP's from the Super's and now will plainly mark the latter so as not to use them in my Kimber UC II. Sounds like it would have been a blast, but perhaps not the kind I would have apprciated....... Truth be told, I wasn't about to try them in anything 'til I got the definitive answer, which thanks to you guys, I now have.

Again.......I appreciate the number of great responses I received. There's nothing like havin' that much wealth of knowledge at one's finger tips, just for the askin'.

Great place.....this.

since you have the ammo now you have to buy a 45 anf convert to the 45 super.Lot's of fun

I've been shooting 45 Super for about 8 years or so. I bought the Springfield V16 LongSlide in 45 Super. They no longer make them. I shoot 230g Golden Sabre HPs at a mild 1150 fps. Stock 45 ACP shoots a 230g bullet at 850. Mine shoots either. Recoil is mild with the 45 Supers and non-existent with regular 45s. Packs like a 45, hits like a 41 Magnum revolver ... It's very accurate and reliable too. It's my concealed carry gun .



Chuck

Many of the original "45 Supers" did use standard barrels, which is the reason for the thicker cases. The .45 Super was patented by Ace Custom and they pretty much own the name of .45 Super, but certainly not the concept.

The idea was originally baked up by Dean Grennell who had done similar work on the .38/45 Clerke, which was originally created by Bo Clerke, a California gunsmith, intended to be a light target load. Grennell turned it into the .38/45 Hard Head, when he magnumized the velocities. Grennell had worked for years to soup up the .45 ACP using standard cases, and then cut down .308 cases, but when the .451 Detonics Magnum came along, those beefed up cases were like Manna from Heaven for Dean, and he begun to use them. Later, when the .451 got scarce, he cut down .45 Win Mag cases to create .45 Super cases. Dean worked with Ace Hindman to create the gun, and Hindman made several changes to increase the safety of the gun. Earlier versions still used the factory barrel, but later the ramped barrel became an option, and I believe it�s now standard.

Ace Custom maintains that only an Ace built gun is safe to fire the .45 Super, but that�s a bunch of malarkey. Ace custom used to install a proprietary dual spring system and then a squared off firing pin stop to help retard and slow down slide velocity. There have been literally dozens of people who have proved that a 24-26lb spring in a standard 1911 will work just fine provided you�re using .45 Super or similarly constructed brass.

The cartridge was legitimize by the always entrepreneurial Fernando Coleho at Triton cartridge company, who took the time to establish some standards, and then contract out with Starline to manufacture factory brass. The .45 Super was a fairly popular cartridge but eventually relations between Ace Hindman and Triton fell apart and Triton was no longer license to use the .45 Super name. Triton then developed their own version of the .45 Super, changing the case to a small rifle primer and re-naming it the .450 Triton, and then changed to .450 SMC; with performance remaining about equal.

Good info, Kevin, but I'm not feelin' it for a .45 Super. I've never fired one, but having to use a 24-26 lb. recoil spring in a 1911 makes me wonder. That's a lot of slam on the return to battery. Do you know the spring weight on the Ace version with the square FP stop?