Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Long Range Hunting Barrel Contours & Cartridges for long range shooting

Having just built a heavy 14 lb rifle in 300 WSM, this one is for hauling in the truck and short distances.

I'm on to the next project.

Now I'm looking at more of a hybrid long range carry rifle.
One that can carry and hit for distance.

(I have my Ti's in 6.5 and .30 for backpack hunting.)

Components;
FN SPR action .473 bolt face
Manners MCS-T stock/carbon
Burris alloy tactical rings
Leupold VX3 4.5x14 LR w M1
Rock 5R barrel.............What contour?


I've narrowed it the contour down to three or?
http://www.rockcreekbarrels.com/prod01.htm

#1 HBR 1.25" - 0.750"
Light Palma 1.25" 0.750"
Med Palma 1.25" 0.820"

I'm thinking no more than 26" and possibly 25" for length.
The barrel will be fluted.

Cartridge is going to be either the 260 AI or 284 Win.
Love the 6.5x284 but hate the barrel life they have.
I would Improve the 260 for case life and maybe gain
50 fps.

My bullets of choice WILL BE Berger VLD's.

6.5 140's @ 612 BC
.28 168's @ 617 BC
.28 180's @ 659 BC.

The buzz says the 28/180's run circles around the others BUT I
don't want to run a 30" barrel to make them work.

That leaves the 26/140 or 28/168.
Both run about the same BC, both run about the same speed?

What advantages and disadvantages am I looking at here in contour and cartridge choice?

I would say the 260 wins with less recoil.
Would the 284 have a longer throat/barrel life? Even though it is burning another 10 grains of powder?

What would be the better for big game including elk?
As JB has stated with differ Berger weights.

If so, are the bullets equal is killing effect though the
6.5 is 28 grains lighter?
Berger's seem to be the unconventional equalizers!

I have the action and scope, the stock is on order and the barrel to be ordered. The barrel is the missing component at this point.

What am I missing here?

Berger's may put the two bullets on a little more level playing field, but when it comes to heavy bone, there's no replacement for momentum when dealing with 2 equally constructed bullets of different weights...

What does the Manners stock weigh? This would determine what kind of contour I'd run.

The Manners stock weighs 2.1 lb.




I don't know about that. I'm seeing where the unconventional Bergers penetrate 2 to 3 inches and grenade no matter what weight.

With that stock, action, and scope/mounts, I'd lean toward the light palma contour and flute it. It might give you halfway decent balance and that would be a primary concern for me.

With elk in mind I would opt for the 284 Win over the 6.5

To illustrate my point, do you think that a 50gr .224 Berger VLD (if one existed) would smash through the shoulder joint of a big bull moose just as well as a 225gr .338 version of the same bullet?

The bullet may be designed to penetrate, but if it lacks the momentum to push on through, it just isn't going to happen...

The difference between 6.5 and 7mm isn't nearly as large as the difference between the .22 and .338, but the 7mm offers a slight edge that I would gladly take advantage of. If you're talking about an elk rifle, the recoil difference between .260 and .284 shouldn't be overly significant.

I just settled on the Rock Light Palma.

With a light fill stock.

Hoping for around a 10lb rifle.

That's gonna be a nice rig!

SU-sounds like a fun project, what cal did you choose?

Personally, I feel that either one will do you just fine for game up to and including elk. You know what you're doing so I sure don't worry about what will happen after you drop the hammer.

Dober

Thanks Mark,

Manners is painting the stock in Marpat camo.
They are lighting up the stock with carbon which also makes it
stiffer. Adding badger pillars and 3 studs.

They are great people to deal with.

I'm thinking 284 Win with the goal of shooting 168 VLD's at
2,900 mv. That puts me at 1,600 fps at 1000, right where I want to be. I also want the option of shooting 180's.
I would prefer the 6.5x284 but I don't believe barrel life would be in my favor.

I added the weight of all the components and came out at
11 lbs even. That's pretty much what I expected and want.

284 is closer to shorter fatter....

and for game I've always believed that more diameter and more bullet weight can never be a negative...

now the thought of 2-3 inches and exploding still shakes me up some, but i'm somewhat on the same course as you but a larger 7mm and if I ever find the right berger "hunting" 180s I'm sure going to see on a couple of non important shots IE wont' risk trying to shatter a shoulder first and the like... do the lungs, move to the head, then move to teh shoulder on a doe, and move to a raking shot and then decide...

Jeff,

The primary function of this rifle would be deer. Elk, you never now.

I've yet to take a raking shot on an animal that I can remember. Don't have plans to with the Berger's.

At 1000 yards, and this is nothing but a benchmark in my mind.
(1,600 fps is the bottom line for the bullet to work like it should. I don't think more speed is going to be a factor in taking an animal. The Berger bullet has all it needs to function in it's unconventional way.

I picked up on something a couple of years ago while deer hunting during the general hunt here in WA.
A camp of hunters were on the edge of a steep and thick canyon
next to a main 4 wheeler road. Every morning all these 4 wheelers speed by to hunt a wilderness area 3 miles away.
(btw, I backpacked to their location.)
This group of hunters would wave them on while eating a big breakfast.
30 yards behind the camp and out of view of the road they had their spotters set up to view the opposite canyon sides.

Now, here in WA we have annual deer migration routes. Year after year these mule deer will take the very same routes on the hillsides as their ancestors did for hundreds of years.
They travel horizontally on the hills, a zig zag, walking for 50 to 100 miles to get to where they winter. Then they go back in the spring, UP to the high country.

These certain hunters had figured out that they didn't need to
cover all this ground in some of the thickest steepest country imaginable. They let the deer come to them but at a cost.
Long Range Shooting. They did real good and that with your off the shelf Walmart SPS.

I hunt the high hunt in Sept, if i don't collect then i hunt the general hunt in Oct. This rifle would be for that hunt.
In my area of interest, hopefully no crowds.

I don't argue the raking shot but my mentality says if I"m prepared, then why should I have to pass on a shot due to poor bullet selection...
In actuality I'd almost bet that in a raking shot you could put the explosiveness of the berger into the paunch and most times have a DRT situation.

I prefer not to be hindered once I find something I want. Hence the choice of bullets.

The other analogy, short/fat... simply a reference to inherent accuracy.

I would love to find a migration route and time it right... nothing wrong with that.

Best of luck with the project, once you are done you'll know what you did wrong/right.... aint that always a shame.

My choice might be worth your consideration: .284 Win, 28" barrel, NULA, about 7.3 lb. with 6x42 Leupold. About 2850 fps with 175 Hornady spire point.

Don't say that!

Those migration routes are contingent upon weather.
Every year it can be different.


Longbarrel, thank you for the input I'll take it into consideration.

I would go shorter barrel in the truck. - Actually, I like shorter barrels in general, so I am biased in that regard.... no longer than 22".

284...(I am biased there again)
Medium sporter weight barrel, or Magnum sporter contour, non-fluted...I don't know what rocks equivalent here is, but the shorter barrel will be plenty stiff.

Faster twist for the heavy bullets, but a 162 Hornady ain't bad at all.

A rifle like that should come in under 8 1/2#, and that rifle will hunt to 700 and easily hit well past 1000 with slicker bullets.

TC

I have two Ti 700s guys that will reach out to 700 no problem.

I WANT a heav-ier rifle.

Nice choice, sounds like a fantastic build. Post some pics when you're finished!

Why not the wsm or saum? I have been contemplating a similar rifle with the mcmillan a3 and a sendero or light palma type contour with either of the above though I have a standard la that begs for the 280ai treatment.

Thinking the 162 amaxs or the berger flavors.