Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Hunter's Campfire Barakistan

Hey, Barak, as one of those who formerly wore a uniform (one I volunteered and was honored to wear, to serve and protect this nation and it's people and way of life), let me render a hearty "[bleep] YOU!"

If you can't figure out that you just proved true every point ever made about your disrespect and disdain toward current and former military personnel, then you're more retarded than we'd originally thought possible.

Gotta ask a question, Barak: How often have you spent time baking cookies for, or doing anything for, military personnel, vs the same amount of time you dedicate to such activities for the scum of the earth (murderers, rapists, drug dealers)?

Actions speak louder than words, and your words just backed up your actions in regard to your true feelings toward military personnel that could, would, and have volunteered their lives to defend your sorry azz (and your family) against threats foreign and domestic.

And, you really think a nation of people like you would stand a snowball's chance in Hell against any aggressor? Delusional, has a new definition.

Well, human nature is indeed human nature, so there is no hope of ever attaining perfection in this world. We, therefore, have to settle for various approximations of perfection, as best we can arrange them.

Well as I'm a person who wore a uniform for about a decade during the Vietnam era, you are delusional if you really think you were defending the people of the US. What you were defending is the government not the people or the state. As a soldier, you are an employee of the federal government not the people. If some how a Fairy Godmother waved a magic wand and the present federal government disappeared and a new government appeared you would have been an employee of the new government. If the government had disappeared all together you would have been without a job.

The point is, that it's a propaganda myth that any military defends the people, it's the government that the military defends. Read our won Revolutionary War to see who defended who.

BTW: People don't have wars against other people, it's the ruling class of the government that has wars against another ruling class of a government. The common man is expected to support the ruling class/government in it's wars. I always wondered what would happen when a ruling class/government declares a war against another ruling class/government and nobody from the common class showed up.

I guess the younger class is smarter than I thought they were, eat, drink, and be marry for their is nothing else.

derby_dude;

Did you volunteer? If so, why?

If you didn't volunteer, then your reasons/requirements for joining were not the same as mine, nor those of anyone else who volunteered.

Plus one.

Yeah, yeah, I already know that my dereliction of duty in failing to render you special deference and respect for your military service honks you off.

It's not my intentional objective to honk you off, and I'm sorry you choose to get all hot and bothered over it; but profanity and insults aren't going to serve to get you any more deference and respect than you already have. Not from me, anyway. That's not the way it works.

The respect I have for you has nothing to do with your military service: it's A) left over from back when you seemed to be mostly a decent sort of chap on the Campfire, and B) bolstered by stuff like what you did for Elf.

Not special deference. Just a modicum of respect. Something that you seem unwilling to do, even as you will kowtow to felons on a regular basis.

That's' a good question and I'll answer it.

1. The draft was in affect at the time so volunteer or be drafted.

2. Nobody in my family was drafted so joining was the only option.

3. As a young 19 year old fresh from high school and having a Dad who was a real war hero of WWII, I bought the propaganda myth that I was defending the people.

4. It soon became apparent that the people didn't give a rat's azz what happened in Vietnam only the American government gave a rat's azz what happened in Vietnam.

5. We were supposedly fighting for freedom in Vietnam for the Vietnam people while in this country the government was doing everything in it's power to deny freedom to the people in this country. We were supposedly fighting to stop the spread of socialism and communism in Vietnam while adopting socialism and communism at a fast and furious pace in this country.

6. It became clear to me that all I was was a mercenary soldier for the federal government, a government employee and the people be damned.

7. The first six years I did because it was mandatory but the last four years I did for the fun and money.

Hope this answers your question. Today, knowing what I do, I would never join the military. Nothing against the military per se but there is no need for the military from a constitutional perspective except for the Navy.

You are free to believe that, but don't put words in my mouth. That's not at all what I said.

VAnimrod used to be a decent sort of chap on the Campfire? Interesting.

Just to foolishly stick my hand in the military service fire for a moment...

I was born in 1965. As a kid, the WWII vets were about the age that I am now. Even with the Vietnam war raging, the red dirt and helicopters and day's casualty count on the evening news every night, as kids when we played "war", it was Americans and Germans... we thought very highly of those vets, and I still do.

I remember the Vietnam vets. If I had to generalize, they'd be angry, sad young men in surplus army jackets with long hair. They were scary.

They were two completely different types of people, WWII vets and Vietnam vets. Obviously, world and societal forces were contributing to that; the world was a far different place in 1950 than in 1975! But there was more to it than that. And I think it gets into Barak's comment on going halfway around the world to kill brown people. Obviously, in WWII we did just that! But they were brown people who had attacked our country, quite literally.

Vietnam.... not so much.

Anyway, to cut to the chase, I could not possibly hold in higher regard someone who truly defended my country. And personally, I differ from Barak in that I respect our volunteer armies for what they THINK they are doing.

But Barak is right when he talks about going halfway around the world to kill brown people in defense of what amount to corporate interests. As a policy, I despise that. Words cannot express the depth of my contempt for the national policy, and national arrogance, and national sense of entitlement that leads us to somehow believe that it's OK for us to spend our blood and capital (and someone else's blood) in the pursuit of what amounts to MONEY.

'nuff said.

That's because most of you seem to be whores/shills for having everything stay on the same path it is on now.

Lyndon Johnson's Great Society (communism) fighting communism. Like the old Sam Kinnison line about Rock Against Drugs making as much sense as Christians Against Christ.

You didn't say it I did but if there is no hope but war, war, and more war, than there can't possible be any hope.

Those are your words, not mine. Is Switzerland in a constant state of war?

Nope, but they are a small country with no drive to have an empire. I suppose when our empire dies and breaks up into smaller countries there will be hope again. Unfortunately, I won't be here and I don't see our nation-state breaking up anytime soon. By war I mean both internally and externally.

BTW: there were a few Founding Fathers that considered a Swiss style confederacy and government. Needless to say it was shot down. How can you have an empire with a small country and limited government.

A modicum of respect? I don't believe you. Here's why.

I show you quite a bit more respect here on the Campfire than you show me, and it's not enough for you.

If the respect you show me is the amount of respect you consider due ordinary mundanes, and the amount of respect you consider due you because of your military service is greater than the significantly higher amount you get from me, then it's clear that you consider yourself entitled to a special level of deference and respect.

Which I'm sure you get from lots of people. Why is it such a big deal for you that you don't get it from me? Why do you care so much what I think of you?

Size doesn't much matter. Look at England. They had a huge empire, and England itself is very small.

Tim, truer words were never spoken.

And that's why, dear reader, most "conservatives" do not truly believe in, nor desire, small government.

They desire a big, powerful federal goverment (I mean State... I mean... damn it TRH! ) that can project American power and influence around the globe.

In short, they desire a government capable of the maximum POSSIBLE intervention into the lives of EVERYONE ON THE PLANET.

Small-government conservatives, my hairy white BUTT!

Well, you got me there. It must be the people. The Anglo-Saxon has need to build empires and the Swiss, Irish, Icelandic, etc. do not.

I have no need, desire, nor ambition to control or build an empire. I guess I'm not an American.