Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Express Rifles and Big Bores Only 9.3x57 vs 9.3x62 (Fixed title)

Ditto for Mule Deer. This thread is getting way of in the boonies.

Goto Steves Pages for some load info... http://stevespages.com/page8a.htm

Surf the web...I came across quite a bit of data on ALL the 9.3x?? when I was deciding which cartridge to use with my VZ-24 conversion. The old LA Tang model Rugers are almost identical to the VZ-24 in many respects.

The case capacity of the 9.3 or ANY of the x57 cases is roughly 62 to 65 gr H2O...the x63 is 72-76 gr H2O....about 16-17%...ANY reloading data for ANY caliber, for cases of 62-65 gr H2O CASE CAPACITY can be used, AT THE LOWER END, to develop reloading data for the x57, it doesn't matter the actual case LENGTH. It is the INTERNAL volume of the case that determines the reloading capacity within a reasonable range.

You could start with reloading data for a 308 size case as it has similar case capacity...the 358 Win or 338 Fed...and there is a 9.3 x 358(308) and a 375x308/358 if you dig deep enough...or use 8x57 or 9x57 data for heavy bullets and start on the low end of the scale and work up...

OR...because the x57 case is about 17% less case capacity than the X62 You can use ANY x62 data for individual bullet by weight, straight across the board, by REDUCING the charge weight by 20-22% and be at a beginning load for the 9.3x57.

Never could figue out why we complicate things other than the penchant for men to always go one-up on each other.

I don't have a 9.3x57 to compare actual velocities to the 9.3x63 so I can't speak to the actual velocity differences between these two specific cases, but I have compared a 7x57mm and a 7x57 AI, a 250 Sav and 250 Sav AI, and the same for a friends 257 R and 257 R AI, using the same rifles only rechambered and the chronoed differences held up in those three cases, roughly 2-3% of the actual case volume increase...

Loaded to the same pressures with the same bullets, powder, barrel length, etc, calculated or othewise, I've never seen a whole lot of increase in the velocity, the most being with the 250 Sav and 257 AI at 150 - 225 fs and that was because of an increase in pressure over factory loaded ammo...nothing in the 400 fs range, without some other change in parameters like pressure or barrel length, bullet weight etc...but each rifle does it's own thing.

All things being equal I would expect to see 70-150 fs increase in velocity between the two cases, which as far as the animal goes, ain't no thang.

Of course if you change anything, all bets are off. I have a 22" 7mmRM take-off barrel for a Savage I somehow acquired and a 26" 280 RM I built for my sis-in-law...I quarantee I get equal to or more velocity out of the 26" tube than the 22" tube and use about 10-12% less powder to do it...this is with all weights of bullets. The difference between the 280 RM and the 7mmRM is just about the same as the difference between the x57 and x62...16-17%...and that is also keeping the 280 RM at the lower SAAMI spec for that cartridge.

Maybe this info will help somewhat...but I'm guessing it will only serve to keep the pot stirred up.

NFG
Good basic advice on start loads. As always prudence pays off.
Randy

MD-

Did you, the proprietor of a publication with 'rifle loony' in the title, just use the word "need" in reference to a rifle ?

I do agree, however, and had intended to rechamber my x57 M98 to x62 but have decided against it... for now anyway... until the "need" should arise... even if in my imagination alone!

Sounds like we're still discussing 9.3x57 vs. x62 to me?



Thank you for this reference. It has a load for the x57 that I don't think I'd seen.



You're right, however I'd love to get some data on domestic powders... particularly those that my other rifles love... there isn't alot of that around, so I hoped that someone who had experience with the cartridge here might have insight.



Compared to finding lab-tested or at least trusted-peer-tested loads that I can reduce and start back up to, what you suggest above seems more complicated, but likely to be exactly what I end up doing, so I do appreciate the step-by-step description.



Yep. Likely the latter. That is ok, cuz this is a discussion board. I for one appreciate the opportunity to interact with other loonies who obsess over this minutae!

Thanks for the suggestions; I'll likely put them to use.

The best advise and data I've gotten have come from Steelhead concerning RL-15 and its ballistic similarities to a particular European powder that provides a safe starting point, so I'll run w/ that.

For goodness sakes, to convert a 9.3x57 to a 9.3x62 is such a minor conversion that I can do it with my fingernail and the 9.3x62 is a bunch more power regardless of what some have so printed!

Mule Deer,
Your correct of course in that the 98 Mausers are all disigned around the 57 MM cartridge but most have rather long magazine boxes and conversions are extremely simple if you go to the 06 or 9.3 and in many cases no work other than a rebarrel and rechambering is required, sometimes some rail work and lengthening is required..why this is I have no clue....I know the Brno Mod 21 and 22 Mausers have very long boxes and very lengthy throats for thier 8x57 and 7x57, to the point that you can get 8 and 7 x 57 Ackley IMP velocity from them.

Mr. A is right...and we're really talking about the difference between a 308 and 30-06, 358W and 35 Whelen, etc...you always gain by "something" going to a larger case, higher velocity or heavier bullet weight.

The X62 has a nice large case capacity as is at 75 gr H2O...the only way to get more is to step up to a larger diameter case which brings in other costly mods and if you need/want more thump you need to go to a longer receiver and/or a larger case anyway.

As an aside...you could do a wildcat using a RUM case shortened to about 2.35", shoulders blown out to about 0.530" with a 0.350" long neck and 3.30" COAL and get 100-105 gr H20 for a very nice, high capacity case and still use the M98 action....more cost and why????

Basically a lot of money for not much gain and the x62 case has a large case capacity already, will kill anything walking the planet when you do your job...Mine is my "pickup Queen", open sighted, it rides with me most of the time along with a 50 round box of ammo, no matter what other rifle(s) I happen to also have with me. It's set in a Boyds walnut stock and Limbsaver pad, all camo painted. I can keep 5 rounds in a 2" circle at 100 yards even with my lousy old eyes. When I had it scoped for load development, it kept a mag full of 286 Hornady bullets touching at 100M with the H4350 load I now use at ~2425fs. What more could you ask for???

When I did my conversion I did it quick and dirty using an already threaded, chambered and crowned screw in and go shooting Lothar Walther barrel...I wouldn't even needed a finger nail if I didn't want to do the bridge grinding and other "stuff".

If you really want to get into this reloading stuff you need some software like "Load from a Disk" or "Quick load"...or go online to some of the links to the Powley computers...any one of the three will give you all the powders in the correct burning ranges and starting loads for "local" powders...plus load up on reloading manuals...every one I have(all available ones) have quite a bit of loading data for the x62.

As far as caclulationg goes all I did was compare the case capacities of the two cases, divide the larger into the smaller and multiply by 100 to get the percent difference...not complicated at all...du pont powders are linear as far as pressure increase goes...this has been understood for more years than I want to admit to...so it's not rocket science and you can deduce that information from just about any reloading manual for any cartridge...or Goto Accurate Reloading's reloading pages...the linear steps can be seen in all the different loads for all the cartridges. Go to a Powley computer and you can work out the step by step process at your leisure.

All this information may be way beyond your needs, but someone might find it usefull.

FWIW...from Load from a Disk...9.3x57/24" bbl/286 Hornady/52gr Varget/2266 at 51,430CUP...9.3x62/24" bbl/286 Hornady/56.8 gr Varget/2417 at 50,998CUP.

My 9.3x62 with the same bullet likes 4350 which gives the highest velocity and the lowest pressure(according to the manuals). Varget is a very close second and is more accurate and not far from 4350 as far as pressure and velocity go...but not enough to sweat in all the departments.

Luck on your quest.

As much as I love my 9.3X62, If I had a nice old 9.3X57 potato tosser I would shoot it as is and use the money I would spend on rechambering for a 9.3X62 project.

The 9.3x57 is a balistic clone of the .358 Win. for all practical purposes and there is nothing wrong with that, It's a fine caliber..

I, personally prefer the added velocity of the 9.3x62 and a conversion runs about $50.00 around here..some do it by hand in a vise..

In my 26 inch tube, long throated Brno mod 21 Mauser with RL-15 I can get 2553 FPS with a 286 gr. Nosler, almost 2700 FPS with a 250 Barnes or a GS Customs monolithic, and 2400 FPS is a snap with the 320 gr. Woodleigh..Also the 300 gr. Swift might be a real good balanced killer at 2450 FPS..These are my established loads that I have been using for years..They are max but have never given me any problems in any kind of inclement weather.. I use RL-15 and H414 and brass lasts reasonably well at 9 or 10 loadings and 2 trims.

If I want a 9.3x57 I put less powder in the 9.3x62 case...Same with the 338 Win over the 338-06..I put less powder to duplicate the 338-06..It won't work the other way around..

Just an opinnion and an option for consideration, not saying its for everyone out there, just another point of view....

Starting big and downloading always works...I do it all the time...fit the bullet and velocity to the game. I like to eat right up to the hole and as cheap as a nickel cigar, so no use in wasting meat or money.

Not a whole lot of difference between .358, .366 or .375... literally "splitting hairs". You can get 100 fs difference between a "loose" barrel and a "tight" barrel in the same caliber using the same load.

Anyone doing any work in this sport for any length of time has lots of stories and "yes...But's" to cover all the nitpicking. In the real world once you pull the trigger it's all over but the shouting anyway...the animal didn't read the fine print, doesn't care a spit over a few feet per second and you do your job or have a red face and start blaming everything but the shooter. Dance with who you brung and enjoy the pleasures.

I think too many get all worked up over the miniscule things and forget the big picture.

I kept the meat locker full using a 22 LR for a lot of years...today I sometime wonder what the he** I'm doing carting around some cannon when a 223 with the right bullet will do the chores for deer/pronghorn at the ranges I usually shoot them...and my 250 Sav AI will handle all but the very biggest animals here in the US of A.

And I'm really scratching my head with building a 0.510 Rigby, having no desire to shoot anything bigger than a deer anyway...go figure????

The 9.3x57 Husqvarna points like a shotgun and is deer/pig MOA at 75 yards with the open sights. Had to tap the sight slightly left but was hitting right above the front sight with 286gr bullets.

It could be chambered in anything and I would like it, just a good, natural pointing rifle.