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In my likely futile hope of beating 7x57Steve at rimfire silhouette this year I'm going to have a CDS dial put on a spare Leupold VX-III I have and thus be able to more easily dial in the drop for the various targets. So, e-mailed Leupold and they're happy to do so and please provide the following info.
Cartridge: .22 Long Rifle Bullet Type: Win Super X Truncate Cone Hollow Point Bullet Weight: 40 grains Ballistic Coef: _______________ Muzzle Velocity: 1085_fps Altitude: 100 ft Temp: 70 f Sight-in Distance: 50 yds
So, herin lies the problem. Any idea on what the ballistic coefficient of the Winchester Super X 40 gr Trunated Cone HP is?(code X22LRSUBA)
I have three bricks of it and my Cooper loves it, delivering 5 shot dime sized groups at 50 yards. I did a bunch of searching and found these other .22's. Maybe I shouldn't sweat it and pick a middle range but the season doesn't start until April and I'll miss that match since I'll be in Texas Axis hunting so this isn't a rush but any help is appreciated.
RWS, 40-gr. R100 (213 4195), 1175 MV, 123 ME, 0.130 BC REMINGTON, 40-gr. LR Target Solid (6122) (6100), 1150 MV, 117 ME, 0.149 BC WINCHESTER, 40-gr. T22 LR Std. Vel. Solid (XT22LR), 1150 MV, 117 ME, 0.149 BC FEDERAL, 40-gr. LR Ultramatch Solid (UM1), 1140 MV, 115 ME, 0.149 BC FEDERAL, 40-gr. LR Match Solid (900), 1140 MV, 115 ME, 0.149 BC AGUILA, 40-gr. LR Std. Vel., 1135 MV, 114 ME, 0.158 BC PMC, 40-gr. Scoremaster LR Std. Vel. Solid (22SM), 1135 MV, 114 ME, 0.111 BC FIOCCHI, 40-gr. LR Biathlon Match Solid (22SM340), 1120 MV, 111 ME, 0.140 BC=Estimated AGUILA, 40-gr. LR Match Golden Eagle, 1100 MV, 110 ME, 0.109 BC LAPUA, 40-gr. LR Polar Biathlon Solid (4317023), 1100 MV, 107 ME, 0.108 BC ELEY, 40-gr. Tenex Ultimate EPS, 1085 MV, 105 ME, 0.150 BC ELEY, 40-gr. Match EPS, 1085 MV, 105 ME, 0.150 BC ELEY, 40-gr. Club, 1085 MV, 105 ME, 0.150 BC ELEY, 40-gr. Target, 1085 MV, 105 ME, 0.105 BC ELEY, 40-gr. Practice, 1085 MV, 105 ME, 0.150 BC ELEY, 40-gr. Standard, 1085 MV, 105 ME, 0.150 BC ELEY, 40-gr. Biathlon Match, 1085 MV, 105 ME, 0.150 BC ELEY, 40-gr. LR Silhouex, 1085 MV, 105 ME, 0.150 BC REMINGTON/ELEY,40-gr. Match EPS (RE22EPS), 1085 MV, 105 ME, 0.149 BC REMINGTON/ELEY, 40-gr. Club Extra (RE22CX), 1085 MV, 105 ME, 0.149 BC REMINGTON/ELEY, 40-gr. Target Rifle (RE22T), 1085 MV, 105 ME, 0.149 BC AGUILA, 40-gr. Match Rifle, 1080 MV, 100 ME, 0.197 BC SELLIER and BELLOT, 40-gr. LR SB Standard (SBA02201), 1084 MV, 104 ME, 0.131 BC SELLIER and BELLOT, 40-gr. LR SB Standard (SBA02202), 1084 MV, 104 ME, 0.131 BC FEDERAL, 40-gr. LR Ultramatch Solid (UM1B), 1080 MV, 105 ME, 0.139 BC FEDERAL, 40-gr. LR Target Solid (711B), 1080 MV, 105 ME, 0.138 BC FEDERAL, 40-gr. LR Match Solid (900B), 1080 MV, 105 ME, 0.139 BC RWS, 40-gr. LR Target Rifle (213 2478), 1080 MV, 100 ME, 0.109 BC CCI, 40-gr. LR Std. Vel. Solid (0032), 1070 MV, 100 ME, 0.105 BC CCI, 40-gr. LR Green Tag Comp. Solid (0033), 1070 MV, 100 ME, 0.105 BC CCI, 40-gr. LR Pistol Match Solid (0051), 1070 MV, 100 ME, 0.105 BC RWS, 40-gr. LR R50 (21304187), 1070 MV, 100 ME, 0.105 BC LAPUA, 40-gr. LR Master Solid (4317033), 1066 MV, 101 ME, 0.132 BC LAPUA, 40-gr. LR Midas L Solid (4317022), 1066 MV, 101 ME, 0.132 BC LAPUA, 40-gr. LR Midas M Solid (4317021), 1066 MV, 101 ME, 0.132 BC NORMA 1, 40-gr. Lead, Round Nose (15613), 1066 MV, 101 ME, 0.132 BC NORMA 2, 40-gr. Lead, Round Nose (15614), 1066 MV, 101 ME, 0.132 BC NORMA 3, 40-gr. Lead, Round Nose (15615), 1066 MV, 101 ME, 0.132 BC FIOCCHI, 40-gr. LR-Rifle Match Solid (22SM320), 1050 MV, 98 ME, 0.140 BC FIOCCHI, 40-gr. LR Match Trng. Solid (22M320), 1050 MV, 98 ME, 0.130 BC LAPUA, 40-gr. LR Super Club Solid (4317066), 1050 MV, 98 ME, 0.114 BC LAPUA, 40-gr. LR Std. Rifle Club Solid (43122420), 1050 MV, 98 ME, 0.114 BC PMC, 40-gr. Match Rifle (22MR), 1050 MV, 98 ME, 0.110 BC RWS, 40-gr. LR Rifle Match (213 4225), 1035 MV, 95 ME, 0.096 BC ELEY, 40-gr. Tenex Ultimate EPS Pistol, 1030 MV, 94 ME, 0.109 BC ELEY, 40-gr. Pistol Xtra, 1030 MV, 94 ME, 0.109 BC ELEY, 40-gr. Target Pistol, 1030 MV, 94 ME, 0.109 BC LAPUA, 40-gr. LR Pistol King Solid (4317031), 1033 MV, 95 ME, 0.130 BC LAPUA, 40-gr. LR Pistol Trainer Solid (4312260), 1033 MV, 95 ME, 0.130 BC ELEY, 40-gr. Pistol Match, 1000 MV, 89 ME, 0.140 BC FIOCCHI, 40-gr. LR Pistol Match Solid (22SM300), 984 MV, 86 ME, 0.130 BC FIOCCHI, 40-gr. LR Match Trng. Solid (22M300), 984 MV, 86 ME, 0.125 BC PMC, 40-gr. Match Pistol (22MP), 900 MV, 72 ME, 0.095 BC WINCHESTER, 40-gr. LR Lead HP (W22LRB), 1150 MV, 117 ME, 0.150 BC ELEY, 40-gr. LR Subsonic Xtra Plus, 1065 MV, 100 ME, 0.115 BC RWS, 40-gr. LR Subsonic HP (213 2494), 1000 MV, 90 ME, 0.092 BC LAPUA, 40-gr. LR Multi Match Solid (4317020), 1100 MV, 129 ME, 0.134 BC
Allen
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Wish I could help, but do not know. Thank you for the research though.
Steyr47
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Campfire Ranger
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Good luck with that. Wonder if anyone in the past has even thought of it.
"Keep thy heart with all diligence; for out of it are the issues of life." (Prov 4:23) Brother Keith
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Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
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Pugs, Is a question you might put to the RFC crowd. At what distances are you shooting? If you're heading out to 100 yards or more you might want to consider shooting at those distances to see how it does...out yonder...before you commit your scope mod to the project.
I am..........disturbed.
Concerning the difference between man and the jackass: some observers hold that there isn't any. But this wrongs the jackass. -Twain
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Campfire Ranger
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Dan, Rimfire metallic silhouette is shot as follows Gallina (chicken) targets at 40 yards Javelina (pig) targets at 60 yards Guajalote (turkey) targets at 77 yards Borrego (ram) targets at 100 yards I shot first match last year, after shooting hi-power silhouette a couple years, and we found it a lot more fun. I did adjust the VX-II on rifle between strings but wanted an easier way to do so. The target or M1 turret is a bit ungainly for a nice looking rifle that I also use for a woods rifle. I looked over at RFC and didn't find much. http://benchrest.com/forums/ had most of the data I found. The whole issue may be pretty petty and I should just pick one and go with it.
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Depends on the range. IIRC, the original official distances are in meters, with yards as an option.
Much of the character and details of the various silhouette games come from it's origin in Mexico.
Gaining popularity is the yet unsanctioned "mini-BPCR" .22 silhouette event. 50-200 meters under BPCR silhouette rules. The official/unofficial national championship is the Tornado Alley match near Oklahoma City in May.
Pugs et all, I admit to being technically challenged, but I've never had much luck calculating .22 rimfire trajectories and sight settings. Even lot-to-lot ammo variation adds to the challenge. I have to just do it empirically, by actual shooting.
Paul
Stupidity has its way, while its cousin, evil, runs rampant.
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Pull one of the bullets, measure it, apply JBM ballistics calculators; http://www.jbmballistics.com/cgi-bin/jbmdrag-5.0.cgi...but I think, for .22 you need to factor in how consistent the powder and primer charges are coming from the factory. In my experience, those seem to have a bigger accuracy affect than BC in rimfires. You could find the most consistent ammo for your gun, then get one of those .22 bullet nose cutters to apply your own preferred meplat.
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JeffG
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The whole issue may be pretty petty and I should just pick one and go with it. a good many things that we do, as shooters, night be considered petty, by some... good luck in your quest, and post pics of your competitions... always been fascinated by the temptation of rimfire sillywet...
"Chances Will Be Taken"
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All, Thanks much for the suggestions and I'm particularly intrigued by Jeff's idea of pulling a bullet and checking it out. 7x57Steve and I have talked several times about what affects rimfire accuracy. He has measured rim thickness and didn't believe groups improved significantly when he sorted by that but he has had very good results in group improvement with grouping by weight so I think I'll give that a try (once the snow melts enough to find the target holders at the range! ) The three bricks I have of this ammo are all from the same lot so I hope they'll be more consistent than just random boxes. Safely ensconced here at the house and my latest woodworking project all glued and clamped I thought why not take the BC's I have and see how much difference it makes in an external ballistics calculator? I ran the lowest and highest and a couple in the middle. The answer? Not much. MV of 1100 fps (I bumped the Winchester spec up 15 fps/inch since it was fired out of a 5" barrel) and standard day (sighted in at 50 yards) BC ****** 40 yards * 60 yards * 80 yards * 100 yards .096 ______ +.4 ______ -.7 ______ -3.3 ______ -7.5 .108 ______ +.4 ______ -.7 ______ -3.2 ______ -7.3 .111 ______ +.4 ______ -.7 ______ -3.2 ______ -7.3 .150 ______ +.4 ______ -.7 ______ -3.1_______ -6.9 So, in theory, I should just pick a middle of the road BC and go with that. If I screw it up I won't be out but the $70 Leupold charges for the change and I'll end up with a scope with an easily adjustable turret that I'll just have to figure it out at the range. I'll let you know how it goes. Allen
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Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
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Pugs, what you might consider is what ammo shoots best for you at 100 yards. The ammo you reference is subsonic and that's positive. Working against it is the truncated HP form which likely has a lower BC than most RN match ammo. Flat meplats carry baggage (drag)like that and HP designs are considered FP for BC calculation, although the meplat diameter is significant in figuring it.
OTOH, there is the issue of finding other ammo in this day and age....
I am..........disturbed.
Concerning the difference between man and the jackass: some observers hold that there isn't any. But this wrongs the jackass. -Twain
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Pugs, what you might consider is what ammo shoots best for you at 100 yards. That's why Steve and I split a case. It's very accurate in my Cooper. The only thing that beats it is the Lapua Midas M at $15/50 . Given I shoot the matches for fun I can't see doing that.
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Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
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10-4. Carry on and good luck!
Ya know, you can come up with better data than manufacturer's BC simply by shooting two known distances and working the drop figures a little.
I am..........disturbed.
Concerning the difference between man and the jackass: some observers hold that there isn't any. But this wrongs the jackass. -Twain
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I never paid much attention to BC's of .22 rimfires.
I always found wind drift to be much more troublesome. Try a 3 to 5 mph breeze in the trajectory program...plays hell with groups.
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Pugs .... Chrono it at the muzzle and then at 25, 50, 75 & 100 yards. There is a formula on the web (somewhere) that you can use to calculate the BC. Good Luck with that! Let us know what you discover.
George Associate Gypsy Order of Sleepless Knights ... That is when I carried you ...
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I am coming out with .9415.
Someone can check my math.
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Allen,
Thought I would help you out here and give you a chance when we shoot.
Pull the bullets on all of the cartridges, and re- insert them backwards. The flat base of the bullet, when reversed, causes a much more effective force on the targets. And you won't have to worry about BC, because it will be a really low number.
Trust me on this, but please do not reveal this secret to anyone.
Your friend,
Steve
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Gotta love a helpful shooting buddy!
I've read that there are shooters trying to load .22 rimfires with black powder, looking for primed cases and such. Maybe backward bullets loaded over fine black powder would be the ultimate.
No end to what some folks try to chase in this shooting business.
Paul
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Allen, Had another good idea.
You could sight it in at say, 60yds, and then measure the actual deviation from dead on at 40,77 and 100 yds and give that data to Leupold and then they could put the correct dots or hash marks on your scope. I'm guessing this would provide greater accuracy than a computation involving BC, velocity and distance.
But I would only use this approach if reversing the bullets did not work!!
Steve
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Steve, I knew I could count on you to be as helpful as usual. Remind me to get you a couple of those energy drinks with extra caffeine before the April match. That extra movement really ups the odds on the chickens! Allen
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Folks, I finally found an e-mail address for Winchester Ammunition, albeit their police support division, and they were nice enough to reply that the BC is .109245. So, that puts it right around many of the others. Problem solved! If anyone else needs info on Winchester ammo, a Bravo Zulu on customer response to; Paul Nowak Senior Technical Specialist Winchester Law Enforcement Ammunition PFNowak olin.com
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