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Joined: May 2005
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: May 2005
Posts: 17,149 Likes: 2 |
Take just one kook(they are out there gentlemen) have them set up a machine gun in the park near the Washington Monument & the field of fire would be the White House, Commerce Building, Treasury Building, Executive Office Building, & the Ellipse.
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The only building that offers a field of return fire is the roof of the FBI Building(J.F. Hoover). If they were at the Washington Monument I suspect the Secret Service sniper on the roof of the White House would make short work of them in a few seconds. Just saying.
If something on the internet makes you angry the odds are you're being manipulated
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Joined: May 2007
Posts: 13,957
Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: May 2007
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Back to Harry Reid who I very much dislike. I have been told that although he is a left wing freak his voting record has supported gun owners and gun rights. This seems strange to me because of how we stands on everything else. I still hope he is voted out of office!!!!!!!!! I have seen things indicating he gets a good grade, but a good voting record to go along with it may or may not be the case. GOA lists what they base their ratings on, but from everything I have seen NRA does not. Last year during the Holder approving vote someone at NRA let it out that the Holder vote wouldn't be figured in to the candidate ratings so (if true) that goes a long way towards explaining how an NRA "A" can be a consistent anti-gun voter. The GOA lies more in a month than the NRA has lied in the past 100 years. Yes, the NRA defines it's grading system. The Holder vote was a confirmation hearing, the NRA grading system is based upon LEGISLATION. This is typical GOA bullshyt. If these ass#$%@& spent as much time actually defending the 2nd Amendment as they do attacking the NRA, trying to justify their existence, then I might listen to what they say. As it is, when I see GOA, I file it mentally with the Brady Bunch in the realm of believability.
![[Linked Image]](http://militarysignatures.com/signatures/member651.png)
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Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 54,284
Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 54,284 |
Some of my buds should have one of those micro-chips planted in their asses!! Between their eyes may be more appropriate.  Most of the attraction of a machine gun of what ever type is in the novelty of the damn thing. I have fired MG34s and 42 all the browning family, M60 and the RPs. The care and feeding of those things is horrendous no matter how much fun they are. We won't talk about sub guns. When the novelty wore off in most cases folks who had them would want to get rid of them because besides just burning rounds there ain't much you can actually do with them. As to the other deal if somebody ain't demonstrably crazy why should I care what he possesses. I am not all that happy with the doctrine of prior restraint imposed on normal people. Speak of mass destruction. A stolen LPG truck can be made into a rolling bomb quickly, easily and cheaply. You see LPG trucks rolling down the highway every day. Somebody MIGHT rig one so we better outlaw them, right? BCR If they were legal, I'd probably have a couple of full auto M-4's instead of the semi's I now own. I wouldn't fire them on fa much though. As you say, just too expensive. Heck, I seldom shoot our AR's much as it is. They are mainly SHTF weapons and not fun guns to me-though they are very fun to shoot. I got my first AR in probably 1982 and have had one or more almost constantly since then. I like shooting old west guns more.
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Joined: Oct 2002
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Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
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If they came under machine gun fire I doubt it. Lets all hope that nothing like this ever happens. There were only concrete barriers to stand behind. Prior to 9-11 snipers were only on the roof when the president left & entered the White House. Now its 24/7. They may have added more weather protection recently since I haven't been on the roof in a few years. No building in downtown D.C. is allowed taller than the FBI building. The kook that was shot at the Pentagon could have created major deaths & injuries if he had arrived earlier. A group of school kids were on a tour(I saw them on the public ring several times) & left shortly before the shooting. This area is easy to access from either the parking lot or Metro(subway).
Life Members SCI & NRA. NRA Instructor & RSO. What have YOU done to support hunting & gun rights?
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Joined: Jul 2007
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Campfire Tracker
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Some of my buds should have one of those micro-chips planted in their asses!! What's that all about? Because I believe that citizens should have the same basic weapons that the police and military have? If I'm not mistaken, that's exactly what the Founder's had in mind when they drafted the Second Amendment, not the protection of hunting and target shooting. I see that the individuals making most of the arguments for restricting access to FA weapons and making some of us seem unreasonable in our interpretation of the Second Amendment are from the DC area and the left coast. Maybe you guys need to rethink your worldview, or at least be honest in your assessment of what our rights entail. The thinking that "reasonable" or "common sense" gun safety laws are needed is the same arguments that I hear from HCI and other anti gun groups. If you agree with their view of things, just say so.
If the American People allow private banks to control the issuance of their currency, first by inflation, then by deflation, the banks..., will deprive the People of all their Property,...Thomas Jefferson
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Joined: Jul 2009
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Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
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If you were even in the military you would know. The many members of the Fire that have served know what machine guns are capable of. Take just one kook(they are out there gentlemen) have them set up a machine gun in the park near the Washington Monument & the field of fire would be the White House, Commerce Building, Treasury Building, Executive Office Building, & the Ellipse. In less than five minutes three or four hundred people could be killed & wounded leaving work & visiting the area. The only building that offers a field of return fire is the roof of the FBI Building(J.F. Hoover). Under the best of circumstances it would take SWAT about five-eight minutes to respond. Don't think that this scenario hasn't been considered & is of concern to law enforcement. How about the kook that used a SKS to shoot people at the CIA entrance years ago. What if he had a fully auto rifle? What about the shooting at the Pentagon several weeks ago. I had just left from this entrance & was on the subway platform prior to the incident. This is just an example of many that could create the biggest killing field in U.S. history. The difference between semi-auto & a machine gun is rate of fire. As devastating as a semi auto may be its nothing to compare to a machine gun. Imagine if the kids at Columbine HS or the Texas Clock Tower had machine guns. I was simply implying with my mention of grenades how ridiculous this entire topic is. Incidental, grenades are pretty cool until you see body parts scattered over about half an acre. I am involved with the fight for hunters & shooters rights & will support the NRA,SCI, & other outdoor groups in every way possible. For the record other than machine guns & filling out a simple form(which does help prevent "some" illegal purchases) I don't believe in any other gun restrictions. Just one tragedy with a machine gun involved hundreds killed would result in more gun legislation than any of us ever dreamed possible. Those that believe otherwise are welcome to their opinions. I have shot several different full autos and don't see your fantasies having much basis in fact. Have you ever fired one? You are aware you are supporting an organization which has called for throwing someone who switches out the pistol grips on an FAL/AK/G3 variant from a US to a foreign version to be thrown in prison, right?
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Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
Joined: Jul 2006
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Son, you obviously haven't a clue who you're talking to.
The pessimist complains about the wind; the optimist expects it to change; the realist adjusts the sails.
William Arthur Ward
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The GOA lies more in a month than the NRA has lied in the past 100 years. Yes, the NRA defines it's grading system.
The Holder vote was a confirmation hearing, the NRA grading system is based upon LEGISLATION. This is typical GOA bullshyt. If these ass#$%@& spent as much time actually defending the 2nd Amendment as they do attacking the NRA, trying to justify their existence, then I might listen to what they say. As it is, when I see GOA, I file it mentally with the Brady Bunch in the realm of believability.
OK, let's see 10 NRA candidate ratings and each piece of legislation that the NRA based those ratings on. So you don't consider voting for Holder an anti-gun act? BTW the "Holder not being held against them" story was not from GOA.
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Campfire Tracker
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Son, you obviously haven't a clue who you're talking to.
Should I? One anti-gunner looks the same as another to me.
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Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
Joined: Jul 2006
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Back to Harry Reid who I very much dislike. I have been told that although he is a left wing freak his voting record has supported gun owners and gun rights. This seems strange to me because of how we stands on everything else. I still hope he is voted out of office!!!!!!!!! I have seen things indicating he gets a good grade, but a good voting record to go along with it may or may not be the case. GOA lists what they base their ratings on, but from everything I have seen NRA does not. Last year during the Holder approving vote someone at NRA let it out that the Holder vote wouldn't be figured in to the candidate ratings so (if true) that goes a long way towards explaining how an NRA "A" can be a consistent anti-gun voter. The GOA lies more in a month than the NRA has lied in the past 100 years. Yes, the NRA defines it's grading system. The Holder vote was a confirmation hearing, the NRA grading system is based upon LEGISLATION. This is typical GOA bullshyt. If these ass#$%@& spent as much time actually defending the 2nd Amendment as they do attacking the NRA, trying to justify their existence, then I might listen to what they say. As it is, when I see GOA, I file it mentally with the Brady Bunch in the realm of believability. ============= Isn't that the truth. The GOA hates being the wanna be little brother!
The pessimist complains about the wind; the optimist expects it to change; the realist adjusts the sails.
William Arthur Ward
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Joined: Jul 2006
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Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 62,043 |
Son, you obviously haven't a clue who you're talking to.
Should I? One anti-gunner looks the same as another to me. ======= You're not a gunner, son. Were you under some mistaken impression you were a gunner? I can't imagine anyone desiring your assistance with anything having to do with the 2A. Guys like you are fatal to the cause and the reason why groups such as the NRA, are most content knowing you fellate the GOA instead. That's if and when you pay your dues , hypocrite,
The pessimist complains about the wind; the optimist expects it to change; the realist adjusts the sails.
William Arthur Ward
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Campfire Tracker
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Fine, but tbear has shown himself to be an anti-gunner as you have. After all, you are the guys who belong to a group calling for people who switch out furniture on rifles to be thrown in federal prison.
Apparently they aren't too content considering the constant begging for money. Based on your emotional responses to every topic under the sun I would suspect you would be more apt to be fellating than most anyone here. Never have seen straight males over the age of about 10 behave in the manner you and others like you behave.
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Campfire Tracker
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I have done more for hunters rights & pro gun issues in one month than you will in a life time  . Yes, I have fired, qualified & used in combat machine guns(30 & 50MM), 105MM tank cannons, mortars, M1, M14, &.45. At any rate, we agree to disagree. Good shooting.
Life Members SCI & NRA. NRA Instructor & RSO. What have YOU done to support hunting & gun rights?
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Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
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I agree with him.
Why do people such as yourself, who evidently think that the general public cannot be trusted with full auto firearms, always move up the scale in lethality to tanks, artillery, and nukes to try and build the straw man and then tear it down? Why don't you be honest and admit that you don't trust your fellow citizens, and that you agree with the left that we should all be restricted as to how we exercise our rights. It sure would make for more honest debate.
What is an M70 tank anyway? There has never been such an AFV in US inventory outside the experimental stage. Even if there were, I would have no problem with someone having one, as many US citizens now own WW II vintage AFV's with none having been used in a crime.
Answer the question with an answer not with another question. Maybe if I simplify, are there any weapons that the ordinary untrained citizen should not be permitted to own? This is not a trick question. There was an M70 Tank, it Replaced the M48 in the mid sixties. It was armed with a 105mm gun, two 30cal machine guns and one 50cal BMG. How do I know? I drove and fired them. In fact I still have my 70 ton drivers license, somewhere with my discharge papers. It is people like you who do more damage to reasonable gun owners than all the antis. You provide the ammo for them to throw at us.
www.paracay.comIt's better to live rich than die rich. Live simply so that I may simply live large.
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Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 24,445 Likes: 6
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 24,445 Likes: 6 |
Arguing over NRA is not gonna go anywhere.
Are they perfect?
NO, but they are the best we have fighting for our right to keep and bear arms, bar none.
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Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
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I thought the M60 replaced the M48.
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Posts: 6,418
Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
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I agree with him.
Why do people such as yourself, who evidently think that the general public cannot be trusted with full auto firearms, always move up the scale in lethality to tanks, artillery, and nukes to try and build the straw man and then tear it down? Why don't you be honest and admit that you don't trust your fellow citizens, and that you agree with the left that we should all be restricted as to how we exercise our rights. It sure would make for more honest debate.
What is an M70 tank anyway? There has never been such an AFV in US inventory outside the experimental stage. Even if there were, I would have no problem with someone having one, as many US citizens now own WW II vintage AFV's with none having been used in a crime.
Answer the question with an answer not with another question. Maybe if I simplify, are there any weapons that the ordinary untrained citizen should not be permitted to own? This is not a trick question. There was an M70 Tank, it Replaced the M48 in the mid sixties. It was armed with a 105mm gun, two 30cal machine guns and one 50cal BMG. How do I know? I drove and fired them. In fact I still have my 70 ton drivers license, somewhere with my discharge papers. It is people like you who do more damage to reasonable gun owners than all the antis. You provide the ammo for them to throw at us. And you agree with them and diminish our rights. Are there weapons that shouldn't be allowed for private ownership? Sure, but that list doesn't include FA weapons, or any weapons that individual LE and military have available. Why should our public servants be better armed that the citizens they serve? That is how citizens become serfs. I suggest that you do some more research on just exactly what the Founder's had in mind when they drafted the Second Amendment. Reasonable restrictions weren't their intent; keeping tyranny at bay was. As to the M70, it was my understanding that it was an experimental AFV developed with Germany that was abandoned due to cost, and never reached operational status. Sorry if I was mistaken, but my point about plenty of US citizens owning AFV's without them being used in criminal activity still stands. Your lack of comfort with their ownership should have no bearing on it.
If the American People allow private banks to control the issuance of their currency, first by inflation, then by deflation, the banks..., will deprive the People of all their Property,...Thomas Jefferson
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Posts: 3,058
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I have done more for hunters rights & pro gun issues in one month than you will in a life time . Yes, I have fired, qualified & used in combat machine guns(30 & 50MM), 105MM tank cannons, mortars, M1, M14, &.45. At any rate, we agree to disagree. Good shooting. And sounds like you support a group that wants people thrown in to prison for swapping out rifle stocks so what ever you do in a month gets negated by that.
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Joined: Jul 2009
Posts: 3,058
Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
Joined: Jul 2009
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There was an M70 Tank, it Replaced the M48 in the mid sixties. It was armed with a 105mm gun, two 30cal machine guns and one 50cal BMG. How do I know? I drove and fired them. In fact I still have my 70 ton drivers license, somewhere with my discharge papers.
You sure you don't mean a T-70? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/T-70 Those were in commmon use and it would explain many of your positions.
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Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 1,515
Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 1,515 |
Am I to believe that the consensus of the majority of those participating in this discussion are of the opinion that there should be no restrictions on the private ownership of machine guns?
Just asking.
Why are you blaming the tool for the actions of the user? What's available at your common home improvement store is far more deadly than a machinegun. I assume from the tenor of your response that you believe there should be no restiction on the possession of machineguns. Not at all am I blaming the machine for the use the operator puts it to. I am not sure about the store anology is correct. what at your local home improvement store can kill at 1,000 yards, or 100 yards? Now, next question; should you or I be allowed to mount a .50BMG in a turret atop my suburban home fully armed with 10,000 rounds? Just asking. This is not a trick question A simple yes or no will suffice. Correct, no restrictions on machineguns. 50BMG atop your home, sure. Until you actually do something illegal with it. Restrictions for what you might do are invalid. Should you have your sex organs removed because you might rape someone? Your hands removed because you might strangle someone? What's available at the home improvement store has the potential to kill many thousands of people without the terrorist being anywhere near the scene, even miles away. Fear of machineguns is misguided at best.
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