Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Hunter's Campfire NRA not agressive enough??

Dear Bigbuck 215,

I am sure what you say is true. I admire the NRA enormously and simply cannot understand why shooters in Canada and other members of the British commonwealth do not adopt NRA tactics. They work and the tactics adopted in other countries don't work.

I hunted with Colonel Merle Prebble who created the NRA's ILA. He told me he could put two tons of mail on a legislator's doorstep in five days. Tough to read the gossip from mom when you have to wade through that much mail.

I get tired of Europeans and Brits and eastern Canadian hunters and shooters saying we don't operate like the NRA here because our "traditions" are different because the traditon they are really supporting is cowardice.

Having said that I have great respect for the hunters and shooters in Alberta who drew a line in the sand and simply refused to register their guns.

They stopped the federal Liberal party of Canada in its tracks and that changed the momentum so now there is momentum to get rid of the long gun registry.

The problem is the Liberal party brought so many criminals into the Canada in the last 20 years I think the Liberals have big organized crime money behind them and nowdays its enormous.

I know a reporter who worked at the TO Star and he said there is a rumour floating around Ottawa that a Liberal Attoney General named Francis Fox got his hands on an illegal $30 million slush fund to jam gun laws down the throats of Canadians. Allegedly the foreign source of the money is non-Canadian George Soros but none of this has ever been proved.

But it is very odd that an anti-gun group that seems to have no support at all led by a woman named Wendy Kukier suddenly sprang out of the woodwork and is now widely quoted by Canadian mainstream Liberal media (in particular the TO Star) whenever she opens her mouth.

I don't think her group has much if any membership. Kinda like the million mom march which had less than 300 bought and paid for members. i think Soros was involved in that.

Its very common in Canada for bogus public interest groups to appear to give politicians an excuse to change legislation for which there is no public support.

These groups are bogus, agenda driven, and financed and planted by outside interests who always hide in the shadows.

You are a bit misinformed about SCI. There are 188 chapters world wide with membership of over 45,000. Hardly a few thousand. SCI is ran by the membership with almost all unpaid volunteers. In most cases board members travel at their own expense with perhaps some travel reimbursed by chapters. A few permanent paid employees are located at the headquarters in Phoenix, AZ. A museum is located at the headquarters with interactive animal displays. School kids tour the museum frequently. On Capital Hill SCI maintains an active lobby headquarters to protect your right to hunt. Excellent relations have been developed with the Congressional Sportsmen Caucus, many Congressmen & women, & committees that are involved with wildlife. Each year chapters send educators to the American Wilderness Leadership Schools in Jackson Hole, Wyoming. & Maine. Over 2000 educators & 26 from my area in DC have learned about our environment & conservation. Woven into this program is the value of hunting as a method of resource management. Many educators that attend are anti hunting & anti guns. Probably over 85% change their position & locally we have had some purchase guns & bows & even start to hunt. This has been an enormously successful program. We also have a project called Safari In A Box that contains wildlife training material, skulls, pelts, teeth, tusks, etc. that is given to schools & libraries. This is a wonderful tool for teaching kids about wildlife. Each cost $750 & my DC chapter has donated over 25 with a long waiting list. SCI is involved with Wounded Warriors & Veterans. We take WW & veterans on hunting & fishing trips & our chapter alone has shipped over 1,000 pounds of comfort items, phone cards, hunting videos, thank you notes, & hunting magazines & books to our troops. The NRA provides a free membership to any service member deployed & has donated hats, shirts, & magazines. SCI provides Sensory Safaris to the blind that allows mounted animals, skulls, & pelts to be touched. A permanent Sensory Safari is on display at the National Center For The Blind in Baltimore, Md. SCI donates many thousands of pounds of wildlife to Hunters For The Hungry & pays for a lot of processing. Our chapter alone donates $2,000 each year for processing. SCI sends Blue Bags with members hunting Africa that contain school & medical supplies & are greatly needed in many parts of Africa. Many member chapters also teach wildlife programs to students & boy/girl scouts. We attend a large scout function each year with wildlife training material & also teach the Eddie Eagle children's gun safety program. Like all hunting & shooting organizations we need additional members to provide the funding to continue these programs. Why don't you join & learn even more about the value of SCI.

SCVI's 45,000 is not the NRA's 4.5 million. The NRA has 100 times more votes than SCI. The NRA is the leader.

Your educational program is a good idea but I am talking about sheer power and not PR spin or good deeds.

I feel certain that even if Mother Teresa were resurrected and gave SCI her endorsement that no politician would notice.

Politicians count heads and whoever leads in that category has their undivided attention.

The numbers determine who they listen to and who they put on the back burner. SCI is wise to ally itself with the NRA but SCI is the junior partner.

You have your head so far up your a$$ you can't see day light. The NRA is involved with gun rights & is not or will ever be the leader in defending hunters rights. SCI is the defender of hunters rights. Frequently, SCI will partner with NWTF, RMEF, & other outdoor organizations to create a coalition of outdoor groups to defeat issues that will limit sport hunting. On occasion NRA will join the coalition, but this is not the norm. When have you have walked the halls on Capital Hill & met with Congressmen & women to discuss hunters rights? SCI board members will be working with their lobbyist group to visit Congressional members the second week of May. Yes, many politicians do notice SCI & respect hunters rights & do meet with us. Feel free to join us on Capital Hill & be enlightened. Oh, I forget you are Canadian yet you know more about Congress that those of us that spent time on Capital Hill. I'm actively involved with NRA & their fight to protect gun rights. SCI & NRA do on occasion work together, but neither is a junior partner either on hunters rights or gun issues. Our SCI chapter is the DC area is very unique since our founder was a former president of NRA & we are very closely aligned. Many members of our SCI chapter are also NRA Life Members, instructors, & RSO's. In the DC area we work very closely together on educational programs & other mutually beneficial projects. Each have their own agendas. You need to get informed & not spread BS or is this just another of your trolling post like on the African Forum? JJ Hack had you figured out long ago.

The NRA has the votes.

In a democracy votes are the bottom line. Fortunately most NRA members are also hunters.

I would like to see SCI have 4.5 million votes but at the moment they don't.

You can do all the back slapping and glad handing you want in Washington but in the end its the votes and how they are used that counts.

Then why don't you join?

Tbear;

Leaving aside JBurner (who is Liar24), you are doing a fine job of supporting the arguments of FC and others who are critiquing the NRA for being arrogant, defensive, non-aggressive, and more motivated by $$ and continued operations than defense of the 2A.

Not your intent, but you're proving a lot of their points.

Three direct questions re: NRA operations that perhaps you can answer/justify.

1) Why maintain Joaquin Jackson as a Board Member, given his stated positions on the 2A and classes of firearms?

2) Ditto that in regards to support of Mark Begich.

3). Explain why the NRA opposed Heller at every step until the last possible minute when it was obvious the case was going to be heard by the SCOTUS? They could have, and indeed tried to, compromise/give that one away, and have been doing likewise with Chicago, and other cases.

Well I know I have heard the NRA support background checks, and I think I have a pretty good handle how members feel about those.

The nearest SCI chapter to where I live is 400 miles away.It has had the same president for 20 years. I hear he uses his position to try to barter for free or reduced rate safaris qalthough I am not sure that is true.

I have belonged to SCI off and on over the years although not at the moment and have been to a few conventions but began to wonder about the organization when for example I realized that hit man Joe Banana's lawyer was serving as president.

In contrast I am very, let me say extremely, impressed with the NRA and how it operates but the NRA deals with American and not Canadian politicians.

What I would really like to see is the Canadian shooting sports adopt NRA tactics to deal with Canadian politicians, make them responsible to their local constituents and not to the party whip.

I would like to see the Canadian hunting and shooting clubs divided up into voting districts to deal with with both federal (gun laws) and provincial (game laws).

Then raise money at DU type dinners. Look at the maps of the voting districts to see where the guys in black hats are weak. Use the dinner money to attack the weak hostiles with TV ads although I am not even sure that is legal in Canada.

In Canada radio and TV stations are licenced and are subject to political manipulation. News papers are the only free press. Anyone can start a newsppaer. They do not need a licence. So what can be done is to raise money to print thousands of flyers that gun club members then deliver them door to door the night before an election.

I have helped do this in Canada. Its legal and it works. That is the kind of organization I would gladly join but at the moment it does not exist.

I continue to be amazed that shooters from around the world do not fly to Virginia, visit the NRA headquarters and ask them what to do. That is what I did.

I met Wayne Lapierre, Tanya Metaska and Merle Prebble and they could not have been more helpful nor did they have any desire to interfere with canadian politics.

But back in Canada it all fell on deaf ears and same the organizations that were losing the fight 30 years ago are still losing the fight today and do not change their ways.

They say a sure sign of mental illness is continuing to repeat a behavior that did not work in the hopes that next time around the results will be different. But I think its mostly big frog in a little pond syndrome.

Tbear,

I am off to Africa in the morning if the volcano does not act up. I was supposed to go yesterday but it did act up. I have to close this conversation for a few weeks.

JBurner just pulled the classic Liar24 move(s), if anyone paying attention.

Of course, St. Andrews, SC isn't Canuckistan or Africa, and I doubt that Wayne or Tanya or Merle are visiting in Mama Evelyn's basement, either.

I don't know what you mean by that, Barkoff. Supports background checks as opposed to? What?

The statutes set out the disabilities which prevent a citizen from purchasing a firearm. You fill our a form, and your responses are verified in a more or less instant background check. What other way would you do it?

A waiting period while they do a background check? or elimination of all disabilities from purchase for felons, illegals, mental patients, etc, so that there is no reason to do one?

I'm not sure what you are asking here. I have read the NRA supports background checks to make sure an individual who his buying a firearm is not precluded from buying one. The alternative being, said ex-felon or known gang banger walks into a store and buys one, then carries it out illegally. No background check, no way of ever knowing until said ex-con is found with the firearm.

My understanding is that the NRA supports the waiting period and background check, many here do not.

Are you seeing a flaw in my thinking here? Wouldn't be the first time my reading comprehension has failed me.

the issue isn't the background check, it's the fact that the law forbids sales to certain people. the NRA supports instant background checks as an alternative to waiting periods.

so if you oppose instant background checks, you either support waiting periods, or changing the statute so anybody can buy a firearm. I don't think there's much support for either of those options.

nor is there much support for just relying on the person filling out the form, since Achmed, Jose, or Jamal with a fake ID will have no qualms about lying on the form.

You are right Steve, just did some googling and reading, my mistake.

look up " Bonus Army " and see how the Gov. and our famous heroes treated our vets and civilians.

I was an NRA member from 1996 to 2009, and I don't recall seeing one article in American Rifleman about repealing the NFA of 1934 or the GCA of 1968. Not one article about owning or running machineguns as a civilian. If the NRA is really serious about our 2A rights, why do they not want us to be as well-armed as the military (rifles/light/heavy machineguns)?? After all, we'd have to go through a portion of the military to get to the occupants of the three branches of FedGov if they got too big for their britches, which is really what the 2A is all about: gutting an unresponsive/hostile government.

That's because if you had been a member during the 1930s to 1960s you would have found the NRA promoting NFA 34 & GCA 68. They are still milking the GCA sporting purposes for all it is worth.

Southernutah,
I am kinda surprised that anyone would bring up the bonus marchers of post WW I but I am really glad you did. The government at that time was absolutely disgraceful and should have been overhauled right then. Let us not forget that our government at that time was made up of unashamedly Socialist Liberal wackos such as Wilson and his supporters for The League of Nations (now the United Nations for you younger folks who weren't taught any real history).
The Bolshevik Russians (Lenin & Marx) spawned the likes of Stalin and created a political climate in europe favorable for the rising of Fascism under Hitler & Mussolini. Distinctly speaking, these Liberal Socialist bastards of that time and their decendants, have ruined the entire century for the rest of us and brought our parents and us WW II, Korea, and Vietnam. They started the process whereby our own government turned against its citizenry, failed to uphold the Constitution and the Bill of Rights, continued the illegal conscription of citizens for the military that Lincoln started during the Civil War, created classes of people like the european aristocracy which they so greatly admired, and implemented illegal and unconstitutional income taxation to insure that somebody else's pig would be roasted to feed the new, lazy, non working Socialist politicians and voters, thereby insuring class warfare so bitter that it would never displace their Socialist Liberal government.
Most of our troubles began after 1899 and continued to mount until the election of Ronald Reagan. Only then did our country realize that they could start to return to our more conservative roots and stop embracing Socialism in its many forms. The battle to return to a more conservative and American Constitutional form of government is still being waged today with the likes of Clinton, Gore, Kerry, and Obama. Fortunately, I believe the worm is turning and these Socialist lice are about to become extinct in America because Americans have realized that there is no free lunch and seen these dispicable people import foreign immigrants (both legal & illegal) looking for free lunches, to vote in our elections and counter the growing tide of dissatisfied American citizens whom they are unable to fool into supporting their Socialist Quack ideas any longer.
Hell, I believe we have one of these immigrant and possibly illegal guys for President and I'll bet a lot of you do also. The point of all of this being, is that we and others like us, need to ensure that this madness is not passed down to our children like it was to our parents and to us. The 2nd Amendment insures that we will still retain the power to shape and change our government and to ensure the continued freedom of self determination over institutional slavery by voting or other means. Any Questions?

Flower Child

I'm not involved in the politics of the NRA. Instead I try to teach kids & others gun safety, taught a turkey hunting seminar to about 50 kids, WW's, women, & prospective hunters. I have assisted in taking WW's on hunting trips, shipped over 1000 pounds of items to our troops in Iraq, & furnished free NRA memberships to those deployed in the military. I really take offense at your statement about being arrogant, defensive, non-aggressive, & more motivated by $$ & continued operations than defense of 2A. Yes, I know these were primarily directed at the NRA. It seems to me some like to dissect everything & work diligently to find something to criticize. There is always some snide remark. No organization or individual is perfect, but I try & work to improve that organization. Some on this forum could complain about something if it was free. I spend untold hours each month in supporting SCI & NRA projects & doing my bit to protect hunters rights & our rights to own guns. I will be on Capital Hill again next month working with SCI staff to continue efforts to protect hunters rights. Those that feel the NRA sold out for instance on not fighting for the right to own machine guns should try & visit congressmen & women or staffers with this as an agenda. Many issues some feel the NRA compromised on are simply not obtainable. Its better to obtain 85% of an objective with a compromise than 0% with no compromise. I believe compromise is the way of a democracy. You are very knowledgeable about many topics & contribute much to this forum. At any rate there is no reason to continue to beat a dead horse so we can agree to disagree. Good hunting & shooting.