Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Hunting Rifles Sako Does Not Play Nice...

A lot of dealers only carry a minimum of Remington, Winchester, Mossberg, etc. because there are very little margins on them. They often carry special run guns from those companies so that they don't have to compete head to head against the basement bandits and Wal Mart.

My guess is that Beretta did this because of complaints from there better dealers that the profit margins were so low that it didn't pay for them to continue carrying there products. How many of you would want to spend $1000 and sit on a gun for a couple months so that you can make $50 on it?

Dealers are going to sell what they can make money on, it only makes sense.

Would anyone pay over a $1000 for a high end rifle if it was available at WalMart?
They are trying to protect their Brand image, which is highend. That genereally means some level of exclusivity in distribution. I have no problem with the way they choose to sell their products.
It's a free country (even in Canada) where a Sako 75 is more like $1500.
Martin

Companies are free to be exclusive, and stupid. I'm free to buy the products I choose. They need me; I don't need them. They lose. That makes them, at the least, shortsighted.

But hey, the marketplace will sort it out in a few years.

Yes, I would pay over $1000 for a Sako rifle at Walmart. If Sako sold their rifles to Walmart for the same prices they sell them to the gun stores wouldn't they make more money? Let Sako's product quality protect their brand image.

My point is, I buy underwear and socks at Walmart, not something expensive like a fine rifle, fly rod or electronic equipment. For things like that I go to a specialty business or store that has both expertise and aftersale service, you don't get either of these at Wally World. The demise of many fine companies has come from trying to be everything to everyone all the time, they end up being sort of, kind of, good and a few things at experts at nothing. I believe business's should find their nitch and become the best in it, not necessarily the biggest. For Sako/Beretta they probably make more money selling a smaller number of guns at a limited number of stores and by not trying to compete on privepoint with mass produced Remington/Savage/Winchester products. I own all of the above btw, 2 Winchester's, 1 Remington, 1 Savage, 1 Benelli and 1 Beretta.

I don't savvy the logic.

If you make a good product,that's priced at where most would discern a sound purchase value,HOW would more Vendors stocking that item be a bad thing?

Loomis costs what it costs and you needn't a $15K buy-in................

I believe that the market should and does set prices. If their products are enough superior to everyone elses, then they will survive and flourish. Personally, I don't believe that to be the case here, especially with the decline in quality since Beretta's takover. Their hand guns and shotguns will end up packing their rifle lines. Why does Beretta care anyway. Don't they charge every dealer the same price regardless of their size? If anything, they'd give the bigger dealers a better price.

If I was selling an initial 70K worth of Sako's and or Beretta's to a dealer who has a long track record with the company. I'm going to do my best to proctect my customer from some fly-by-nite kitchen aid down the road who wants to buy 5 to 10 guns for the year and sell them piss cheap to his friends. When it comes to higher end guns word spreads quick that so & so has them for this price. It takes no time for word to reach the dealer that he is too expensive and that
"I can buy it cheaper from the kitchen aid down the road".
Dealer then calls factory rep, and ask WHAT THE *%&$ IS GOING ON!!!
I just gave you an intitial 70K and last year we did 350K and your letting the kitchen aid down the road undercut me?

I think the Product has to stand upon it's own merits,as does the Vendor.

As a Manufacturer,I would be bent on offering a sound Product,to all Vendors and let them hash out their margins as they see fit.

If a guy wants to move 5 or 10 rifles,at minimal profit,that's solely his business and I don't see it crushing WalMart to the ground.

Who don't shop for the best price,on most their goods? Is that something a guy should feel sheepish about? Is there some hidden inner satisfaction,for paying double for an item,just to say you did it?

As a Manufacturer,I would be happy to move more goods,through extry Vendors,so as to reach more prospective Consumers and not be bent on letting only a certain few charge an inordinate premium upon my wares.

If a Vendor needs subsidy,they ain't got much in the way of a future,anyhow...........................

Had a mechanic shaft me on rebuilding my boat engine some time back. He never made it back to fix the shortcomings and sent me a big bill for what should have been covered. When he denied my request to fix his mistakes I came up with a line I am very proud of, though it had no effect on the mechanic.

"You can stand behind your work or hide behind your warranty."

Sako should have enough image to maintain sales for quite some time, but cheapening the rifles and messing with the distribution system seems fraught with danger to me... Sakos should be good enough to stand behind so they don't have to hide behind a marketing ploy.
art

SU35, 2 words, Volumn Discounts. If 350K guy can't buy guns from you cheaper than Kitchen Aid that's just one more thing that's wrong with Berretta's Marketing.
You seem to be argueing that Berretta should be loyal to their dealers instead of the customers. Somehow they need to figure out how to be loyal to both.......DJ

There is only one problem with this.......its called the internet, what keeps companies from just listing guns on the internet at a discount so they can sell x dollars of rifles. How much is a dealer actually making on a SAKO?? every gun shop I know can't seem to make any money on selling new guns cause the margins are so low. if you pony up 15k for an order to only be able to make 50-75$ at best per rifle, does it really make it worth investing the 15k in the first place. The easiest way to solve the problem is to give a discount based on sales volume the 350k/yr company gets the rifles for much less than what they sell to the basement people. This is done in cars, carpets and many other things. I am sorry this is a stupid marketing scheme

Bigstick, I qoute: "Loomis costs what it costs and you needn't a $15K buy-in................"

Loomis does require a certain "buy in" and gives territories to it's dealers. I am not sure what the buy in is, certianly not 15k but we are not talking $500 - $1000 items either. Although lately the territory seems to be shrinking, sometimes it is as small as your parking lot!

I can buy Loomis here,but not Sako.

'Nuff said.................

Every gun store in Ak that I've spoken with says they can get me tne Sako I want, but it'll take a while...and it'll be expensive...and they are hard to come by.

The prices seem to be rising, perhaps due to the difficulty of actually getting one in your hands.

None of the gun stores seemed interested in putting forth the effort to get one.

Someone has their head up their azz...and for once, it doesn't seem to be me.

dave

Where does Beretta make most of it's $$? I'm betting gove contracts and shotguns. How many O/U's does one have to buy to meet the $15k buy in - THREE? ONE? Even a $400 92's only take 38. Spread that around the Sako/Tikka line and 30 rifles isn't all that many for a big retail shop. The local big shop still has 3 or 4 left overs from the fall (wood only). They have maybe 50 Marlins, probably that many Rugers, close to that many Rems, but, amazingly enough not a new Winchester in sight.

Why? Because they don't move enough to be a Win distrib so they are cheaper at Wal-Mart than they can buy them. Does that sound like what Beretta's doing?? My kitchen aid friend only beats their price on Savage combos by $20 - and I have to wait for delivery.

We wished for lower prices and our wish was granted - the �volume discount� genie has us trying to discern the finer points of rifles with the Wal-Mart Gun Guru.

The 24-hour Campfire offers a good comparison. Rick Bin is a top hand, will knock himself out to find you an answer, and offers a FREE website for your entertainment and pursuit of knowledge. But ya know, I�m going to Wal-Mart because its $5 cheaper�

Bullshit.

Those younger than 35-years or so probably don�t remember the �old days�. Gun shops were awesome places where first-rate knowledge could be had. Sure, a lot of BS was tossed around, but there was always someone to call it like it is. Knowledge costs money � ignorance is cheap. Thin margins, caused in a large part by volume discounts, have made ignorance more profitable.

Who don't shop for the best price on most their goods? Me � I would rather pay a premium for knowledge. However sappy it sounds, I�d rather pay more and hope to preserve the legacy of gun shops, cracker barrels, wood burning stoves, and a cup of really bad coffee. Screw Wal-Mart.

If Sako is going to play games - screw Sako too.

Paintless, they change things evey year and I dont keep up with them anymore. As far as going into details, I really dont have time and am only sharing some of the experiences I had.
When I was a rep, we could open an order with only 5K, that seems to have changed now for whatever reasons I'll never know.
All a store needed was a sign outside.

"You seem to be argueing that Berretta should be loyal to their dealers instead of the customers. Somehow they need to figure out how to be loyal to both.......DJ"

It's a high wire act DJ, Why dont you give it try sometime? I'm sure your an expert at it.

Remington,Winchester,Savage,Ruger,etc can do it.

The concepts ain't novel,nor secreted......................

Stick, I know, but those people from italy, well what can I say! <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/help.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" /> You do your best with what is given you.
A good rep would be able to take care of Alaska. I would be on the horn changing the rules with the powers that be.


I just hope Sako can keep it's luster....I really respect them.