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Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 35,900
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Jan 2007
Posts: 35,900 |
Wow!Look at the difference between Hybrid and the other powders...!  This is a very cool thread;thanks to JB.....long live the 257 Roberts!
The 280 Remington is overbore.
The 7 Rem Mag is over bore.
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Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 44,885 Likes: 10
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 44,885 Likes: 10 |
There's a gun show I'll be attending this weekend. One of the regular vendors usually has a pretty good selection of Ruger Hawkeyes. A Roberts may follow me home. A 358 Win. almost did last time. 
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Joined: Jul 2001
Posts: 60,186 Likes: 21
Campfire Kahuna
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OP
Campfire Kahuna
Joined: Jul 2001
Posts: 60,186 Likes: 21 |
Hawk1,
Actually, the .257 was capable of 3100-3200 with a 100-grain ever since the introduction of IMR4350 in 1940, and certaonly after mil-surp H4831 in the 1950's, but the weird, antique pressure standards for commercial ammo kept it from happening, even in handloading manuals.
Though I will check my copy of the first Speer manual, published in 1954....
“Montana seems to me to be what a small boy would think Texas is like from hearing Texans.”
John Steinbeck
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Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 11,953
Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 11,953 |
Well, I just got my latest Hodgdon Annual Manual and was browsing through it. In the .257 Roberts data the fastest load with the 115-grain Nosler Patition is listed at 3049 fps, and the powder is Hybrid H100V, the maximum charge 46.0 grains. This is from a 24" barrel, so still should be somewhere around 3000 in a 22" barrel. Musta been a short action Roberts. The long action can get at least 3500fps.  .
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Joined: May 2009
Posts: 18,508
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: May 2009
Posts: 18,508 |
Puts it right there with a 25/06.
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Joined: May 2006
Posts: 4,063
Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
Joined: May 2006
Posts: 4,063 |
John,
Inspired by your writing,I went out and bought a new 257 Roberts,a Kimber Select.
It functions just fine and shoots well too.
The first factory load that I tried was the Federal Premium with the 120 grain Partitions.
Three of them will hit in a little less than an inch and the chrony said they were going 2940 fps some 10 feet from the muzzle from the 22 inch barrel.
If Federal can get close to 3000 fps with a 120 grain bullet,I'm pretty sure the rest of us can get a 115 grain bullet there too.
In fact,rounds like the 257 Roberts,280 Remington,and 30-06 which have pressure limits in commercial ammo of 50,000 cup or less,generally respond very nicely to handloads which often can safely beat factory velocites.
On the other hand,if you try to beat factory velocity with a number of cartidges which have higher saami limits,like the 243,270,308,and the WSM series,you have to run some pretty spoooky pressures to get there.
Lots of people here understand the difference,but some folks just can't wrap their mind around it. My 17-month old son, Jack, has a kimber montana 257bob/3.5-10 luppy and talleys - - one day in 8 or so years *bang*!~
“There is no limit to the amount of good you can do if you don’t care who gets credit.” R. Reagan
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Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 1,727
Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 1,727 |
While the velocities stated are nice indeed, there is one thing that can not be denied. The 257 Bob can never equal the 6.5x55 in killing power because of the bullets offered.
There is nothing available for the 'Bob that equals the 140-160 grain bullets loaded by the Swede. For deer, it's flip a coin. For anything bigger, the Swede has the advantage. 105yrs of history stands with the Swede.
I don't drink or Smoke. I spend my money on gunpowder and gasoline.
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Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 96,121 Likes: 1
Campfire Oracle
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Campfire Oracle
Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 96,121 Likes: 1 |
"Dear Lord, save me from Your followers"
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Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 18,342 Likes: 1
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 18,342 Likes: 1 |
Ruger, and Kimber both in 257 roberts.
I don't think I will ever be without a Roberts again. I am very happy with my Kimber select classic wish I had bought a montana in the bob instead of a 308 now.
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Joined: Jul 2001
Posts: 60,186 Likes: 21
Campfire Kahuna
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OP
Campfire Kahuna
Joined: Jul 2001
Posts: 60,186 Likes: 21 |
dmsbandit,
Thought we'd hear from you before too long.
Here's my question, which I wanted to ask on the other thread:
Have you ever actually hunted with, handloaded or even shot a .257 Roberts?
“Montana seems to me to be what a small boy would think Texas is like from hearing Texans.”
John Steinbeck
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Joined: Jul 2009
Posts: 14,076
Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Jul 2009
Posts: 14,076 |
Killing power?
Anything you can kill with the swede you can kill with a 257 roberts.
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Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 1,727
Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 1,727 |
Nope. Never saw the need for one. I own a 243 Win, a 250 Savage, (3) 6.5x55s, a 260, (2) 284 Winchesters, (2) 308s, a 30-06, a 358 Win, a 35 Whelen, a 38-55, and a 45 Colt rifle. So I think I have the North American game killing spectrum covered pretty well. But I have friends that have and do use the 'Bob. It's a fine cartridge but like any it has it's limits.
History has proven the Swede capable of killing big critters [including elephants]all over the world. I don't recall ever hearing of the 'Bob being used in Africa or any other distant land on critters big and small. But the Swede is world reknowned for it's killing abilities on critters of all sizes. The Swede was used for many years to win 1000yd matches and that is another area the 'Bob is MIA.
The 257 Roberts is a fine cartridge, it's just not as good as a Swede.
I don't drink or Smoke. I spend my money on gunpowder and gasoline.
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Joined: May 2009
Posts: 18,508
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: May 2009
Posts: 18,508 |
Riddle me this Batman,
Can a 257 Rob kill a Swede carrying a 6.5?
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Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 13,401
Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 13,401 |
Ruraldoc,
That's good to know about the federals - I've got 3 or 4 boxes stashed away somewhere and should probably try those out of my Kimber Bobs...
Also was getting ready to order some more H4350 so I'll pick up some 100V also to try it out.
“There are some who can live without wild things and some who cannot.”
ALDO LEOPOLD
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Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 1,727
Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 1,727 |
Killing power?
Anything you can kill with the swede you can kill with a 257 roberts. Elephants? Eland? Zebra? Bears?
I don't drink or Smoke. I spend my money on gunpowder and gasoline.
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Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 13,401
Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 13,401 |
dms,
History has also proven the bow and arrow capable of killing everything in the world...
“There are some who can live without wild things and some who cannot.”
ALDO LEOPOLD
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Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 2,961
Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 2,961 |
dms,
There are no degrees of dead in hunting. Dead is Dead.
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Joined: Jul 2001
Posts: 60,186 Likes: 21
Campfire Kahuna
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OP
Campfire Kahuna
Joined: Jul 2001
Posts: 60,186 Likes: 21 |
dmsbandit,
So I take it that you have killed elk and grizzly bears with your 6.5x55's? Or did you used your bigger rifles on elk and grizzly bears?
Or have your friends who own .257 Roberts rifles failed to kill elk and grizzly bears with their .257's?
Please explain the precise limits of the .257 Roberts so that those of us who own both .257's and 6.5x55's can be sure not to screw up.
“Montana seems to me to be what a small boy would think Texas is like from hearing Texans.”
John Steinbeck
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Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 28,277
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 28,277 |
A Roberts question for anyone who can field it. Does Ruger make the RL or UL or whatever they call it these days with a Syn stock/stls and in Roberts?
Thx
Dober
"True respect starts with the way you treat others, and it is earned over a lifetime of demonstrating kindness, honor and dignity"....Tony Dungy
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Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 21,976 Likes: 1
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 21,976 Likes: 1 |
Hawk1,
Actually, the .257 was capable of 3100-3200 with a 100-grain ever since the introduction of IMR4350 in 1940, and certaonly after mil-surp H4831 in the 1950's, but the weird, antique pressure standards for commercial ammo kept it from happening, even in handloading manuals.
Though I will check my copy of the first Speer manual, published in 1954.... As usual, you are correct John. I have only loaded my own 257 to those velocities with RL-22, where even the Alliant data (not the recent Speer stuff) was extremely soft and had a lot of room, even for plus P loads. I have also used H4350 to 3,100 and change, I just prefer to use very slow powders in most of my loads when I can get away without too much compression. The BYOB loves RL-22, and I suspect the Swede does as well, but alas I don't own a Swede, prolly never will, so I don't KNOW jack about it...... I have a Ruger MKII and sent my Rem. 25/06 down the river, even though it exceeded the "killing power" of the 257 and the Swede, if math alone creates dead animals.....
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