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Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 131,959 Likes: 54
Campfire Sage
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Campfire Sage
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 131,959 Likes: 54 |
I won't argue what you experienced in that DA's office, but I will tell you it doesn't hold water here unless you want to talk about the "big" stuff. Obviously nobody wants to be the CA/ACA that lost a rape/whatever case.
When you get into the "other" felonies they're looking for ways not to bother going to trial. We now have "Family Court" to handle DV, etc. We have "Drug Court" so we can get the low level drug schit out of the way. "Mental Health Court", blah blah blah.
It's not about conviction rates, it's about saving time and money.
That still doesn't address the fact that most "Joe Six Packs" will only have to deal with the Court on a lower level. Most only for violations/low level misdemeanors. Pleas make the world go 'round there.
George For the young ADAs it is all about conviction rates. That's how they earn recognition.
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Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 10,796 Likes: 4
Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 10,796 Likes: 4 |
In some offices I imagine you're right. Not so in our CA's office. It helps that our CA is a younger guy who still believes that justice doesn't always equate to a guilty finding. The last one, not so much. Unfortunately she made her way to the AG's office and is now a problem State-wide instead of being contained to our County.
George
�Out of every one hundred men, ten shouldn't even be there, eighty are just targets, nine are the real fighters, and we are lucky to have them, for they make the battle. Ah, but the one, one is a warrior, and he will bring the others back.�
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Joined: Feb 2001
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Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 73,096 |
Without the story it is a just a gratuitous picture of a dead animal. With the story it makes sense. I have shot & killed more than one in my day, but always with reason.
George Orwell was a Prophet, not a novelist. Read 1984 and then look around you!
Old cat turd!
"Some men just need killing." ~ Clay Allison.
I am too old to fight but I can still pull a trigger. ~ Me
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Joined: May 2003
Posts: 20,494
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: May 2003
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Me too, Terry, as I said back a few pages, and the reason was a very good reason, every time, or the animal lived.
"Keep thy heart with all diligence; for out of it are the issues of life." (Prov 4:23)
Brother Keith
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Joined: Feb 2001
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Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
Joined: Feb 2001
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The only way.
Have a great evening Sir.
George Orwell was a Prophet, not a novelist. Read 1984 and then look around you!
Old cat turd!
"Some men just need killing." ~ Clay Allison.
I am too old to fight but I can still pull a trigger. ~ Me
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Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 12,022
Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Aug 2002
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You guys can crap on me all you want but I know how the system works.
Defense attorney wants a plea bargain because he wants his calendar free in case a lucrative client comes or go chase ambulances or go play golf or whatever, the last thing a criminal attorney wants to do is defend Joe Six-pack who hasn't two nickels to rub together. It�s quite clear you haven�t spoken to many defense attorneys. The vast majority of the ones I got to know were interested in providing their client with a zealous defense, and with getting the client the best possible outcome. In most lower profile cases, this is a plea bargain. Prosecuting attorney wants a plea bargain to put more conviction notches on the political belt because every prosecuting attorney has grand visions of the gold ring, US Senator. Wrong again, but you are consistent. Prosecuting attorneys have no more interest in convicting an innocent person than you have seeing one convicted.
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Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 13,760
Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Dec 2005
Posts: 13,760 |
I won't argue what you experienced in that DA's office, but I will tell you it doesn't hold water here unless you want to talk about the "big" stuff. Obviously nobody wants to be the CA/ACA that lost a rape/whatever case.
When you get into the "other" felonies they're looking for ways not to bother going to trial. We now have "Family Court" to handle DV, etc. We have "Drug Court" so we can get the low level drug schit out of the way. "Mental Health Court", blah blah blah.
It's not about conviction rates, it's about saving time and money.
That still doesn't address the fact that most "Joe Six Packs" will only have to deal with the Court on a lower level. Most only for violations/low level misdemeanors. Pleas make the world go 'round there.
George For the young ADAs it is all about conviction rates. That's how they earn recognition. Really? And you know this how? BTW, I couldn't begin to tell you what my conviction rate is.
War Damn Eagle!
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Joined: Feb 2003
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 15,553 |
You guys can crap on me all you want but I know how the system works.
Defense attorney wants a plea bargain because he wants his calendar free in case a lucrative client comes or go chase ambulances or go play golf or whatever, the last thing a criminal attorney wants to do is defend Joe Six-pack who hasn't two nickels to rub together.
Prosecuting attorney wants a plea bargain to put more conviction notches on the political belt because every prosecuting attorney has grand visions of the gold ring, US Senator.
The Judge, ah the Judge, there are some really good judges but way to many judges graduated at the bottom of their class all they want to do is clear the decks to they go golfing, boating or whatever. For many judges the best job they'll ever have in the legal profession is the judgeship.
See I know how the game works we have an adversarial justice system and all the pros are actors playing a part. The best actor wins. With any kind of luck the poor sucker who's the football between actors will get justice but more often than not he won't. And to think, I've had 2 healthy drams of Lagavulin tonight.
"I Birn Quhil I Se" MacLeod of Lewis
I Burn While I See
Hold Fast MacLeod of Harris
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Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 61,130
Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
Joined: Apr 2004
Posts: 61,130 |
I won't argue what you experienced in that DA's office, but I will tell you it doesn't hold water here unless you want to talk about the "big" stuff. Obviously nobody wants to be the CA/ACA that lost a rape/whatever case.
When you get into the "other" felonies they're looking for ways not to bother going to trial. We now have "Family Court" to handle DV, etc. We have "Drug Court" so we can get the low level drug schit out of the way. "Mental Health Court", blah blah blah.
It's not about conviction rates, it's about saving time and money.
That still doesn't address the fact that most "Joe Six Packs" will only have to deal with the Court on a lower level. Most only for violations/low level misdemeanors. Pleas make the world go 'round there.
George For the young ADAs it is all about conviction rates. That's how they earn recognition. Oh? Do tell, Mr. Never-Gonna-Use-The-J.D.-Daddy-Bought-Ya..... Exactly HOW many cases have you litigated? How about how many have you negotiated a plea? Hell, I'll make it easy: how many have you filed? Wait.... Damn, that's right; you're guessing again, without any basis in fact or experience.
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Joined: Sep 2007
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 26,524 |
Forty freakin' pages......................... C'mon guys, get a life or something.. Aw, hell, the battle was over after page 6 or so. The rest of this is just the horse soldiers spearing the survivors... and the thieves looking for booty amongst the dead. Nothing to see here, move along....
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Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 5,264 |
In my experience with DA offices, some guys do only care about convictions and not guilt or innocence of the accused. However, most of the time it isn't that they don't care if the accused is guilty or innocent, the just believe that pretty much EVERY accused is guilty.
If they make a decision to move forward on a case, they have already evaluated it to a degree and therefore, they believe that the person is guilty. Once they make that decision, a lot of them kind of put the blinders on and it is full speed ahead.
And cynically, a lot of defense attorneys believe it too. The law is a cynic's business. If you weren't one before, you'll end up being one later. You see the worst side of everyone...your clients, other lawyers, and cops and prosecutors. Everyone you see is having problems, or you wouldn't be seeing them. You learn secrets you never wanted to learn when you get telephone calls in the middle of the night from friends, family, and people you go to church with. You watch people turn into absolutely insane idiots while going through a divorce. You see people turn themselves inside out over relatively minor legal matters and drive themselves insane.
Like I said, all of that kind of lends itself to a pervasive atmosphere of "everybody is guilty of something" that sometimes does have a negative effect on the administration of justice.
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Joined: Sep 2002
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Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Sep 2002
Posts: 11,738 |
If they make a decision to move forward on a case, they have already evaluated it to a degree and therefore, they believe that the person is guilty. No, they believe they can get a conviction. Big difference.
Save an elk, shoot a cow.
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Joined: Feb 2001
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 24,239 |
What part of ;"in my experience " makes it hard for you to understand ?
Never holler whoa or look back in a tight place
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Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
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Joined: Sep 2006
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 18,005 |
Forty freakin' pages......................... C'mon guys, get a life or something.. Aw, hell, the battle was over after page 6 or so. The rest of this is just the horse soldiers spearing the survivors... and the thieves looking for booty amongst the dead. Nothing to see here, move along.... Too right, and TFF!! 
"I'm gonna have to science the schit out of this." Mark Watney, Sol 59, Mars
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