Home Forums Birds & Dogs Shotguns AyA shotgun and steel?

I have an AyA Matador 12-ga double, purchased in 1971. I had Briley tubes installed this summer to make it more versatile.

Can I shoot steel shot in it, using IC or Mod tubes?

Tom
Minnesota

Briley sell specific tubes for steel, I believe they are marked, otherwise its probably not advisable even with fairly open chokes. I might consider IC if I was not worry about ruining the gun but personally I would not likely try Mod.

If the Briley chokes are steel capable they will be marked "Steel". You can shoot lead through the "Steel" marked chokes.

If the Briley chokes are only for lead they will be marked "Lead Only" and you cannot shoot steel through them.

Keep in mind, If you are shooting lead through a "Steel Full" you will get a Modified pattern. Lead through a "Steel Modified" will throw an Improved Pattern. Lead through a "Steel Improved" will throw a Skeet pattern.

Thats how it works with the Thin Wall Brileys I have.

OK; got that on the lead/steel markings on the tubes.

Now, the other half of my question: is the 1970-era AyA double OK to shoot steel in with the proper Briley steel tubes, or should I spring the big bucks and use Hevi-Shot's "Classic Doubles" stuff?

Thanks for your expertise

Tom
Minnesota

I am no expert by any means, but if Briley installs Steel chokes in it you are ok. If the barrels are too thin, I would think they would tell you not to shoot steel accordingly. They installed think walls in my 70's Model Wingmaster and my Model 12 Winchester made in 1940. They pattern great.

Thanks again for the info!

tom
Minnesota

I can't offer an opinion about your shotgun, but I disagree with the 'if Briley installs tubes everything is okay' sentiment on this thread. I'm going though the same process with a Browning Twelvette and Briley has been zero help:



Yes, I did call Browning, but they were no help either. After finally getting through to some dickwad that I UNDERSTAND they don't service the Twelvette anymore and I only want an opinion on steel shot AFTER installing choke tubes the dickwad told me the Twelvette is not designed for steel shot. Duh.

Sorry to say, but I bet your choice is the same as mine - you can't use steel as is, so retire the shotgun or pay for tubes and take your chances.

JOG,

Man I am sorry to hear of your experience with Briley. I have never had anything but good luck with them. But, I live in near Houston and just go by there when I need to. They have gotten so big in the last few years maybe their customer service has gone downhill.

Briley does nice work, I just wish they had the stones to offer an opinion based on the kazillion choke tubes they've installed. I smell a Briley lawyer.

But hey, it's the same deal with Ahlman's - a well respected shop here in Minnesota. They will also gladly take my money without offering an opinion on whether tubes will solve the problem.

On his website Randy Wakeman mentioned a guy that supposedly does first class shotgun work. I emailed him a couple weeks ago and I'm either still waiting for a reply or for hell to freeze over.

Sorry for the rantage.

I will say that I am no pro and have never had briley tubes put in any of my guns but do a pretty prolific amount of reading about the use of double guns and this is my take (and I would PERSONALLY trust it based on the posters that made these statements).

steel shot (any shot at that matter) should stayed contained within a modern wad all the way through the tube... meaning there should be basically no actual contact between the barrel wall and the physical steel shot... it would seem that if the shot was touching the barrel you would likely end up with some very poor patterns.

Many ppl shot steel out of vintage doubles W/O briley tubes in them for years without issue. Alone that would be specious reasoning but I have read of ppl putting 100s of rounds of steel in vintage double with not only no bulges at the choke but no damage to the length of the tubes.

The issue is "only" that the steel will not compress as it exits through the choke like lead or bismuth or other non-toxics.

All this said, if you have briley steel inserts, your gun has enough barrel wall thickness to shoot any modern shell (I won't comment at this time on what that might be to avoid a tangent thread jack) it "should" be safe to shoot.

I know of others that have OLD vintage doubles with fairly open chokes that STILL shoot steel out of them... mostly low dollar guns that they are willing to destroy but again... several hundreds of rounds and no signs of issues. Your gun is NOT vintage, by 1970's the steel used was VERY good compared to the guns that I am referencing that probably average about 1910.

My personal recommendation... get the steel choke tubes and shoot the gun with steel... the tube costs will be saved in about 3-4 boxes of shells.

I appreciate your post and from what I've been able to learn so far I agree. My rant is based on gunsmiths that have installed thousands of choke tubes and worked on thousands of shotguns that are afraid to offer an opinion on something they see everyday. I would happily settle for, "We will install the tubes and think it will do the trick, but we can't offer a guarantee."

Nothing is a sure thing, but lean a little okay?

I plan on having tubes installed in the Twelvette (DOB 1967) because even blowing the end off the barrel is a better option than retiring the old friend. I can always buy a replacement barrel.

Anything gun made after 1950 or so with steel choke tubes in it... I would not even worry about, personally.

I totally understand your rant... try to get a smith to tell you what is and what is not a safe min barrel wall thickness!! you get some kind of wishy-washy "well... I saw a set that blew that measured XXX but i know another guy that regularly shoots turkey load through his and it measure XXX less than that soo..."