Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Hunter's Campfire Question on cheap shotgun shells

I'm posting this here since it get far more looks than in the shotgun or shotshells forum.

Is there any noticable difference in patterning among the inexpensive 12 gauge target/game loads? Particurlary the 2 3/4" 1 1/8 oz # 7 1/2's or # 8's varieties. Any recommendations? Are they sub-standard compared to AA's or STS's. Reloading isn't a factor for me at this point.

In case your wondering - I've been shooting a 20 gauge forever so my practical experience with a 12 gauge is limited. That and living in Alaska for 14 years - which didn't provide a wealth of shotguning opportunities. I was busy enough enjoying other outdoor adventures and the shotgun was put aside for many years.

I've never done any patterning tests, but the fairly cheap dark red Federal hulls from WallyWorld. load up nicely and do real well on pheasants/chuckar. I've not complained about them yet. I actually like them better than AA hulls.

I load both 12 and 20 gauges with the Federals hulls.

If you are comparing between brands of cheap shells - the Wal-Mart value packs - that is something you and you specific gun need to determine.

Compared to the AA's of the world? They should - the primary difference being that the AA-types will used chilled or hardened shot with a higher antimony content. Harder shot deforms less - should pattern better.

Test it yourself and see if the cost is justified.

Myself - if I were shooting in a league or something where money/bragging rights were an issue I'd be shooting something like the AA's - my reloads, actually.

Shooting with the kids on the back 40? If I didn't reload I wouldn't think twice about using the lower cost stuff. Good 'nuff for those purposes. Done it a many a time.

Very little difference in "pattern". The main cost difference is in the quality of the shell itself (for relaoding purposes) and the hardness of the shot. Soft lead is great for hunting, but not for busting clays.

Are you hunting or target shooting?

I've found the AA's and STS's to pattern much better than the discount game loads. The discount game loads use softer shot and frequently, hotter loads, which deform the shot and patterns tend to get sparse.

If you get the STS, save the hulls in case you decide to start reloading. I get more quality reloads out of an STS than anything else.

And as the good El-Tee mentioned - the case quality. IF you have any intentions of ever getting in to reloading it is the AA types that you'll want to stock up on.

The cheapies have steel bases that have been known to split on the first firing and plastic that would never survive the "work" applied during repeated firings and loadings.

What has happened to AA hulls should be prosecuted as a felony!

They certainly managed to screw up a good product.

I just realized why I asked this question.

I started shooting a 20 guage waaaay back when one piece wads or even shotcups weren't the norm as today. You could still buy paper hulls with just a wad card. The was big difference in how shotgun shells performed and patterned back then.

I remember my first "attempts" at reloading shells for duck hunting and with the advice of ???? started out with a 7/8 oz load of lead #4's. It didn't take long to find out that they didn't work worth a schite. After years of experimenting and patterning 2 3/4" and 3" loads I finally found nirvana in a 2 3/4" 1 1/8 oz load of lead #5's. It was a duck killin' sum bish. Substitute # 7 1/2's for valley quail and that was perfection also.

At least from my experience I found a 20 gauge to be a little finicky about what did and didn't perform best. You couldn't buy just any off the shelf load and expect it to work as well as a tested reload or even some of the premium shells at the time.

I asked myself the same question years ago. I ended up buying some good target loads (AA) and some promo loads (Federal game loads). I cut open 10 of each and dumped out the shot for inspection. The AA had very nice shot, round, well formed, and was pretty hard to deform with pliers while the Federal shot had a lot of out of round shot and it was easier to deform with the pliers. I interpreted this to mean the AA would pattern better although I never put it to paper. However, both would break trap and skeet targets with no appreciable difference in scores leading me to believe that for fun shooting, at my skill level, the promo's will work nearly as good as the others. You don't specify what your application will be but seems like you are not competing.

No competition anticipated here - If that was case I'd just buy the AA's or STS's and start reloading again. I've got enough experience to know the differences or needs in most situations.

Skeet - no big deal - ranges are close and clays are easy to bust with most anything. Trap - 16 yard - no so picky on loads. Handicap trap - yeah - then the need for a really good patterning load becomes more more apparent. Sporting clays/five stand - depends on how difficult the shots are. Doves in a field full of em' - you have enough opportunties that it doesn't matter too greatly as long as you keep your shots within a reasonable range. Pass shooting doves at longer ranges when birds are scarce and flying high - that calls for something a little better.

Blah, blah, blah ....

I guess I'm just looking for a head start on what to buy for ??? ... clays, doves and maybe a trip to the desert for quail. Thus the 2 3/4" 1 1/8 oz loads.

I've just been out of it for a long time and don't know how factory ammo performs today. I guess I'm being anal too since I reload for all my rifles.

I just wonder why you put your shot gun away in AK...

I didn't put it away for the entire time I was there. I did a little duck hunting, shot some ptarmigan and spruce hens and I shot in the leagues at Birchwood for a couple of years.

I just didn't pursue it as much as when I lived in the lower 48. There was other thing things to do that had a higher priority.

I used to shoot some of the cheap promo loads for dove. I found that the shot was too soft. I would put a good hit on the dove, and feathers would boil but the dove would keep flying. I then started loading my own dove loads with premium shot and my success rate went way up.

If you are going to load for 20 and 12 gauge, get the Lyman shot shell manual for current load data and go to a skeet range and buy a couple of bags of AA or STS hulls cheap. Around here AAs go for about $6-$8 per 100 hulls. Even though the AA is nowhere near what it used to be, it still loads better than the promo hulls.

This is correct! Now that they've gone to the new style two piece hull they have gone downhill.

As far as quality of target loads vs the cheap ones, I think just about all of the loads will break targets better than the person behind the gun is capable of. I do like the target loads more because they seem to burn cleaner and in an automatic that is a plus.

Dave