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Just across the newswire - I figured that some might be interested...

Canada set to OK same-sex marriage
http://www.cnn.com/2005/WORLD/americas/06/28/canada.marriage.reut/index.html
Tuesday, June 28, 2005; Posted: 9:25 a.m. EDT (13:25 GMT)

OTTAWA, Ontario (Reuters) -- Canada's Parliament was set Tuesday to approve legislation that will allow same-sex marriages across the country, despite fierce opposition from conservative legislators and religious groups.

A majority of parliamentarians support the legislation, which would make Canada only the third country after Belgium and the Netherlands to allow gay marriages.

Officials said Parliament would vote at around 8 p.m. EDT (midnight GMT) Tuesday.

Canada's minority Liberal government said it had to produce legislation permitting gay marriage after courts in eight of the country's 10 provinces ruled that a ban on same-sex marriages was unconstitutional because it violated Canada's charter on rights and freedoms.

Church groups and the main opposition Conservative Party say the law is an attack on organized religion, and some have suggested that allowing gay marriage could lead to the legalization of polygamy.

Prime Minister Paul Martin has ordered his Cabinet to vote for the legislation, but around 35 Liberal legislators will oppose the bill.

Canada's stance stands in contrast to that in the United States, where President Bush wants Congress to back a constitutional amendment banning same sex marriages.

The gay marriage legislation is the last item on Parliament's agenda before it breaks for the summer. Legislators are due to resume work September 19.

And so the steep, slippery slope continues..........

Qtip
Soli Deo Gloria!
To God Alone Be The Glory!

Someday, far off in the future kids will ask "You mean it used to be illegal to marry who you wanted to?"

It'll happen in the same tone of voice that kid's today intone when they read about the old laws they had in the US that prohibited people from marrying outside their race.

Count me as a minority (perhaps of one) - but predjudice is always wrong, whether it be racially based, gender based, orientation based or based on one's chosen religion.

I won't debate my view, because it would serve no purpose - but not everyone who loves guns and shooting is a social conservative.

I stand by my view on how kids will view these times in the future, because as a teacher I can see their views changing as we debate these issues.

This new generation is far more tolerant of people who are "different" than any of the generations that preceded this one.

I, unlike the majority, think this is a good thing.

BCBrian,
Once again you show me that you(in my opinion)
are a complete kucklehead.Marriage is defined as:
"Relationship established by law between one man
and one woman united for life to perform the duties
of husband and wife."
Call it something else,"Marriage" is already taken.
You said that you won't debate your view...GOOD,
I don't want to hear it!
God help the kids that you(allegedly) teach <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/mad.gif" alt="" />.

It might be defined that way where you live, but our Supreme Court defines it differently. I am mildly opposed for economic reasons not "moral". This whole issue gets a major yawn in Canada for a majority except in parts of the Prairies. It's hardly a defining issue here.

Brian, I tend to disagree with you on many issues and I sometimes find your posts to be based more on a desire to promote a trendy point of view than on a careful, rational approach to contemporary social problems. However, I respect your courage in posting your opinion on this issue and I feel strongly that you have every right to do so.

While I may argue ferociously from a socially/culturally conservative point of view, I would not ever attempt to hush dissenting voices on any issue; that is what is really wrong with Canada today, the self-styled "progressives" cry havoc at ANY comment on their political agenda. The whole imbroglio concerning "natives" is perhaps the most obvious example of this problem.

My one comment on your view of changing social mores among the young is to state that I was a longhaired student rebel during the late '60s and early '70s and my attitudes have changed (just a bit) since those days, which now seem so long ago. I suspect that your students might follow a similar evolution, thus, your view of the future might not be entirely realistic, we shall see.

Hey Kutenay,

You might be right!

It think it was Churchill who said -

"If you aren't a liberal in your youth - you have no heart.
"If you aren't a conservative as you get older - you have no brains."

Or something like that....LOL!

It's one I use on my leftist buddies from time to time.

I'm all over the bloody map on these issues...
maybe someday they'll invent a party for me...

But then, would I really want to belong to any group that would want a guy like me in it?

The Canadian Liberal government is so 'at-risk' with this issue that they have had to form a coalition with the Bloc-Quebecois.

The Bloc is a separatist political party that wants to have the province of Quebec separate from Canada to become a soverign nation.

That's how desperate the Liberals are to stay in power.

Just as someone else said 'Marriage' is taken, call it something else.

Marriage as defined in Canada has a lot of tax deduction, health insurance benefits for married couples.

These benefits cost the Canadian taxpayer and the economy, in general, a lot of money.

These benefits were originally instituted by both government and corporation to help parents with the extremely high cost of raising a family. Both groups recognized that the children of the present needed whatever advantage that society as a whole could afford to give them to help them become productive and independant adults.

This brings in the whole issue of homosexuals raising children for which I don't think that a child should be brought up in a homosexual environment.

Canada has enough contract and personal rights law to protect whatever guarantees that a homosexual couple would want to protect themselves from.

I am Canadian and absolutely disagree with the notion of calling/recognizing a homosexual relationship a marriage.

Just to give you an idea of how much 'tax' money Canadians pay to have the luxury of our social safety nets.

-- Tax Freedom day came on June 26 of this year.

-- America's Tax Freedom day came on April 17 of this year.

That's how much extra government expenses Canadians have to pay for our social luxuries over the U.S..

When I was in college, late 70's, tax freedom day came in late April, early May. That's how much extra 'taxes' we now have to pay for the same level of services that we had 35 years ago.

Annoyed? Frustrated? That this self-serving group of individuals want to dip into public coffiers?

You betcha!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/mad.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/mad.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/mad.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/mad.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/mad.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/mad.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/mad.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/mad.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/mad.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/mad.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/mad.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/mad.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/mad.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/mad.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/mad.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/mad.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/mad.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/mad.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/mad.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/mad.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/mad.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/mad.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/mad.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/mad.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/mad.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/mad.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/mad.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/mad.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/mad.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/mad.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/mad.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/mad.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/mad.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/mad.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/mad.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/mad.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/mad.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/mad.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/mad.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/mad.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/mad.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/mad.gif" alt="" />

Lowtech... <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/mad.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/mad.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/mad.gif" alt="" />

Lowtech,
My sister and her partner are raising a young daughter they had via artificial insemination. I generally agree with you on the economic side of this issue, I think that most folks who will take advantage of the cross benefits now available will never have kids which was the reason they were invented. To this gays and Lesbians would respond what about the heterosexual couple who choose not to have kids. My response to my sister is that as Governments in Canada at all levels struggle to provide services for reasonable costs to the masses, maybe we shouldn't extend these benefits to Heterosexual couples without kids either.
On the issue of Gay/Lesbians raising families, you would be hard pressed to find a more loving supportive family unit than my Sister and her partner. She's a great sister, daughter and aunt to my kids and while I am sure she is going to have to deal with some issues such as Who's my Daddy, I have great confidence that they will figure it out.
On the issue of becoming more conservative as I get older absolutely, but I have a hard time getting excited about this issue or turning it into a moral issue, no doubt due to my personal experience with a great sister who happens to be gay.

Lowtech Canadian has it right about a couple of the same gender not being as well qualified to raise a child as a couple that includes both genders, and a single parent isn't as well qualified as a father and mother, either. It has nothing to do with a loving, supportive environment. It has to do with the fact that no matter what the liberal psycho-ninnies say about how there shouldn't be any gender roles in society, there ARE gender roles in society, and that's the way we were created to be. Even if someone believes we evolved from primodial goop instead of being created, there are still very strong gender roles that are here to stay. Study after study has shown that for a child to relate properly to the opposite sex (and to people in general), that child (male or female) needs to have decent role models of both genders.

Martinbns, if your sister and her lesbian lover care at all about the girl they have, they should be having her spend a lot of quality time with you or someone else who can show the little girl how a husband and wife in a good relationship relate to one another. There's no substitute for that, no matter how much love and support is flowing.

Bottom line, there is no substitute for having both a father AND a mother. Single parents can try their best, but all children need both a male and female role model involved in their lives for the best outcomes in their relationships with others. The kids are being sold short otherwise.

Being's where I am the same gender as me can I marry myself?

Vaminrod:

FOUL. Off Limits. Bad form old chap. Lay off my Canadian friends.

These good neighbors and friends are the best in the whole world. You crossed the line. Back off.

Bill Tibbe

Hopefully it will not be an 11 year girl saying that to her 43 year old husband.....................


It has to stop somewhere.

Lets see, socialists at the gates, gun control, not to mention all the damn French.

My friends don't let that happen in their house.

Ramblin Razorback,
I agree with you that it is better to have parents of both sexes and all sorts of influences to raise children. I certainly have tried my best to expose my kids to all kinds of people and things. I feel pretty strongly that a parents responsibility is to ensure his children grow up knowing they are unconditionally loved by their parents and extended family(that doesn't mean giving them money), they be allowed to fail, to think for themselves, and to be held accountable for thier actions. My sister believes the same things, my neice is exposed to my brother and his normal family, both sets of traditional grandparents, me occasionally(I live accros the country)and all sorts of traditional family units.
Steelhead,
I take great exception to your comments about my country.
whether a redneck like you believes it or not the french contribution to the fabric of Canada and the history of Canada helps make Canada what it is. I'm not going to get into a debate about the differences in our systems or way of life(the stupid socialist comment).
You sir, are an Idiot, just another no mind ignorant redneck who gives American's a bad name.

You and Steelhead belong together, that is ridiculous. Believe it NOT

"Beleive it or not , it is perfectly legal in Canada for an adult to have sex with a 14 year old girl, or boy for that matter."

horkin yorkin, You can't be serious....? BTW, catchy screen name you have there...
John

You are correct. I am sorry, it was a statement made with tongue firmly planted in cheek. I shouldn't make blanket statements about 3rd world countries that I don't live in.

I actually have enjoyed my visits to Canada, albeit western Canada. The women are GREAT. I even have friends from Prince Rubert and Williams Lake, and I dated a French canuck from Montreal for over a year, who spoke VERY poor english.

Your country is a model of what I HOPE our country can be someday.

Also, could you please use smaller words next time, kinda hard to follow...........

Age of consent

The Criminal Code does not now criminalize consensual sexual activity with or between persons 14 or over, unless it takes place in a relationship of trust or dependency, in which case sexual activity with persons over 14 but under 18 can constitute an offence, notwithstanding their consent. Even consensual activity with those under 14 but over 12 may not be an offence if the accused is under 16 and less than two years older than the complainant. The exception, of course, is anal intercourse, to which unmarried persons under 18 cannot legally consent, although both the Ontario Court of Appeal(3) and the Quebec Court of Appeal(4) have struck down the relevant section of the Criminal Code.

Up to snuff on your own laws, eh