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Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 50,170 Likes: 2
Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 50,170 Likes: 2 |
Using SWAT teams for evidentiary searches in a routine criminal investigation means that any one of us is subject to a raid of this sort , and , as I pointed out in an earlier post , knowing I'm innocent of any wrongdoing would lead me to respond exactly as the former Marine did.
Except , after being exposed to the mindset of some of the LEO's on here -not you obviously- the safety on my shotgun would not be engaged. SWAT teams are not used for any searches ( unless a primary investigator happens to be on the team). Investigators do searches, SWAT teams secure the scene. Again, how do you know he is "innocent of any wrongdoing"?
The only thing worse than a liberal is a liberal that thinks they're a conservative.
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Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 24,239
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 24,239 |
You ought to count the "may" , "if", "maybe", "could" etc. words in your post, DINK.
You are trying to defend an ACTUAL wrong by using hypothetical justifications.
That's a lawyer trick which might impress Bob.
Not me.
Never holler whoa or look back in a tight place
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Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 34,261
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 34,261 |
The only thing that is known though is that no one knows. Not so. It is known that a man once supporting a family is dead at the hands of the police as a result of a dynamic raid on his home. Maybe that's not relevant in your world and understanding that irrelevance may go a long way in understanding perspectives. DITTOS.
Don't vote knothead, it only encourages them. Anonymous
"Never underestimate the power of stupid people in large groups." Anonymous
"Self-reliance, free thinking, and wealth is anathema to both the power of the State and the Church." Derby Dude
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Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 50,170 Likes: 2
Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 50,170 Likes: 2 |
The only thing that is known though is that no one knows. Not so. It is known that a man once supporting a family is dead at the hands of the police as a result of a dynamic raid on his home. Maybe that's not relevant in your world and understanding that irrelevance may go a long way in understanding perspectives. DITTOS. A lot of things are known, and not on just an emotional level. A magistrate issued a warrant demanding that officers enter the home and bring forth...(something). They did. The subject (and family) of the warrant was there, with a rifle, and was killed. Some kind of evidence was obtained. A lawyer is talking on behalf of the deceased suspect, who was a Marine. The rest is pretty much conjecture.
The only thing worse than a liberal is a liberal that thinks they're a conservative.
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Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 24,239
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 24,239 |
C'mon,Pat. I didn't say HE was innocent. I said that I-knowing that I am innocent- would respond exactly as he did. As a matter of fact that means that I consider his actions to be those of an innocent man , but I said that several pages back. The burden of proving him guilty of a crime rested with the State before he was killed and his death doesn't change that.Technically , he IS not guilty of a crime. At some point in the future , some of you may be in demand as expert witnesses for the defense in a wrongful death lawsuit brought by his widow and on behalf of his kids. Lotsa luck. 
Never holler whoa or look back in a tight place
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Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 34,261
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 34,261 |
The only thing that is known though is that no one knows. Not so. It is known that a man once supporting a family is dead at the hands of the police as a result of a dynamic raid on his home. Maybe that's not relevant in your world and understanding that irrelevance may go a long way in understanding perspectives. DITTOS. A lot of things are known, and not on just an emotional level. A magistrate issued a warrant demanding that officers enter the home and bring forth...(something). They did. The subject (and family) of the warrant was there, with a rifle, and was killed. Some kind of evidence was obtained. A lawyer is talking on behalf of the deceased suspect, who was a Marine. The rest is pretty much conjecture. Can't argue with that either.
Don't vote knothead, it only encourages them. Anonymous
"Never underestimate the power of stupid people in large groups." Anonymous
"Self-reliance, free thinking, and wealth is anathema to both the power of the State and the Church." Derby Dude
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Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 7,472
Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
Joined: Mar 2006
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You ought to count the "may" , "if", "maybe", "could" etc. words in your post, DINK.
You are trying to defend an ACTUAL wrong by using hypothetical justifications.
That's a lawyer trick which might impress Bob.
Not me. You have to use "may", "maybe", "could" and "ifs" when no facts are known. There are few facts known so everything else is a wild azz guess. Dink
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Joined: Oct 2004
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Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 50,170 Likes: 2 |
There is ALWAYS a wrongful death lawsuit and you ALWAYS pay.
The only thing worse than a liberal is a liberal that thinks they're a conservative.
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Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 7,472
Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 7,472 |
The only thing that is known though is that no one knows. Not so. It is known that a man once supporting a family is dead at the hands of the police as a result of a dynamic raid on his home. Maybe that's not relevant in your world and understanding that irrelevance may go a long way in understanding perspectives. How do you know he supported his family? Or did he support his family with drug money and items sold that were taken in the home invasions? Or did he beat, stab or shoot men, women and children in the home invasions? Maybe thats not relevant in your world. Dink
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Joined: Feb 2001
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 24,239 |
The magistrate didn't just wake up one morning and say;"Sic 'em".Somebody convinced him that they needed to enter the house to "get something".They , not he, defined the objects of the search.
The magistrate didn't tell them to use a Swat team in all liklihood.
This deal originated with a PD or SO , was planned and executed by the same.
They OWN it.
Never holler whoa or look back in a tight place
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Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 53,303
Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 53,303 |
The only thing that is known though is that no one knows. Not so. It is known that a man once supporting a family is dead at the hands of the police as a result of a dynamic raid on his home. Maybe that's not relevant in your world and understanding that irrelevance may go a long way in understanding perspectives. DITTOS. A lot of things are known, and not on just an emotional level. A magistrate issued a warrant demanding that officers enter the home and bring forth...(something). They did. The subject (and family) of the warrant was there, with a rifle, and was killed. Some kind of evidence was obtained. A lawyer is talking on behalf of the deceased suspect, who was a Marine. The rest is pretty much conjecture. Yup, ....+1 ......I'd say it's a lead pipe cinch that we'll be sitting right there for quite a while. I mean,....look at the Terry Slaying, and the inherent WRONGNESS of so much that's transpired there. GTC
Member, Clan of the Border Rats
-- “Sometimes I wonder whether the world is being run by smart people who are putting us on or by imbeciles who really mean it.”- Mark Twain
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Posts: 50,170 Likes: 2
Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 50,170 Likes: 2 |
Yup, ....+1
......I'd say it's a lead pipe cinch that we'll be sitting right there for quite a while.
I mean,....look at the Terry Slaying, and the inherent WRONGNESS of so much that's transpired there.
GTC True enough, though in the BP case we know somebody was murdered.
The only thing worse than a liberal is a liberal that thinks they're a conservative.
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Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 62,043
Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 62,043 |
The burden of proving him guilty of a crime rested with the State before he was killed and his death doesn't change that.Technically , he IS not guilty of a crime.
==============
You sure have a knack for the irrelevant and insignificant. Rapists,gangbangers,drug dealers and robbers who are shot in the commission of their crime in progress aren't guilty of a crime either,I guess. You hang your hat on the most meaningless nuances while mistakingly believing you're making some credible point. The marine pointed a gun at SWAT and he's now dead for having done so. I'm rather confident that exact dynamic will play out about 99 times out of every hundred entries, when the alleged perp points a gun at 5 0.
Your comment is really meaningless blather. Were you trying to tie in some relevance with your assertion?
Last edited by isaac; 05/25/11.
The pessimist complains about the wind; the optimist expects it to change; the realist adjusts the sails.
William Arthur Ward
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Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 24,239
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 24,239 |
You ought to count the "may" , "if", "maybe", "could" etc. words in your post, DINK.
You are trying to defend an ACTUAL wrong by using hypothetical justifications.
That's a lawyer trick which might impress Bob.
Not me. You have to use "may", "maybe", "could" and "ifs" when no facts are known. There are few facts known so everything else is a wild azz guess. It is not a wild ass guess that cops launched 71 projectiles into a small area containg a woman and child. Nor that they went into the house , shot and killed a man holding a rifle and withdrew without being fired on. Given those facts [unless the cops change the "facts" again] it is up to the cops to prove that all this was justified. They won't and their employer's Ins.Co. [which means that it will ultimatly be Pima Cty. taxpayers] will write a LARGE check. The former Marine will still be dead and his status as dead hero or suspected crook will be determined with no input from him. All the cops went home at the end of their shift so ultimatly it was a successful operation. I gotta stop for awhile , you people are starting to become real.
Never holler whoa or look back in a tight place
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Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 50,170 Likes: 2
Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 50,170 Likes: 2 |
Maybe so, and it may be because he brought all of this upon himself and his family.
The only thing worse than a liberal is a liberal that thinks they're a conservative.
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Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 2,464
Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 2,464 |
Boring Police Story
I went to the local police station yesterday morning to get a permit to serve and sell liquour at a foodbank fundraiser for which I am the bartender. They took my 25.00 bucks and the application and said thank you, I said thank you back. No one shot me and I went to work afterwards.
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Posts: 10,863
Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 10,863 |
You ought to count the "may" , "if", "maybe", "could" etc. words in your post, DINK.
You are trying to defend an ACTUAL wrong by using hypothetical justifications.
That's a lawyer trick which might impress Bob.
Not me. You have to use "may", "maybe", "could" and "ifs" when no facts are known. There are few facts known so everything else is a wild azz guess. It is not a wild ass guess that cops launched 71 projectiles into a small area containg a woman and child. Nor that they went into the house , shot and killed a man holding a rifle and withdrew without being fired on. Given those facts [unless the cops change the "facts" again] it is up to the cops to prove that all this was justified. They won't and their employer's Ins.Co. [which means that it will ultimatly be Pima Cty. taxpayers] will write a LARGE check. The former Marine will still be dead and his status as dead hero or suspected crook will be determined with no input from him. All the cops went home at the end of their shift so ultimatly it was a successful operation. I gotta stop for awhile , you people are starting to become real. How do we know that 71 rounds were fired? I've served many a search & arrest warrants, i can tell you that the media wasn't invited along. I can also tell you that it's considered a crime scene and the media wasn't allowed to snoop around. In this case, i know it was a crime scene and the media wasn't allowed in the residence or inside the tape for that matter. I hope no one from PCSO gave that info out, which i doubt they did. So other then some media back ally info. where did the number of fired rounds come from?
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Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 53,303 |
" How do we know that 71 rounds were fired?"
Would a Pima County Sheriff Department's press release do, dumbchit?
You'll just run that head and mouth at the drop of a [bleep]' hat,......guess you "pro" LEOs develop a sixth sense that dismisses the need for any backround work,....or READING a post before blowing gas.
Patehetic,.....you'll be demanding someone 'Show" you,...next.
GTC
Last edited by crossfireoops; 05/25/11.
Member, Clan of the Border Rats
-- “Sometimes I wonder whether the world is being run by smart people who are putting us on or by imbeciles who really mean it.”- Mark Twain
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Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 50,170 Likes: 2
Campfire Kahuna
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Campfire Kahuna
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 50,170 Likes: 2 |
I don't laugh easy and I know neither one of you are going to like this, but you two sound just like brothers in this thread.  Edited to say...No! I got it! The movie "Stepbrothers".
The only thing worse than a liberal is a liberal that thinks they're a conservative.
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Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 844
Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 844 |
" How do we know that 71 rounds were fired?"
Would a Pima County Sheriff Department's press release do, dumbchit?
GTC Zing!!!
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