Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Hunter's Campfire Explore a hypothetical with me

..............The more you post, the more the complete and idiotic moron you look!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

There aren`t enough exclamation points, commas, periods, which could imply, indicate or emphasize what a total and complete ass you are.

You are very representative of your own party`s symbol.

Like in `010,,,,the "jack ass" will be crushed in `012.

If you think that the current economic situation is a mere "recesssion",..then you're too damn dumb to even have a discussion with.

This is a currency meltdown.

Gold doesn't hit $1800+ an ounce as a result of a "recession".

Still compensating for your lack of a point I see.

If you think a currency meltdown is the worst we got comin', you're too damn dumb to have a discussion with....... read the thread....










(what's gotten into you today, anyway?!)

.............Well at the very least, my posts have content and intelligence, which is a far cry from what you have posted or can ever post.

How do ya explain the debt #s that I posted earlier?

Whether you are Paddler, Peddler or whomever. Everytime you are confronted with actual facts, you resort to feeble im-maturities within your replies.

That`s what liberal do. Why change!

Guys... get a room...

The ekklesia of Christ as He established it, in spiritual preparation for eternity in the kingdom of God.

No attempt at any man-made substitute stands a snow ball's chance and may not even delay the inevitable.

.............Piddle paddler peddler wouldn`t survive in a room with me!.....

Not a good idea.

JO on "peak oil":


No, Jeff, it's not going to happen.

There are several reasons. First of all, you'll notice that when oil/gas gets too expensive, demand falls off. Then the price goes back down.

There are many other factors though. First, there is enough coal in Montana alone (according to the governor there) to provide oil for 200 years at our current rate of consumption, at around $50/barrel using the well understood process of coal gasification. The only obstacle is the environut movement which will be swept aside if things get bad enough.

Then there are the tens of billions of barrels of offshore oil that the current administration is blocking from development, as well as major new onshore supplies facing the same blockage.

None of this even factors in the emergence of cheap biofuels, which are possible.

LONG before we "run out of oil" solar, nuclear and other major sources of energy will be fill the gap, along with practical hydrogen or battery-powered vehicles.

The economy does face some long-term issues, most importantly the wave of retiring baby-boomers who'll turn from taxpayers to tax consumers.

However, I think President Palin will get things back on the right track. =:-D

Gah! Not Palin!

Thanks for the post.

First off, to address your first statement, it categorically IS going to happen. It's not "if", it's "when".

Coal liquificatiin is very likely to be part of an attempt to mitigate the costs of declining oil. It's not really a fix, though. It's a very energy-intensive process; much more so than oil refining. Energy will be expensive, remember. The carbon output of the process is beyond massive, so something will have to be done about that. They've got ideas... But the main problem is, as usual, cost. Coal mining is a very oil-intensive process, ironically, so the cost of getting the coal and transporting it goes way up. The price of coal will rise due to demand as oil starts to taper off and we need more electricity. Finally, coal extraction has followed the same predictable pattern as other resource extraction: we've picked the high-quality, low hanging fruit. It just gets harder and more expensive from here.

So, I agree that coal liquification will be somewhat of a bridge to whatever is next, but it will be an expensive bridge, and the fundamental problem here is cost. The high cost of energy is what (among other things, lol) will keep us in a permanent state of economic malaise.

Then there's the ecological cost of ripping up states like Montana and Wyoming, but that's a foregone conclusion unfortunately. How do you put a price on that?

Agree that solar and nuclear will be big parts of future energy infrastructure. Likely hydrogen too. But none of them are what oil is: cheap, portable, concentrated and already existing as energy (in the case of hydrogen, which is best seen as an energy storage mechanism, not a source).

Peak oil does not destroy humanity. That's not my point. My point is, it's a hugely under-reported, near-certain economic disaster that has no solution that doesn't take several decades, and uncounted trillions of dollars, to even get to a functional replacement infrastructure. Can the US and global economy just make that happen without adverse effect? Are we well positioned as a nation to absorb this hit? I'd say no and no.

Get used to it, "President Palin" has a lovely sound really.


Not if other energy sources come online fast enough. Then, there's no "crunch" as oil runs out - it simply becomes more expensive and used for things like plastic and pharmaceuticals.


I think you need to read up on this. The original cost I saw per barrel for oil produced from coal was $40/barrel. I raised it a bit to account for inflation, however that is still well below the current cost per barrel of oil. Do some research.


The only thing keeping us in a state of economic malaise is President 0, which is a temporary condition. The parallels between him and Jimmuh Carter are staggering.


The percentage of those states involved would be quite low. The gasification process doesn't have to happen there, rail could take the coal to New Jersey or some other "armpit state". :-) (Apologies to any NJ residents reading that...kind of.)


Solar and nuclear are both "cheaper" than oil, given proper oversight and regulation - as opposed to the current ridiculous state of affairs.

BTW, nuclear waste is an eminently solvable problem - drop it, suitably packaged, at the mid-Pacific subduction zone. If packaged in super-strong, non-corrosive "torpedoes" they'd hit fast enough to embed in the sea bottom, then eventually they'd be dragged down to the mantle. Problem solved.

The reason that approach hasn't been pursued so far, though, is the "waste" is too valuable to throw away...look into "reprocessing". A fast breeder reactor program could recycle 90% of the "waste" back into useful fuel.

Then there are thorium reactors, in which China is heavily investing, which use a very plentiful fuel and produce waste that decays in just a few hundred years.

The problem is absolutely not that there's not enough energy - it's that the current view of how to exploit it is FUBAR.


You're way off base with this assessment. That's all.

The only way the energy sources that COULD mitigate the crunch could be online in time is if we started... yesterday. It's going to be massively expensive. In my opinion there's neither the political will nor financial ability for any nation to do this... short of putting economies of a pseudo-wartime footing.

By the way, what is Pres. Palin's energy policy other than "drill baby drill"? Is she pushing for what you and I agree must happen, starting yesterday? Is it a central theme for her?

I'm enjoying reading your posts- well done sir- but I'm of the feeling that you are complexly misjudging the size of the problem. In your first post you (I think it was you) mentioned the deepwater Gulf fields. In the best case scenario they represent about a month's worth of global demand. And that oil is under 8000 feet of water and 20,000 feet of rock. To say it sill be expensive to extract is an undestatement. Same with the Alberta oil sands or the shale oil formations in the Rockies. Cost.

As production declines and price goes exponential, it cripples our, and everyone else's, already-FUBAR economy.

I suppose if I were to put it succinctly (hard for me, lol), I'd say that in order for what you say to be true, there'd need to be a lack of denial, global will to tackle this, and economies able to do the infrastructure upgrades.

I see denial, no will, and no resources.

Therefore, nothing will happen until it's a crisis. And therefore, there will be decades of pain.