Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Hunter's Campfire Explaining the War in Vietnam

In light of the interest in the current program Vietnam in HD, it would be beneficial to give the youngsters a primer on Vietnam.

Let's see if you guys can keep your comments to 4 short statements or less. Here goes:

What you really need to know about the Vietnam War:

- The French were there first and screwed things up

- Ho Chi Minh started the insurgency by having the Viet Cong kill every village chief, school teacher, and doctor they could in oder to destabilize South Vietnam. A real guerilla terrorist campaign.

- LBJ, with advise from McNamara and Westmoreland figured that by escalating the numbers of troops, they could kill enough VC and NVA to make Uncle Ho back off.

- When that didn't work out, Nixon bombed the crap out of Hanoi, started Peace Talks, and tried to turn the whole mess over to the South Vietnamese.

There it is, 4 statements. Add your own 4.

That Walter Cronkite,Dan Rather and the rest of the "journalists" handed the communist [bleep] their psychological victory. The "students and leftists" demonstrated(destroyed things) and the North had the real motivation to keep on. After Tet the VC was destroyed and the NVA was in a serious hurt. Defeat snatched from the jaws of Victory.

Jim, I was hoping you'd jump on this early. Hope the youngsters are reading.

Not old enough to remember the Vietnam war(born in 67) and not really a 'youngster' but seems to me we could have had the thing in the bag if Nixon had kept up the bombing of Hanoi and other targets in the North?
Or am I totally off base here, Jim?

100% spot on but I'll add my four:

We screwed up by not helping the French out MORE like before Dien Bien Phu, in fact we pressured ALL the colonial powers to give up their empires in our naive belief (that we still have, i.e. "nationbuilding) that all these dopes could turn all these colonies into mirror images of the US and forgetting about the terms "power vacuum" and "Realpolitik".

Once we got in (and rightfully so to stop communist expansionism that threatened OUR national interests), we let a bunch of pussydemocraps run the show with scripted tactics and objectives.

We let the MSM in there with open arms thinking they were actually on our side, and they in turn made all the sheep over here believe we could not win(you know, the same people that just voted in Ohio and are more concerned with ESPN and American Idol than current events)

Once a Repubican (sort of) got in there, we let the MSM (again) drive the train and even though we were a hair's breath from total victory, we negotiated a phony peace, then left, once again thinking democracy would work and that the NVA with the full weight of the Chinks and Russians would not take advantage of the aforementioned "power vacuum" theory (HINT: it's about to happen in Iraq once we leave).

I have read somewhere that Lyndon Johnson owned controlling interest in Bell Helicopters, can anyone confirm or refute that?

When Nixon ordered round the clock bombing of Hanoi rather that the previous "on schedule" strikes, the North was truly schitting a brick. They felt actual FEAR. US ground troops had been kicking the ass of the NVA at a great cost and the combination would have put the commie [bleep] out of business IF the media and the demorat congress had kept their mealy moufs shut. Keep in mind that we withdrew as per Paris Acoords that included a pledge to continue air support to the South which the demorats abrogated very quickly. They never intended to keep a promise. They still don't.

Those of us who were there had damn little time to ponder political ramifications. We were too busy ducking bullets and enduring the weather, bugs, and diseases.

The hardest part of doing your job was the inane and insane limitations on what you could do - while the enemy ignored any and all rules.

Except for uniformed NVA, you were never sure who was friend or foe. Not even women or little kids could be trusted. For that matter, uniformed ARVN couldn't always be trusted.

Something seldom mentioned: The war may have been mentally harder on our families and spouses than on us. There was almost NO communication except for very iffy mail. The services gave families next to no help, housing, or support. Worse, they had to endure public opprobrium merely because of their relation to us.

That's my four.

We even did that wrong. Kept the same flight path over Hanoi day after day, and the the NVA put their USSR donated SAM's to work and a whole bunch of flyboys checked into the Hanoi Hilton.

The bombing by itself wouldn't have secured victory by itself. The the NVA quickly decentralized everything they could out of Hanoi. No industry to ruin to begin with. It did motivate them to come and talk.

Mining Haiphong harbor came 10 years too late. We feared that if one of the Soviet supply ships blew up on our mines, then WWIII would follow.

1. The chief traitor of Vietnam; Jane Fonda.



2. The Democrat who got the US into Vietnam. "...ask what YOU can do for your country."



3. The Democrat who f***ed it up.



4. The Republican who got us out of Vietnam.

What was the saying? If they are running, they�re VC. If they�re standing, they�re well trained VC.



McNamara and the rest of the �Best and Brightest� get a lot of my enmity. They ignored the recommendations of their on the ground commanders, figured they knew better, and went with their own ideas. (Hmm, sound like something in recent events?) McNamara particularly figured everything could be quantified and measured, e.g. body counts as a measure of success. IIRC, this was the same man who gave us the Ford Edsel.

Shouldn't have been escalated in 65-66.
Once there, should have gone north to Hanoi and actually defeat N Viet Nam.
Politicians shouldn't be the ones to decide on targets for bombing.
Jane Fonda should have been tried for treason.

Found cache in A Shau Valley. Weapons,ammunition,and MEDICAL SUPPLIES that had labels. Memory no exact, but they went "donated to the brave People's Army of Vietnam by their friends at UC Berkely(BERZERKELY)Students in Solidarity with_____" I highly doubt that that was the only cache that contained such gems.

Vocabulary Homework for tonight. If unfamiliar, read up on:

Napalm


Booby Trap


Tunnel Rat


Phu Gas


Punji

Wow, I had never heard about that.

Sickening.

Why would the "journalists" report on such a thing???? The ONLY one Soldiers trusted and held in actual awe(1st Cav) was Joe Galloway and he wasn't there with us.

I don't have 4 things. Politically it was a complete lack of understanding of the culture of Viet Nam. Much like the Middle East, they've always warred, and always will. You can win a war vs an Army, but not a culture.

Militarily, it was a complete lack of understanding of how to deal with guerrilla tactics, and fighting a war where taking and holding of real estate wasn't of military importance.

1. make sure before you enter a fist fight or a war it's a fight worth fighting

2. once that decision has been made, you go balls to the walls with everything you've got to end it decisively and quickly. only 1 rule Win Baby WIN

3. anyone and everyone that stands in your way as an impediment towards the goal of #2 should be removed with extreme prejudice, including Walter Commmunist Cronkhite and Jane [bleep] traitor Phonda

4. if you can't make the distinction between politicians decisions and men in uniform desperately trying to stay alive STFU or prepare to have your azz stomped beyond all recognition



those 4 do it for me

well Lady Bird was a major stock holder in Bell as she was in Brown & Root (which received tremendous contracts in building bases and runways in Viet Nam.
Lady Bird was the front for LBJ's ventures.

Fixed that for ya.