Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Deer Hunting Hunt preperation differences, East vs West, Private vs Public?etc.

It's interesting the differences in preparation before hunting, (scouting etc) there are between the Eastern and Western states. Or maybe it's just Whitetails vs Muledeer? Private vs public? We have no Whitetails here, I believe there are some on the Eastern slope of CO, but I've never seen anyone use a night game camera to "scout" with. Also I believe "chumming" or "baiting" is very illegal here. It may be different if we were overrun with deer like I keep hearing some of the Eastern states are with whitetails? Maybe it's just differences in habitat or behaviour of the animals? Scouting here (rarely if any) consists of high country tracking/glassing/stalking etc. We usually scout as we are elk hunting (depending on what season we draw). Some people here have commented about the private land whitetail tactics stating that it's not really hunting, but I wonder what they would do in the same situation? Still one has to wonder where the line is drawn? Are there people that have high fencing, and close in deer to keep them on their property? Why not snare them the night before and shoot them on opening morning? If I were to go to Iowa and hunt whitetails on my in-laws property, would I have to adopt these tactics? I have problems with people "hunting" for bulls on private ranches around here and still calling it hunting. JMHO, Vern. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif" alt="" />

The high-fence debate is a very opinionated subject....I will so this ....I would much rather kill a trophy free-ranging deer on a low fence rather than a trophy high-fenced groomed deer....it would just be so much more meaningful...

Saying that though I can see both sides of the arguement and it just depends on your situation....that's all I'll say for now....

If you have a problem with just hunting on private land,
how do you feel about me sitting in my deer blind,overlooking my corn feeder,on my land,with my low fence?

I hunt free ranging whitetails on private ground here in Kansas. I dont use corn flippers or tree stands. The largest piece of ground i hunt, is 600 acres, most being from 20 to 120 acres. I do not have ANY piece of land to myself, some is leased, but is shared with my dad and 3 other guys, one 40 acre piece and a half section..The 600 acre piece is almost all corn stubble and one side is bordered by a crick, on the other side is a half section of woods, little corn patches and weed patches. I do not have permission on that side, it is Posted every 100 yds and u will get to visit the fish Cop if you are caught over there. It is also covered with corn flippers, mineral licks, and whatever else you can buy to hold deer in there, but is not fenced in any way. It is hunted heavily all 3 weapon seasons. The deer stay over there unless pushed out by their 4 wheelers or shooting.
Other places I hunt are the same way, people setting in the property lines, driving deer out with trucks, people in places they KNOW they r not supposed to be. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/mad.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/confused.gif" alt="" />
It burns my @ss when people say that if its private its not hunting, I would love for some of you guys to come hunt "Private land Whitetails " with me and see how its like "shootin fish in a barrel"! Just because its private, it says nothing about how "tame" the Deer are.
I have shot a "good", 130-170 B&C, buck every year but 2 since I was 16, last year was #2. I hunted morning and night almost every day of the season, 2 days out of them all I didnt have someone shooting on the property right next to me, shooting off of the road back towards me, driving in where they werent supposed to be, yelling at the deer in front of me, Etc ETC. It SUCKED, I was so discouraged after season, I wanted to give it up, and start bowhunting, it wouldnt be quite as bad then......... I rambled like hell, but its not a pice of cake to hunt private around here.......... <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" /> Thank you for reading my crap....... 721 Tomahawk

Bart, That is fine, to each his own, I'm talking about the ranches where the elk are almost tame, someone takes you out and points at one and says "that's the one, take him", doesn't seem like hunting to me but What ever turns your crank, I'm just saying there are alot of differences, ....for different tastes I guess.

721, It's not crap and it just goes to show you how much I know about whitetail hunting, I never would have thought that hunting season would be so crowded in central Kansas. Vern.

Vern, Its not like that ALL the time, but most people dont just get on their quad and ride, on THEIR property or lease, out to the corn flipper and shoot a tame monster buck. I start scouting after season until season the next year. Its pretty hard to see anything from July 1st to now because the corn isnt harvested and there is so much other cover..
Poaching and trespassing is getting ridiculous around this area. I dont know how many people road hunt and shoot any deer wherever they see it, permission or not and most of them dont stay on the road and that is going to ruin it for everyone... I caught a rich old out of state Prick and 3 others on our lease Qual hunting last year. They drove by three "LEASED, NO HUNTING" signs and the telephone pole where they pulled into the field is PURPLE. I asked who they got permission from and he said they had hunted there 6 or 7 yrs ago with another guy that had permission then, so they figured it was OK. Then I got a little rude because he said "NO BIg deal we'll leave"!! <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/mad.gif" alt="" /> BULLSHIT, it is a big deal , he was a liar and we pay hard earned money to Lease it, he didnt have clue who owned it then or now!!!!! I called for a Fish Cop and a deputy showed up. I told them I wanted to press charges, the deputy called his Superior and the superior said there was nothing they could do. There is no "trespass"law in Kansas, it has to be "Criminal Trespass", Whut the Fark is that??????????? <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/confused.gif" alt="" /> I said he was killing my birds and shooting holes in my trees, isnt that criminal enough. NOPE, SURE AINT, according to MR. Superior. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/confused.gif" alt="" />
SOOOOOOO, sum people suck and ther aint DICK u can do about it, legally!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/confused.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" /> Jesse

Savage, you're talking about one of the reasons I don't hunt deer where I currently make my home in North Carolina (in my own defence I only stay here since I was married to a local when I got out of the Army and right now we have family obligations that keep us from moving). Most of the land here is private and most of the whitetail hunting is with dogs or over bait. Dogs I can understand as I've always been a "dog person" and have no problem hunting other species, like birds and rabbits, with them. However, most folks around here "hunt" the corn pile. An acquaintance of mine has hunted the same corn pile, with deer tracks all around it, for 3 years without even seeing a deer. Most of these bait hunters seem like ignoramuses also, many of their hunting stories involve shooting from a vehicle, and blatant disrespect for game in general. One guy described his hound hunting as "hitting a deer and tracking it for miles." This same guy (I might be picking a bit at an example of one or two but this has been my experience with folks down here) was so ballistically ignorant that he told me my .30 WCF's bullets would tumble at 100 yards and "lose their accuracy!"

It's just like road hunters in my home state of Pennsylvania. These guys never get a quarter mile off the road (so sad as there's no end of roadless hills and hollows around my place up there, more than I can hike in two weeks of rifle season) and then claim there's no deer! However there is a lot more public land up there and there seems to be a better ethic among the majority of the hunters, although there are still road shooters and guys who shoot out of season, or just let a deer lay if they don't want it. In fact, I found a button buck once like that, someone had shot before looking for horns and when they found it, seeing it was illegal (this was back when PA had a bucks only rifle season, 1999 IIRC), left it to rot. But there still those of us, fortunately, that look at hunt preparation as working out, practicing with our weapons, and getting out in the woods and looking around. The bad news is that we're no longer a majority, at least in my experience.

I don�t think my experience of eastern whitetail hunting is atypical so I�ll describe it. We have about 1000 acres in Whitley County KY. No need to Mapquest it�s off of RT 75, the last town in KY before you get to TN in the SE corner of the state. It�s been in the family since 1890 and is not fenced except along the road and that�s more hedgerow than fence anymore. Topographically it�s one valley with two smaller hollows off it with an elevation change of about 1000 feet from top to bottom. This URL may show the terrain of the property.

http://tinyurl.com/aub9q

It was last farmed in WWII but most of it is too steep for a mule team or tractor. My brother and I put in about 10 acres of � to 3-acre plots of various food plots every year. We have one corn feeder that sits down in the valley. No one hunts within several hundred yards of the feeder, which, frankly, feeds more squirrels and turkeys than deer but that alone is worth the entertainment. About 30 years ago a seam of coal was taken out and Tampa Bay Electric did a great job reclaiming the land, creating one small pond and on nice 3 acre 33� deep lake. There are six of us who hunt the land modern season and three of us who hunt muzzleloader. We do not use ATV�s to go in and out but all still or stand hunt as appropriate and hike in from our vehicles in the bottoms. We have all taken 130 B&C plus deer over the last ten years and there�s bigger one�s there.

All-in-all. It�s private land, we enhance via planting, we have feeder (for what it�s worth) and we hunt fair chase. I�ve hunted out West in Wyoming and Washington State and while that�s where I would rather be I�m lucky to have what we have and hunt at an ethical standard. It�s different but not better or worse.

Allen

Here in New Yorkistan, we have an enormous public access area to hunt--IF you want to hump the hills. and forests. In the Northern half of the state it is the Adirondack Park. Low density but tending to have very large body sized bucks. Southern half of the state has more farmland and most is posted except the Catskills. Western part of the state has lotsa deer but I have never hunted there. Scouting the Adirondacks is a labor of love in itself. Lotta very hard terrain to look at.

I'm not going to fall into knocking how others choose to hunt. I was born, raised, and live in Michigan so I grew up a whitetail hunter and still love it. I also love the west and have hunted mule deer in Montana, Utah, and Idaho. I have and do hunt private and public land. I have never hunted land that was fenced or with feeders set up. I'm not passing judgement, only commenting that I have no experience to judge. All that being said there are some fundimental differences between hunting the two. The key with whitetails is that they have small home ranges, generally 1 square mile or so. That is what makes scouting so important. Scouting is like playing detective. You know the deer are there but the trick is figuring out where exactly they will be during shooting hours and where to place yourself to get a shot. It looks easy on TV when a hunter takes a buck from a stand but to consistantly be successful it takes a lot of work figuring out where to place the stand. The dirfference between public and private land is that you are trying to figure out the deer's natural movements on private land where on public it is often a matter of predicting what they will do when pressured by other hunters. Because their home range is smaller whitetails are masters of using every piece of cover to their advantage. Mule deer on the other hand, at least where I hunt them have much larger territories so you need to cover more ground to find them. Weather plays a greater role on where they will be. The country is bigger and lends itself to spot and stalk hunting which is great fun.
From a preperation standpoint, for mule deer hunting I focus on conditioning and shooting. Where I hunt it is not unusual to hike 10-12 miles in a day and we pack the meat out on our backs. For whitetails my preparation is more geared to preseaon scouting, setting up stands, and stealth. oth are great fun and I'm already having a hard time sleeping as our bow season for whitetails opens this weekend.

Good hunting,

Jeff

Wow, I'm getting lots of info here, I didn't know whitetails range was typically so small, Are they more allert than mule deer? Does anyone still-hunt (stalk) whitetails?

Vern

A bit off topic but I've seen a couple of good WT killed off the air force base or area around Colorado Springs a number of years back. So they aren't that far from you in reality either. Just FYI.

Jeff

Definately more alert than mule deer. Still hunting whitetails is a lot of fun but it's tough. With mule deer you have an advantage in that you can spot them at a distance and plan a stalk. Whitetails often stick to cover where you are lucky if you can see 50 yards.

Jeff

Jeff, I've talked to a couple of people who hunted for whitetails on the east slope but I think you would be using up a mule deer chance to do that? Don't remember seeing a different whitetail license in the CDOW stuff. Something I may be looking into in the future, I'll have to talk to some informants regarding Colo whitetails. Thanx, Vern.

Does Colorado allow out-of-staters to get muley licenses nowadays? Thought they'd cut that off a few years back (the same year I was gonna buy one).

Haven't been lucky enough to get a muley buck, but sure seems like the muley does aren't as skittish as the whitetail does around where I hunt.

I never have hunted whitetails behind high fencing, but from what I gather it is not as much for keeping the deer in, as it is for keeping the overpopulated stunted deer out! As well as being helpful for balancing the buck doe ratio which means the dominant bucks do most of the mating.
I have hunted a ranch that was adjacent to high fencing and the vegatation was just as dense on the other side, certainly no zoo.
If the place is several hundred acres of typical whitetail habitat, the fence will not help you to see more deer or "snare" any of them. <img src="/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif" alt="" />

Calhoun, I believe it's been a couple years now that they will take your money, go here: http://wildlife.state.co.us/hunt/season_dates_fees.asp
Only $293.25
However, you'll have to hunt long and hard to find a Decent 4 point still, but they are starting to rebound. Not sure if you need pref. points or not though, probably depends where you want to go? Don't they have mulies in Nebraska?

I have been fortunate enought to learn my hunting spots to the point I have a pretty good idea where I'll be standing before I ever set foot in the woods. Don't get me wrong-I've done my homework in years past-but I get away with making a quick check of my spot the evening before deer season and then getting out of the woods 'till the next morning. I hunt public land, from the ground, and my main concern is to make sure no one has hung a tree stand in my immediate area. I hunt pretty rugged country, and the road hunters are too lazy to get back in there with me, so I've never had to fall back to plan "B" but would be able to if necessary. I hunt the edge of an old clear cut which has a scrape line on it every year. It's a nice setup, and as long as I practice scent control, and don't disturb the area, I see deer and take my deer very regularly.

Western Nebraska has muleys, and actually the area I hunt has a fair population. Just not the land I hunt <sigh>, and all the good land is leased to out-of-staters. I don't mind the ranchers doing that, hard enough to make money ranching anyway.

Always wanted to hunt Colorado since watching a 6x6 muley buck northwest of Fort Collins one night. My brain knows I won't get one like that, but intelligence and hunting don't always go together! I've seen more muley bucks in Colorado over the course of a couple of months there than I've seen in a lifetime in nebraska. Heck, just about hit more muley bucks with my jeep in one night driving back from elk hunting up by Rifle than I've seen in nebraska<grin>.

Well, for about $270 difference, I might just have to get myself a muzzleloader permit next year and try some of the public land out in western Nebraska. Hate trying to hunt new land during rifle season... too many idi... umm... hunters;)

I agree with some of what you said, but first you have to understand that private land does not always have fences and the deer are free roaming sometimes. I hunt in NC and yes I hunt private land that me and 11 others lease for still hunting. I do not bait deer such as putting out corn feeders and such. Although some years we plant food plots when the farmer plants all cotton. This helps keep some deer on our property. There is very little public land left here in NC so if you want to hunt and hunt safely this what we have to do sometimes. I spend time scouting and placing stands were I would like to hunt, but this goes on all season because the deer change their patterns during the season. I mostly spend my time before the season cutting paths to my honey holes and getting my equipment ready to hunt. I have learned that hunting whitetails is work all season and most of the off season. I have hunted out west and since a lot of the land is wide open and there is plenty of public land the hunting tactics are very different. Since I have hunted both places I know that the hunting can be very hard either place. Of course this does not make me a expert. It is hard to glass 5,000 acres of pines on mostly flat land or a cutover the same size that is grown up 6 or 8 feet tall. The deer on our property are free roaming so one day they are there and one day they are not. I usually try to ambush the deer between the food and water and the bedding areas and sometimes I hunt the bean fields. I like being down in the creek bottoms the most though, I like to surprise them.