Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Long Range Hunting 264 Win vs 6.5X284 vs 7mm Rem mag

I've had 2, 6.5-06's built. One for targets/comp and one for hunting.
One built on a Surgeon XL action. One on a Remmy 700. They both shoot sub .5 moa to 500 yards. I plan to use the hunting one for Deer and Elk. My limit on Elk will be 600 ish. The both drive the 139's and 140's at just a hair shy of 3000 fps.

I've had many many rifles in many calibers over the years. In my older age I've realized I hate heavy recoil and I don't really like burning a ton of powder to reach something way out there every time I trip the trigger. Mostly cause I like to shoot the rifles I have, often.

Yep I could have a cartridge with more horse power. But to accomplish what I need it really isn't needed.

In the end it is about accuracy, bullet placement and impact velocity.

If you aren't crazy about the underrated, under appreciated, near perfect, 6.5-06. Look at the 7 wizzum. The 7 RM is nice but over rated in my opinion. Plus there's the belted thing.

The 264 takes a beating on so many fronts it's almost pathetic..most common misconception is it's a "barrel burner"..BS no more so than many other high velocity hitters.Launching 100 grainers at 3400-3500 will take it's toll in a hurry out of anything but personally I haven't met or shot with anyone over the years where that's their go to bullet weight.I built mine around the 140gr pill where it really shines and have put thousands of rounds out with still MOA capability but where common sense prevails bore life will be extended you can put that in the bank!

That's it in a nutshell.......

Of the three, my recommendation, based on 11 years of 1K BR, where accuracy comes first, would be the 6.5-284. I only know of a couple of guys that runs 6.5-06's or 280AI's, one quite successful with a 6.5x55AI, and nobody with a 264 or 7 Mag, but the 6.5-284 has been an over whelming favorite, by far. It's a good compromise of performance and barrel life, with an outstanding accuracy background.

I getting an 8 twist Bartlein chambered in it for a new LR hammer this week......

aalf is right.

At long range, accuracy is king and it's hard to beat the 6.5-284. Faster rounds may buck the wind better, but with ranging reticles and turrets, the 6.5-284 is a excellent long range round. I like 140's in my 8.5 twist Kreiger, using SST's and VLD's. Mine will print 4 1/2" at 600 from a bench and my turret is calibrated for my best Vv N165 load.

I also shoot a Brux barreled 7RM, but don't have (or need) a .264WM.

To answer the OP, I'd go with the 6.5-284.

IMHO,

DF

David,

For comparisons in hunting rifle barrel lengths(26-27"):

6.5-06 Imp 140 Berger 3070-3120fps
6.5-284 140 Berger 2950-3000fps
264WM 140 Berger 3150-3200fps
7RM 180 Berger 3020-3060fps

All can be built to be "benchrest" accurate although the 264WM tends to be a little finicky. These are actual numbers based off of drop from out to 1 mile from rifles out of the shop.

I would go with the 7RM. The 6.5's are to close to yoru 243 ballistics now and really wouldn't be much of a step up. I wouldn't worry about the belt either. Its only needed on the first firing, then just bump the shoulder like any other case. The biggest misconception is that the belt is not accurate and it has to be used for headspace. If people actually measured a virgin piece of brass compared to a headspace gauge, they would be very surprised and how much shorter it is. Accuracy is all in how they are put together. My personal 7RM has shot several groups in the .1's and .2's from a 10lb hunting rifle as well as a few sub 4" groups at 1k.

Might muddy the waters a little here and throw in the 7mm Mashburn as well for your consideration.

Travis,

What twist? How's the 7 RM or Mashburn vs the 7 WSM/SAUM?

I just paid off the 243AI scope and now this.

Back to the poor house.

It's a hard life

Go 9 twist in the 7's. The RM and Mashburn will outperform the WSM/SAUM's with lower pressures. Case capacity and heavy bullets go hand in hand. If a guy was only going to shoot 168's and lower, the WSM would be fine. The 180 is a fantastic bullet though and the larger cases drive it along much better with no effort.

<4" at 1K is super. I thought I was doing good at 600. My rifle is a hunting sporter with 26" bbl, around nine pounds all up, not a heavy, long barreled type.

It seems 600 to 1K and beyond, separates the men from the boys, and I have great respect for those who do that.

Seems to be more real long range shooting out West, and not so much locally. Although I do hunt some out West, most of my shooting has been 400 yds. or less.

DF

The 7RM and the 7WSM have nearly identical case capacities. Assuming proper throating and mag constraints, they should be identical twins in the performance department...

Depending on what action you choose, the 7mm RM is going to be considerably more flexible regarding seating depth. Most times the WSM is crowded into a "short" action with a mag limited to the SAAMI OAL, 2.860. OTOH, a 7mm RM will be a long action. Some are '06 length (like Ruger) but Remington uses an H&H length action.

Often if you set up the throat for a hunting bullet at SAAMI-acceptible length, a long VLD will also just touch the rifling with the bullet base/corner right about the base of the case neck, but with a much longer OAL, often a lot over SAAMI. Being able to take advantage of that with a real long action can be pretty handy.

Tom

The Kimber 8400 WSM action, IMO, is perfect length for that family of carts. There's a ton of mag latitude.

Tanner, if you would refresh my memory but does the Montana (aka Big Sky) hold 3 WSM rounds down or 2 with the bolt closing over top?

Thx
Dober

Dober, I do believe it holds 3 in the belly. Hopefully all I'll ever need in a volley on critters

Dober,

They're 3+1

Well......there is this....which I would not mention for fear of appearing biased,since I have one..and in an effort to be "objective". So, I stuck with what the OP put on the post as choices....Travis is braver than me...

But everything Travis says is true. That the 6.5's might manage longer strings with less recoil is no doubt true....but magnum 7's bring recoil to pretty manageable levels;and we are talking hunting cartridges here.Whatever goodness the 6.5's bring to the table, I don't understand how a bit more of the same from the 7mm's is somehow a handicap....

In comparing other 7mm's of similar capacity,how one is a winner,the other "overrated", I never understood.

As an aside issue, personally, I am not going to shoot at a big game animal with a bullet(any bullet) that can not make it through the air and flies to flinders from too much twist,and too much velocity....even if this means I leave some distance on the table.

Whoa...

OK albeit I don't know you but this...



Is a tad hard to swallow. I've watched the 1K BR nationals champion in perfect conditions barely break 5"
I've shot 1, 4.1" group in my competition days.

A few sub 4" groups at 1K from a hunting rig? If you'd a said 10" I'd be ok with that as I've done that in a hunting rig.

No worries....you are right though, we have never met. The guys that I do compete against would gladly back this up. My "hunting" rifles weigh in between 10-15lbs depending on the rig. They are basically setup the same as my tactical match rifles, which I have won benchrest matches with. In all honesty, if my rifles shoot a 10" group at 1K, they are getting rebarreled. This is under field conditions with a bipod, prone in the dirt as well. I know several guys that can easily hold 1/2moa at 1k consistently. Hell, most of our tactical matches only have 10" targets at the 1000-1200yd range. I am not sure that I could do it with my 6-7lb LW rifles, but that is not what they are designed for. In our builds, if they don't meet my 1/2moa accuracy requirement, they don't leave the shop. Our style of LRH rifles.


If you find my post hard to swallow, than that is your opinion, your entitled to it. Here is a 300yd group from one of my hunting rifles that measures in the .2's from a bipod to give you an idea. This same rifle has shot multiple 4" groups at 1k with lots of witnesses as well as multiple critters beyond the 1k mark.

Cool rigs TMR. Very cool.

Travis (TMR) built my 243 AI.

It's a one-holer at 100 yards. I'll see what it does further out this weekend.

Cocadori - I have a couple of sincere points/questions per your post.

Why go to the expense of building a 6-06 to push a 139/140 bullet " a hair shy of 3000 fps." ? I've been pushing 140 BTSPs at 3000 fps since Hornady introduced them for the 270 Win.
As a loony, a 6-06 is different, but how much? Why is it worth the extra expense? The powder charges can't be that diff.

As far a the 7 RM, I don't understand the 'belt thing' that you and others see as a problem. I've had several belted mags in 7, 8, 300, 338, & (375 not mine) over a lot of yrs. NO PROBLEMS.

The 7 RM pushes 139 BTSP at 3300 fps with 67-68 grs powder. I don't see or FEEL that as excessive.

MAYBE it just different personalities, desires, or being different AND THAT'S OKAY. I just don't feel the EXTRA EXPENSE is needed.

Sincerely, I am NOT trying to start a verbal fight.