Home Forums Reloading Bullet Casting Please, check my work

Getting ready to test for my Pre 64 W70 in 9.3x62. Had Veral Smith make me a mold with two different bullets; 168 gr PB and 170 gr GC.

I took 50 new Hornady pc of brass. Ran them through the Redding FL sizer die to make sure all was evened up. Then ran them through a Buffalo Arms expander cut to .365". I chamfered all brass mouths. The PB bullets, lubed and sized with the custom sizer die come out .365". They weigh 167 to 168.5 gr. I was able to seat them by hand with a bit of resistance. I placed the rear of the bullet at the neck/shoulder junction. They protrude into the lands approx .025". I then set the Redding Seater die to crimp about .004".

I contacted my ADI friend. ADI makes most of Hodgdon powders. He said I could use IMR 8208 the same as H4895's 60% rule. Looking at Hodgon's load data for 30-06, 168 gr bullet, the max charge is 48 gr. 60% of that is 28.8 gr. So, I loaded up 5 each 29, 29.5 and 30 gr. Also, 17 gr of Universal Clays. I used CCI 200 primers.

See any faults with my plans? Should I test them at 50 or 100 yds? Scope is a 1.75-6 VX3 with std duplex.

Alan

The first thing that pops out at me is your bullet diameter--.365". Isn't the 9.3 a .366" caliber? Have you slugged your bore to see what the true diameter of the rifle is? I fear that if you are a little undersize, you will see significant leading and poor accuracy.

Beyond that, I think you are golden. As far as testing distances, I would get on paper first...whether that be 25 or 50 yards and then move out to 100yds if you are so inclined.

The size stick out to me under size WILL LEAD. Rule of thumb is .001-.002" over bore size. Clint

Guys,

I know better than to "undersize" a bullet. For the life of me, when Veral and I communicated, I can't figure how it came to .365". The mold he made me is .367". The only thing I can think of is he told me .365" from the measurements he took off the throat slugs i sent him; from his throat slug kit. That's the measurement I told BuffaloArms when I ordered the custom RCBS sizer die. I guess we'll see.

Alan

if they cast at .367, try lubing and loading some of them. May just need to flair the mouth to get them to start nicely.

I'd shoot at 50yds to start.

Thanks Blammer.

Hey, the mold I got makes one bullet flat base and the other for GC but having issues with the GC's. Hope to iron that issue out too; someday. Any problems shooting the .367 GC bullets without the GC as you suggested without sizing them and simply applying some LBT Blue by hand?

Alan

the no GC on a GC boolit is an iffy proposition. Some work, some don't. I'd not start with that until later.

I'm one of those who never got satisfying results with GC-less GC bullets. Many have though, or so I hear.

First results.

60 yd sighter with Universal Clays. Lowest shot is from an oiled bore I forgot to wipe out.

About 1640 fps.



Next 4 groups increased .5 gr each. Last group on lower left was 16 gr running 1800 fps. 15.5 gr seems to be as much as this load can handle before accuracy suddenly went South.



At which point I used patches and Hoppes #9 to get out as much lead as I could. Bunch of flecks on each patch until no more.

Next; IMR 8208 using the 60% reduced load rule for H4895. Only shot 3 groups but to me, pretty impressive for my first ever cast boolits for rifle. 29 gr in the middle was all over the place but then so was the velocity. 29.5 and 30 gr were much better.



This evening I loaded up 30 to 33.5 gr and hope to shoot them tomorrow.

How am I doing?

Alan

I am a relative neophyte when it comes to lead through rifles. However, in shooting various cartridges through the longer bores I have found that IMR 4227 seems like a frequent good shooter and that 1500-1700 fps has some magic for those of us who don't have all the nuances figured out. Blue Dot has been a very friendly (accurate) powder in the 30-30. SR 4759 works well in a variety of cases, it being my favorite with 200-ish cast in the 358 Winchester. But 4227 and 1700 fps are two constants when I think of cast rifle loads.

Testing fell apart this am.

With IMR 8208, heavy leading started around 1400 fps and faster.

With Universal Clays, it seems to be above 1750 fps that the leading starts getting heavy.

I was able to use a double cleaning patch (one slightly smaller than the other) system to get a very tight fit with either Hoppes #9 or Shooter's Choice Lead Out.



Also, noticed a few things about the IMR 8208. Would get hang fires, lower than normal velocities and unburned powder in the barrel unless I tipped the muzzle up just before firing. Basically, it worked better if the powder was back against the primer.

I just have to get the GC issues resolved. Basically, when trying to crimp on .375" GC's, it destroys both the bullet and GC. I'm waiting for a guy in the deep South who is an optometrist, to develop and supply me with true 9.3mm GC's.

I might then by another sizer die in .366" from Buffalo Arms; or .367" if they'll make it for me.

Alan

Dacron filler.....works like a check, prevents leading, eliminates hangfires.

Seating the check:

Adjust your sizing die liftout plug so its at its lowest point; size the bullet nose first, putting the check on last, before it enters the die.
This allows the softer lead to align and the check will seat last, concentric with the rest of the bullet, even when oversize.

DO NOT use an aluminum top punch to do this. Any steel one will work of 30 cal or larger, but the largest that will still fit in the die is best, and will put a concentric size on the check's base.

Try to lube the bullets first; the best will be a .376 die. This will keep bullets from sticking and galling.

44 checks also work well on 41's when done in this manner. Seating the check first will mess up a perfectly good bullet near every time.

Really? prevents leading. I'm all for that. I knew about the Dacron or Kapok filler keeping the powder charge against the primer. I'd be nice if that load would work as I have almost 8 lbs of IMR 8208 and nothing to use it for; except for my AR15 in .223 and 53 gr Sie MK's.

Your explanation on setting my RCBS Lube Sizer to place/crimp the GC confused the heck out of me.

Alan

Sorry for the confusion.

I'll do it in steps:

Basically you do everything the same, your just putting the bullets in nose first and the gas check goes into the die last.

1. Lube the bullet in a slightly oversized die (.375/376 in your case).

2. Change the die out to the size you want the bullet at (366/367).

3. The liftout plug adjustment is at the base of the press. It allows the bullet to go in and pushes the bullet out on the upstroke. Make sure it is backed off so the bullet will go ALL the way into the die on the downstroke (if the check does not get swaged on, its not fully adjusted).

4. Put your lubed bullets in the die nose first. Push the bullet slowly into the die until it stops, allowing it to center in the die, but do not size yet. Now place the check on the base (check shank).

5. Be sure to use a cupped STEEL top punch for at least 308 bullets (or the largest punch that will enter the sizing die) and "size" the bullet on the downstroke slowly, just as if the bullet were base first.

The nose, shank and lastly, the gas check, are sized in that order on the downstroke. As the bullet is sized, it allows the lead to guide the gas check.

As you have noticed, sizing with the gas check first, especially the larger ones in your case, messes up the entire bullet. Even if not visibly apparent, it usually leaves one side of the nose sized more than the other, because the check is harder than lead, it will guide it out of round the bullet will be unbalanced.

Dacron: Use it as a FILL-ER.
Don't use it to "keep the powder close to the primer".

Fill the space. (Don't use it with Universal or shotshell powders; its not needed and pressures with them rise too fast!)

Kapok is flammable.

Reduce your load two grains and use enough Dacron to be slightly compressed as the bullet is seated. Think of it as making a longer bullet. Under pressure it seals off gasses, it keeps top pressure and torque away from the bullet (it protects the base) and it "wipes" the barrel of molten lead like a gas check/lube. It also allows longer, trouble free shot strings.

With the powder and case your using it should be between 2-3 grains. Weigh it. Chronograph the load and work the powder back up until you hit your target speed. Be careful. The Dacron will go out like it went in, but much faster. It can kill a chronograph!

Nice!

I would not have thought about runnin em through nose first!

And Dacron!

Does the Dacron need to be weighed ect. like a powder charge or, can ya just cram some in till ya think ya have enough of it in there to do the job?

Also, where do ya get the Dacron filler?

Thanks for your time and knowledge!

Zeik

Yeah, I like to weigh it, since it is something that is occupying volume.

Again, it should be enough to fill the airspace between RIFLE powder and be slightly compressed by the bullet. Its not needed for pistol and shotgun powders and should not be used for obvious pressure reasons.

Most any powder in the medium rifle burn rate works, like 4198, 3031, 4895, Varget, RE15 and 4064.
H4895 and a sixty percent reduction of Max where it is listed in the Hodgdon manual along with the Dacron filler gets nice tight groups and fast speed, so long as the bore isn't rough.

Cool!

Thank You!

So, where do ya get the Dacron filler?
I can't quite imagine me cutting up my 80ies leisure suit

Thanks for your time and knowledge!

Zeik

If I remember correctly, batting used for blankets and pillows adn such is dacron. Just run down to your local craft / fabric store and pick up an roll of the stuff...should last years.

Great!

Thanks War_Eagle!