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#6837358 - 09/03/12 03:28 PM Hiking revolver
raverym14 Offline
New Member

Registered: 09/03/12
Posts: 2
First time post. I am going hiking on the Appalachian Trail in 2 weeks, and wondering what some thoughts are on loads and guns for carrying along. I have a Smith 21 .44 Spl and a Smith 57 .41 Mag. I also have a Super Redhawk .480, but I am not considering it (too big and heavy). There is a very slim chance of black bear, which are fairly small in the Southern Mountains, and cougar. More worrisome are the two legged rats on the trail. I had a cousin and her boyfriend murdered in their tent on the trail back in the 80's. No rape, no robbery, just shot in their sleep for the @#$$ of it. No gun in the world would have helped them, but I am still taking one. I went back and re-read some old articles by Brian Pearce, and I am looking for opinions on which caliber and whether to go with some of the hot Buffalo Bore hard cast loads or something like the Hornady XTP loads. I also have my eye on one of the Ruger Blackhawks .44 Spl built on the .357 frame. ( I am basically just looking for a reason to buy it, it seems it would be less bulky to carry. Any help is greatly appreciated.

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CI16728
#6837386 - 09/03/12 03:37 PM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: raverym14]
Magnum_Man Offline
Campfire Guide

Registered: 11/11/09
Posts: 2884
8 grs Unique 210 grs SWC for your 41 Mag M57 1100-1200fps depending on barrel length. Good DA load and still plenty a power. Magnum Man

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#6837396 - 09/03/12 03:41 PM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: raverym14]
rem06 Offline
Campfire Regular

Registered: 07/04/11
Posts: 457
Loc: Pa
I dont think you need to worry about mt lion either smile

what you mentioned with any ammo will be fine, although a 22 rimfire wouuld be some entertainment.

the little "judge" is fairly popular or the above with some snake shot may come in handy?
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is that extra 25fps worth detonation?
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#6837429 - 09/03/12 03:48 PM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: rem06]
noKnees Offline
Campfire Guide

Registered: 11/09/05
Posts: 4671
Loc: johnstown, NY/Bloomfield CT
its a little late to suggest buying a new gun.. but this is my answer to your question.



12 oz 357, I carry a full power 158g load in it.
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#6837450 - 09/03/12 03:55 PM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: raverym14]
Jeff_O Offline
Campfire Oracle

Registered: 04/21/07
Posts: 26248
Loc: Wetter'n Oregon
Originally Posted By: raverym14
First time post. I am going hiking on the Appalachian Trail in 2 weeks, and wondering what some thoughts are on loads and guns for carrying along. I have a Smith 21 .44 Spl and a Smith 57 .41 Mag. I also have a Super Redhawk .480, but I am not considering it (too big and heavy). There is a very slim chance of black bear, which are fairly small in the Southern Mountains, and cougar. More worrisome are the two legged rats on the trail. I had a cousin and her boyfriend murdered in their tent on the trail back in the 80's. No rape, no robbery, just shot in their sleep for the @#$$ of it. No gun in the world would have helped them, but I am still taking one. I went back and re-read some old articles by Brian Pearce, and I am looking for opinions on which caliber and whether to go with some of the hot Buffalo Bore hard cast loads or something like the Hornady XTP loads. I also have my eye on one of the Ruger Blackhawks .44 Spl built on the .357 frame. ( I am basically just looking for a reason to buy it, it seems it would be less bulky to carry. Any help is greatly appreciated.


Glock 20 (10mm Auto) or Glock 22 (40 S&W) would my choice of a trail revolver. smile

If you really want to limit how many rounds you've got, get a Kahr P45. Light as a feather, 6+1 of .45 ACP, and a trigger very similar to a DA revolver pull.
_________________________
Aim small, miss small
Think small, miss big

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#6837451 - 09/03/12 03:55 PM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: rem06]
PastorDan Offline
Campfire Regular

Registered: 09/17/10
Posts: 1315
Loc: Cottonwood, AZ
Either of your S&W's would be perfect but for a self-defense gun I would take the .44 Special. Plenty of oomph for small blackies & cougars and the lower recoil makes it more controllable if you need to engage anything with two legs.

I would urge you not carry a SA revolver for self-defense. Learn to use one of your DA revolvers accurately (read that as "practice"). In fact, I would carry the S&W that has the DA pull that feels best to you. You also need to put a good number of rounds thru it in DA firing to make sure the main spring tension hasn't been unduly messed with. I have a S&W .357 that was perfect in SA firing but would misfire about 1in 6 in while shooting DA because of light primer strikes.

You also need to make sure the loads you carry will fall out of the chamber. A defensive situation is no time for sticky extraction...ya, and make sure the cylinder is kept clean as well...for the same reason.

Lastly, spend a LOT of time doing dry fire practice so you have the feel of the DA etched into your brain and trigger finger. Most S&W revolvers have a DA pull that if you practice enough can be shot DA but in a manner that is very much like shooting SA. Find an old timer PD who had to carry an S&W that was department modified to shoot "DA-only" and he can show you. There is a point in the DA stroke that the cylinder has fully rotated and "locked" but the hammer hasn't fallen. When learned, you can pull the trigger DA and hold the hammer for a single action feel release...and brought to bear very quckly. Learn to shoot this way and you won't ever need to shoot SA again...or want to.


Edited by PastorDan (09/03/12 04:06 PM)

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#6837664 - 09/03/12 04:54 PM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: PastorDan]
Ohio7x57 Offline
Campfire Regular

Registered: 11/23/08
Posts: 393
Loc: Ohio
I would take which ever one is lighter. Load the .44 with a 240-250 grain hard cast SWC and the .41 with a 210-220 grain of the same design. Push either bullet to 950-1000 fps and you will be well protected from 2 or 4 legged threats. Never turn your back to anyone you run into in the back country, no matter how friendly they appear. Have fun!

Ron
_________________________
People sleep peaceably in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf.
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#6837687 - 09/03/12 05:02 PM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: Ohio7x57]
Mule Deer Offline
Campfire Oracle

Registered: 07/24/01
Posts: 35416
Loc: Banana Belt, Montana
How many of the people who've responded so far have actually shot a black bear, mountain lion or 2-legged varmint with their choice of "hiking revolver"?

Just curious, partly because of all the threads on the the perfect deer/elk/Cape buffalo/mongoose cartridge or bullet.
_________________________
John

The ultimate concern of a rifle loony is rifle trivia. And why not? What else is as distracting from the really important concerns of everyday life?

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#6837708 - 09/03/12 05:06 PM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: Ohio7x57]
David_Walter Online   content
Campfire 'Bwana

Registered: 09/07/04
Posts: 10157
Loc: TriCities, WA
S&W 642 38 Special with Crimson Trace grips.

Although a Ruger SR22 in 22 LR would have 10 plus an extra mag.

I doubt the bears will be impressed with either, but the bandits will.
_________________________
Of all tyrannies, a tyranny sincerely exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive.... those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end for they do so with the approval of their own conscience.
C. S. Lewis

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#6837802 - 09/03/12 05:29 PM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: David_Walter]
doubletap Offline
Campfire Tracker

Registered: 12/05/07
Posts: 5131
Loc: Atlanta
Even though I've hiked in bear and mountain lion country, the only dangerous animals that I've encountered on the trail were vicious dogs and rattle snakes. It doesn't take that much power to dispatch a dog if you can shoot accurately.
_________________________
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#6837832 - 09/03/12 05:39 PM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: Mule Deer]
David_Walter Online   content
Campfire 'Bwana

Registered: 09/07/04
Posts: 10157
Loc: TriCities, WA
MD,

I've plinked at a few "two legged varmints" but it was not with my hiking revolver, and it wasn't in this country, and it for damn sure wasn't "camping." I carry a Glock 32 in 357 Sig sometimes when hiking, but it's heavy and I don't know if it'd do much on bears or lions if I encounter one.

The AT is a LONG hike and I'm not sure anything other than bear pepper spray is required for any of the circumstances in the OP's original question.

But, he asked about revolvers.


Edited by David_Walter (09/03/12 05:45 PM)
_________________________
Of all tyrannies, a tyranny sincerely exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive.... those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end for they do so with the approval of their own conscience.
C. S. Lewis

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#6837840 - 09/03/12 05:39 PM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: doubletap]
idahoguy101 Offline
Campfire Guide

Registered: 03/28/08
Posts: 2687
Loc: Caldwell, Idaho
What pistol do you own now?

If your not familiar with any sidearm then the simplest to operate is a medium framed revolver loaded with factory .38 Special Jacketed Hollow Point bullets.

If your intent is to buy one I'd suggest you consider a used Ruger SP101 with a three inch barrel chambered for .38 Special or 357 Magnum.

To answer John Barsnes's question. I've never shot a human and hope that I never need to. Nor have I ever pointed a weapon at someone. I consider a concealed weapon an indispensible tool if I ever need one.


Edited by idahoguy101 (09/03/12 05:47 PM)

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#6838117 - 09/03/12 06:54 PM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: idahoguy101]
raverym14 Offline
New Member

Registered: 09/03/12
Posts: 2
I appreciate all the input. I have considered an SP101 for quite some time now, I just never bought one. I have never owned a 357, but I have used a Smith Model 65 extensively years ago and I enjoyed shooting that. I normally carry a 1911 in 45 acp loaded with XTP's. I occasionally have need to carry a Beretta 84 in 380 and a a SIG P238 as backup, both loaded with XTP's. I am fairly proficient with all my guns, semi's and revolvers, or I would not be around go on a hiking trip to celebrate my 10 year anniversary. I HAVE had the misfortune of dispatching two legged rats both with an M14 and a 1911, in several different s#%@hole countries. The .44 Spl and 45 acp are pretty identical power wise in my book with similar loadings, and I know first hand what a 45 will do to a man. I was mainly wondering whether the loads I would use to stop a man (XTP's, Hydra-Shoks, etc) would provide enough penetration on a bear, even if it is relatively small compared to the bears out west, or to go with the hotter hard cast bullets. I am not much of a hunter, but everything I read leads me to believe that pound for pound, some animals can take a lot more than people. Again, thank you all.

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#6838176 - 09/03/12 07:08 PM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: raverym14]
viking Offline
Campfire Ranger

Registered: 04/20/08
Posts: 2331
Loc: Texas
How about that new Ruger SP 100? The five shot, 4 inch "kit gun". Take a few snake shot, a few 38's and a few full power 357's and hit the trail.

If I had to choose from what I have it would be my Taurus 44 mag tracker.
_________________________
Glocks remind me of an old German farm wife, kinda thick but will work night and day.

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#6838213 - 09/03/12 07:17 PM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: raverym14]
johnw Offline
Campfire Outfitter

Registered: 05/25/02
Posts: 8551
Loc: old gap grove
enjoy your trip and leave your heavy metal at home... a portable motion detector available for ~ $20 should let you sleep well...
_________________________
"Chances Will Be Taken"

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#6838224 - 09/03/12 07:20 PM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: David_Walter]
Mule Deer Offline
Campfire Oracle

Registered: 07/24/01
Posts: 35416
Loc: Banana Belt, Montana
David,

I figured you might be one of those who'd shot at one of the varmints mentioned.

My question wasn't directed at those with actual experience. Few of us have had to fend off any of the three large varmints mentioned in the original post. I certainly haven't, but the majority still offered firm opinions. Was just wondering about their experience.
_________________________
John

The ultimate concern of a rifle loony is rifle trivia. And why not? What else is as distracting from the really important concerns of everyday life?

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#6838233 - 09/03/12 07:21 PM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: raverym14]
deflave Offline
Campfire Oracle

Registered: 08/16/07
Posts: 40499
Loc: Havre, Montana
Originally Posted By: raverym14
First time post. I am going hiking on the Appalachian Trail in 2 weeks, and wondering what some thoughts are on loads and guns for carrying along. I have a Smith 21 .44 Spl and a Smith 57 .41 Mag. I also have a Super Redhawk .480, but I am not considering it (too big and heavy). There is a very slim chance of black bear, which are fairly small in the Southern Mountains, and cougar. More worrisome are the two legged rats on the trail. I had a cousin and her boyfriend murdered in their tent on the trail back in the 80's. No rape, no robbery, just shot in their sleep for the @#$$ of it. No gun in the world would have helped them, but I am still taking one. I went back and re-read some old articles by Brian Pearce, and I am looking for opinions on which caliber and whether to go with some of the hot Buffalo Bore hard cast loads or something like the Hornady XTP loads. I also have my eye on one of the Ruger Blackhawks .44 Spl built on the .357 frame. ( I am basically just looking for a reason to buy it, it seems it would be less bulky to carry. Any help is greatly appreciated.


As a guy that backpacks on occasion, I highly recommend you carry whatever weighs the least.



Travis

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#6838286 - 09/03/12 07:33 PM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: johnw]
Siskiyous6 Offline
Campfire Tracker

Registered: 11/20/04
Posts: 6192
Loc: Del Norte County, State of Jef...
I have killed deer, grouse, snakes, and porcupines with 45 ACP, 38 Special, and .22 Rimfire revolvers on the trail during my 35 years of hiking and woods rambling.

I killed a mountain lion with a 300 Weatherby once, and was glad to have such a powerful arm, but I have tried to stalk them since then carrying a 220 Swift, and would do it with a 22 Magnum lever action rifle, but not a 38 Revolver.

My experience has me carrying a light rifle more often these days. T/C Carbines can be built as light as 44 ounces in 35 Remington, a serious cartridge for any of the mentioned purposes.

Most of my hiking is in the Siskiyous Mountains, and the nearby Marbles and Trinitys.

On long hikes I often carry my Taurus Ultra light Model 85 38 Special. The reason is because weight becomes burdensome on long hikes.

For day hikes I like my Model 625 in 460 Rowland, I loaded a pile of Speer shot capsules up with number 12 shot years ago, and one of them travels in the number one position. Number 12 is the bomb on snakes.

I think the next trail gun I buy will be a Kel-Tec PMR-30 in 22 Magnum. Then I wouldn't have to carry any extra ammo.
_________________________
Ignorance is not confined to uneducated people.

RAND PAUL 2016!

WHO IS
JOHN GALT?


LIBERTY!











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#6838287 - 09/03/12 07:34 PM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: deflave]
David_Walter Online   content
Campfire 'Bwana

Registered: 09/07/04
Posts: 10157
Loc: TriCities, WA
What Travis said.

I'm in the mid fifties and everything weighs more after mile ten.

The thing I learned "down range" was that everything is too #%^*in' heavy, even for the young Soldiers and Marines.

Pepper spray works on all concerned and involves less paperwork when effectively employed, I'm told.

I'd hate to have to know how you'd advise the police and what you'd have to do to demonstrate fear of injury.

Also, check the gun laws along the route. Some ain't friendly.


Edited by David_Walter (09/03/12 07:39 PM)

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#6838299 - 09/03/12 07:36 PM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: raverym14]
johnnyappleseed Offline
Campfire Regular

Registered: 07/21/03
Posts: 408
Loc: Cody, Wyoming
i normally carry a 38 special airweight in non grizzly country with a couple of shot cartridges included for rattlesnakes

or if i think i might need better accuracy i go with my walther pp 32 auto. it's a bit heavier

or in grizzly country i don't leave home without my ruger super blackhawk 44 magnum with hardcast 300 grain bullets

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#6838312 - 09/03/12 07:39 PM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: deflave]
Bigbuck215 Offline
Campfire 'Bwana

Registered: 04/26/06
Posts: 13414
Loc: Billings, Mt and proud of it ...
Travis said "As a guy that backpacks on occasion, I highly recommend you carry whatever weighs the least.



Travis
"

And I agree one hundred percent, at least. I'm headed for grizz habitat tomorrow and was going to take my heavy Ruger Bisley in .45 Colt but decided to cut back to the old S&W model 19 in .357 loaded with 180 gr. hardcast and probably wont need that. Hope so, anyhow.

Travis, I'm gonna wander up to the lake where you went either later this week or first of next week. Any advice to pass along? Wishin I had some good lookin' chick to carry my pack but no such luck.
_________________________
The Mayans had it right. If youre going to predict the future, its best to aim far beyond your life expectancy, lest you wind up red-faced in a bunker overstocked with Spam and ammo.



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#6838352 - 09/03/12 07:52 PM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: raverym14]
260Remguy Offline
Campfire Kahuna

Registered: 12/18/02
Posts: 16291
Loc: NE
I have hiked a bit of the AT and lived for many years along its route, in Hanover, NH, but never encountered anybody or anything that bothered me other than dogs, mosquitos, flies (Black/Deer/Horse). When I go off the beaten track, I generally carry a small Rossi 720 with 2 CCI shot cartridges and 3 240 grain SWCs.

Jeff

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#6838362 - 09/03/12 07:55 PM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: Jeff_O]
ExpatFromOK Offline
Campfire Guide

Registered: 09/17/05
Posts: 3549
Loc: Finally back in OK!
Originally Posted By: Jeff_O
Originally Posted By: raverym14
First time post. I am going hiking on the Appalachian Trail in 2 weeks, and wondering what some thoughts are on loads and guns for carrying along. I have a Smith 21 .44 Spl and a Smith 57 .41 Mag. I also have a Super Redhawk .480, but I am not considering it (too big and heavy). There is a very slim chance of black bear, which are fairly small in the Southern Mountains, and cougar. More worrisome are the two legged rats on the trail. I had a cousin and her boyfriend murdered in their tent on the trail back in the 80's. No rape, no robbery, just shot in their sleep for the @#$$ of it. No gun in the world would have helped them, but I am still taking one. I went back and re-read some old articles by Brian Pearce, and I am looking for opinions on which caliber and whether to go with some of the hot Buffalo Bore hard cast loads or something like the Hornady XTP loads. I also have my eye on one of the Ruger Blackhawks .44 Spl built on the .357 frame. ( I am basically just looking for a reason to buy it, it seems it would be less bulky to carry. Any help is greatly appreciated.


Glock 20 (10mm Auto) or Glock 22 (40 S&W) would my choice of a trail revolver. smile

If you really want to limit how many rounds you've got, get a Kahr P45. Light as a feather, 6+1 of .45 ACP, and a trigger very similar to a DA revolver pull.


Or a Glock 23. The Buffalo Bore .40 +P 180 FMJs and JHPs are listed at 1100.

Expat
_________________________
Government is not reason; it is not eloquent - it is force! Like fire, it is a dangerous servant and a fearful master. - George Washington

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#6838460 - 09/03/12 08:37 PM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: doubletap]
seattlesetters Offline
Campfire Ranger

Registered: 05/27/09
Posts: 1539
Loc: Bellevue, Washington
Personally, for the AT I'd not be worried about animals other than the two-legged kind. I'd carry an HK P2000SK in 9mm. Small, fairly light and 10+1 ultra-reliable rounds of Peace of Mind.

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#6838471 - 09/03/12 08:41 PM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: Bigbuck215]
deflave Offline
Campfire Oracle

Registered: 08/16/07
Posts: 40499
Loc: Havre, Montana
Originally Posted By: Bigbuck215
Travis said "As a guy that backpacks on occasion, I highly recommend you carry whatever weighs the least.



Travis
"

And I agree one hundred percent, at least. I'm headed for grizz habitat tomorrow and was going to take my heavy Ruger Bisley in .45 Colt but decided to cut back to the old S&W model 19 in .357 loaded with 180 gr. hardcast and probably wont need that. Hope so, anyhow.

Travis, I'm gonna wander up to the lake where you went either later this week or first of next week. Any advice to pass along? Wishin I had some good lookin' chick to carry my pack but no such luck.


Yeah, the last mile is a beatch. Go slow. Bring beer.


Travis

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#6838481 - 09/03/12 08:45 PM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: David_Walter]
deflave Offline
Campfire Oracle

Registered: 08/16/07
Posts: 40499
Loc: Havre, Montana
Originally Posted By: David_Walter
What Travis said.

I'm in the mid fifties and everything weighs more after mile ten.

The thing I learned "down range" was that everything is too #%^*in' heavy, even for the young Soldiers and Marines.

Pepper spray works on all concerned and involves less paperwork when effectively employed, I'm told.

I'd hate to have to know how you'd advise the police and what you'd have to do to demonstrate fear of injury.

Also, check the gun laws along the route. Some ain't friendly.


Great point and I always carry spray if I remember to bring it.

But here are a "thousand words" on why guns are more better.



Travis

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#6838487 - 09/03/12 08:48 PM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: doubletap]
smithrjd Offline
Campfire Ranger

Registered: 10/03/07
Posts: 2135
My answer after having a few is a 357PD 4" in 41 Magnum. Tried the 629 4" really got heavy on the hip. Had a 586 357 Magnum in 6" try sitting down with that on the hip. Given that you have a model 57 then I would pick it. The 357PD is perfect for me, light weight, not brutal to shoot and power enough for anything that should be shot with a revolver.

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#6838538 - 09/03/12 09:08 PM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: ExpatFromOK]
bowmanh Offline
Member

Registered: 09/25/09
Posts: 203
Loc: NW Oregon
I agree with those who advocate the lightest gun with adequate power. I just finished backpacking across the Wallowa Mountains in NE Oregon. I carried a Glock 36 .45 ACP. It weighs only 20 oz. (27 oz. w/ a full mag) and has a 3.8 inch barrel with a 6+1 capacity.

Thankfully I have never needed to use a firearm to defend against either an animal or a person but it seems to me that in the case of a problem black bear something that penetrates well would be what you want. Phil Shoemaker has written about handguns for brown bear defense and he advocated loads that penetrate well. Though a black bear is generally smaller I would think the same principles apply. Any load that might work on a bear should be plenty for cougars, wolves, humans etc.

I carried one mag of +P 230 grain truncated cone FMJ (from Buffalo Bore) and another mag of 230 grain Federal HST. Buffalo Bore says this FMJ load was designed with black bears in mind. There are many possibilities but my Glock 36 is light, compact and reliable. I shoot Glocks a lot so this was a natural choice for me.

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#6838560 - 09/03/12 09:15 PM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: bowmanh]
David_Walter Online   content
Campfire 'Bwana

Registered: 09/07/04
Posts: 10157
Loc: TriCities, WA
Phil also advocates for a 357 mag with 180 hardcast, and I believe him. I think his daughter (Tia?) carries a smith in 357 as her backup while guiding.

A heavy bullet with sharp edges punches holes in stuff.

'course, a 357 Sig with the 124 grain, and 14 of them with 13 in the mag and 1 in the pipe ala Glock 32, isn't anything to laugh at, either.

The problem with guns on camping trips where there are a lot of other people is most folks aren't used to knowing where it is, exactly where it is, 24/7. If you misplace the pepper spray, no biggy...the revolver may require a trip back, routing around, calling the PD, etc., etc.

_________________________
Of all tyrannies, a tyranny sincerely exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive.... those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end for they do so with the approval of their own conscience.
C. S. Lewis

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#6838578 - 09/03/12 09:29 PM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: Mule Deer]
shrapnel Offline
Campfire 'Bwana

Registered: 06/04/07
Posts: 12001
Loc: Bozeman, MT
Originally Posted By: Mule Deer
How many of the people who've responded so far have actually shot a black bear, mountain lion or 2-legged varmint with their choice of "hiking revolver"?

Just curious, partly because of all the threads on the the perfect deer/elk/Cape buffalo/mongoose cartridge or bullet.


I have spent most of my life in bear country and have killed 2 grizzlies, 3 black bears, one mountain lion, with everything from a 25-35 to a 30-378.

I just bought a 4 inch Python for hunting in bear country, because of the size, manageability and power factor of a fully loaded 158 grain Jacketed bullet. I have a Smith and Wesson model 57, but it is a long barrel at 8 3/8 inches, so I wanted a smaller framed gun, smooth and pointable when firing double action.

I had a Taurus Titanium 41 magnum, but once you fired it, you would rather be mauled by a bear. I sold it and decided to use the Python. I haven't had to, but we did run into a grizzly last fall and the fellow that hunted with us, just bought a 4 inch model 57 in 41 mag just in case. He did mess his pants and you won't find him sleeping in a tent this fall...
_________________________
Originally Posted By: deflave
If you want to fit in with a new crowd, ask them if they know shrapnel. There is no friggin' way they won't know who that man is. He is the Chuck Norris of Montana and you will have a nice icebreaker to discuss.
Travis



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#6838607 - 09/03/12 09:43 PM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: shrapnel]
David_Walter Online   content
Campfire 'Bwana

Registered: 09/07/04
Posts: 10157
Loc: TriCities, WA
Originally Posted By: shrapnel
He did mess his pants and you won't find him sleeping in a tent this fall...



When I was a young man, I jumped out of an airplane and landed in strong crosswinds. I panicked and instead of just pulling one of the lines to collapse the chute, allowed myself to be dragged across a road with heavy traffic. The view from ground level of people trying not to run over you is interesting, at least.

When I finally took control of the situation and the chute, a truck with my friends pulled up and I had a wet spot on the front of my jeans.

"Drug you through a puddle?"

"%$^* no," I replied, "I pissed my pants!"

In retrospect, that story is funny. I guess they all are when you're alive to tell them.
_________________________
Of all tyrannies, a tyranny sincerely exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive.... those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end for they do so with the approval of their own conscience.
C. S. Lewis

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#6838636 - 09/03/12 10:09 PM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: David_Walter]
NJelksmacker Offline
Campfire Regular

Registered: 03/23/11
Posts: 1144
Loc: New Jersey
The AT goes through New Jersey and you ain't allowed to carry in the Communist State of New Jersey and if your a non resident the cops treat you worse.

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#6838729 - 09/04/12 12:30 AM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: NJelksmacker]
idahoguy101 Offline
Campfire Guide

Registered: 03/28/08
Posts: 2687
Loc: Caldwell, Idaho
Originally Posted By: NJelksmacker
The AT goes through New Jersey and you ain't allowed to carry in the Communist State of New Jersey and if your a non resident the cops treat you worse.


Unless New Jersey has changed it's laws. Hollow Point ammo is illegal for civilians.

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#6838930 - 09/04/12 05:02 AM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: idahoguy101]
Savuti Offline
Campfire Ranger

Registered: 01/31/07
Posts: 1519
Loc: Collier Co. Florida
HPs are legal to possess, just don't use 'em or you'll be in the brown sauce.
_________________________
There is nothing made by man,
which cannot be broken by woman.

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#6838971 - 09/04/12 05:20 AM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: doubletap]
djs Offline
Campfire Kahuna

Registered: 01/18/06
Posts: 17813
Loc: Virginia
I faced the same issue when I hiked the Appalachian and other Trails. I have several S&W "N" frames (44 Mag), too heavy when packing a heavy pack. I found a used S&W Model 64 ("K" frame, 38 Special, +P rated) with a 4" barrel. I carry it in a large fanny pack and load it with Buffalo Bore 38 Special 158 gr. "Ourdoorsman" loads.

With about 475 ft. pounds of muzzle energy, it works well for eastern hiking and kayaking. It is enough for black bear and two legged varmints and, the Model 64 is light and easily to carry.

Buffalo Bore website: https://www.buffalobore.com/index.php?l=product_detail&p=291

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#6838983 - 09/04/12 05:28 AM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: Mule Deer]
djs Offline
Campfire Kahuna

Registered: 01/18/06
Posts: 17813
Loc: Virginia
Originally Posted By: Mule Deer
How many of the people who've responded so far have actually shot a black bear, mountain lion or 2-legged varmint with their choice of "hiking revolver"?

Just curious, partly because of all the threads on the the perfect deer/elk/Cape buffalo/mongoose cartridge or bullet.


As I've mentioned before, I shot a Grizzly in Montana wilderness 52 years ago with a Ruger Blackhawk 44 Magnum. Following a bad bear attack, I bought the pistol for working in the back country. It was light and easy to carry, but the hammer would bloody my hand after a few shots - it was just too light for shooting with heavy loads.

For griz country hunting, I'd consider the 44 Mag as a minimum; but in the East, a 357 Mag or (Buffalo Bore) 38 Special +P load would be enough for black bear.

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#6839208 - 09/04/12 06:50 AM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: djs]
kenster99 Offline
Campfire Guide

Registered: 01/09/05
Posts: 2646
Loc: Hangtown Ca

I am liking my 329pd for hiking.Plenty of power and light weight too!

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#6839217 - 09/04/12 06:54 AM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: kenster99]
ShortMagFan Offline
Campfire Ranger

Registered: 07/22/09
Posts: 2491
Loc: NC - work / SC - play
3" SP101 loaded with the SD load of your choice. The 2-legged threat is far greater than being attacked by a black bear or cougar.

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#6839273 - 09/04/12 07:20 AM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: ShortMagFan]
old70 Offline
Campfire Regular

Registered: 03/13/04
Posts: 1310
Loc: Michigan
I have to qualify this by stating that I've never shot a bear, cougar, or human, but I have had close encounters with two of the three in which having a gun made me more comfortable, and confident in my actions. For trail use I have a Smith model 60 with 3" barrel that I carry with the FBI load, since it is a bit rambunctious with full house .357 loads in DA. I also carried speedloaders, one with more FBI load, and one with wadcutters for small game use. I have used the gun for rampaging squirrel and rabbits, and it works well. I have every confidence that it would work for larger critters, too. It carries well in a good holster, and is light enough for protracted carry.

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#6839373 - 09/04/12 07:44 AM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: ShortMagFan]
jt402 Offline
Campfire Ranger

Registered: 07/25/10
Posts: 1786
W/O buying a new gun, the 21 is going to be lighter than the .41 or the .480. Slimmer contour barrel, bigger holes in the steel. I have (and love) a stainless Ruger 4 5/8" .44 special, but I doubt it saves any weight over the 21.

I suppose you could get it somewhere here, but bears are scarce in my normal haunts, so bear spray is not on the shelves. I can tell you that wasp and hornet spray works on other than flying insects-and works well.

While vacationing in Colorado this summer, my wife spotted a bear across the small lake in front of the house. She called me and we watched as it worked its way around the shore line, across a gravel road, and on up the mountain. There were hikers on a trail who never saw the bear. When Mr. Bear saw the hikers, he changed directions to avoid them. The hikers never knew he was there. Now he did come back one night to try the trash (no luck) and he did get into our Mule. I guess he couldn't get it started. Tracks and a few scratches in the paint were evidence.

Best wishes for a fun trip. jack
_________________________
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#6839455 - 09/04/12 08:07 AM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: Mule Deer]
PastorDan Offline
Campfire Regular

Registered: 09/17/10
Posts: 1315
Loc: Cottonwood, AZ
Originally Posted By: Mule Deer
How many of the people who've responded so far have actually shot a black bear, mountain lion or 2-legged varmint with their choice of "hiking revolver"?

Just curious, partly because of all the threads on the the perfect deer/elk/Cape buffalo/mongoose cartridge or bullet.


Good point...but then again I haven't shot a human either. My response was based on the personal recommendations of a guy who runs dogs after bears/lions here in Idaho who has treed and been involved in the killing of probably several hundred of them in the past 25 years...and police officers who have shot two-legged vermin in the line of duty.


Edited by PastorDan (09/04/12 08:08 AM)

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#6839478 - 09/04/12 08:13 AM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: smithrjd]
PastorDan Offline
Campfire Regular

Registered: 09/17/10
Posts: 1315
Loc: Cottonwood, AZ
Originally Posted By: smithrjd
Tried the 629 4" really got heavy on the hip.


When I backpack (usually 35-45 pound pack) a chest rig is what I use to carry my 3" 629. This summer I used a very cheap and simple Blackhawk IWB nylon holster clipped to the inside of my packs sternum strap. Worked great.

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#6839818 - 09/04/12 10:24 AM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: PastorDan]
nifty-two-fifty Offline
Campfire Regular

Registered: 11/22/05
Posts: 1319
Loc: Far Northstate Calif
My favorite hiking revolvers are my S&W AirLites, a M-360 3" .357, or my M-329 4" .44 Mag.

Very pleasant to carry, yet lots of power available should it be needed. Pleasant to shoot with light loads for practice or vermin. Rust is less of a concern than with blue guns.
_________________________
Nifty-250

"If you don't know where you're going, you may wind up somewhere else".
Yogi Berra

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#6839834 - 09/04/12 10:32 AM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: PastorDan]
JCMCUBIC Offline
Campfire Tracker

Registered: 04/25/05
Posts: 5567
No experience shooting bares, katz, or peoples but the SP101 in .357 has been mentioned a couple of times. Since the OP didn't list one....and if he's going to buy one....get the new model with the 4.2 inch barrel. I've been carrying one since early this spring while working on the farm, mainly for gophers and snakes. Great little revolver. Not to heavy to carry in a good holster, heavy enough to shoot mag loads, slim design, great sights, long enough barrel to use the mag loads, sweat resistant finish....

I doubt you have any need for it, but it's a first round pick in the Ultimate Hiking Revolver draft.

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#6840197 - 09/04/12 12:46 PM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: JCMCUBIC]
PastorDan Offline
Campfire Regular

Registered: 09/17/10
Posts: 1315
Loc: Cottonwood, AZ
Since the greatest threat will be of the two-legged variety the following link should prove interesting to those who carry a gun for defense.

The person writing the article is works for County Medical Examiner in a morgue in Atlanta. He has first-hand experience examining in detail the affects of bullets on flesh and bone.

http://smith-wessonforum.com/concealed-c...erspective.html

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#6840484 - 09/04/12 02:33 PM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: PastorDan]
Jim in Idaho Offline
Campfire Kahuna

Registered: 01/29/01
Posts: 16365
Loc: Idaho, USA
Is the Appalachian Trail that dangerous these days? Last time I hiked it was in summer camp with a bunch of other 11 and 12 year old boys. We went about 50 miles through North Carolina and northern Georgia. The most dangerous weapons we carried were cans of Vienna sausage.

I think we were more terrified of the 16 to 18 year old counselors running us ragged and forcing us to do all of their chores than any wild animals. But then, they were definitely a sadistic and malicious bunch of SOBs.
_________________________
Gunnery, gunnery, gunnery.
Hit the target, all else is twaddle!

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#6840504 - 09/04/12 02:41 PM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: Jim in Idaho]
logcutter Offline
Campfire Tracker

Registered: 02/06/04
Posts: 5759
Loc: Central Idaho
We don't have any Mongooses here or Cape Buff but the handgun I carry while hiking without a rifle,will penetrate a Cape Buffalo's shoulders(both) exit and kill the one standing next to it...

Not sure about Mongooses though!

Jayco laugh

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#6840517 - 09/04/12 02:49 PM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: logcutter]
logcutter Offline
Campfire Tracker

Registered: 02/06/04
Posts: 5759
Loc: Central Idaho
Before anyone calls BS and things go South..Here is part of it from Rifle Magazine....

Quote:
Right off, I would imagine this debate is somewhat inspired by the story Brian Pearce did about the .45-70 in Africa, where he used a Cor-Bon 400-grain solid to shoot a Cape buffalo, whereupon the bullet exited the bull and killed a cow buffalo that had gone unnoticed on the other side of the bull. The bull took off, and Brian shot it in the south end where the solid penetrated to the heart, ending the affair in fairly short fashion.


Jayco

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#6840526 - 09/04/12 02:53 PM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: Jim in Idaho]
mudhen Offline
Campfire Outfitter

Registered: 05/30/05
Posts: 9437
Loc: Boot Heel of New Mexico
I have used a Browning Hi-Power in .40 S&W to dispatch wounded deer, pronghorns and hogs. It worked as good as anything else I have tried and made a compact carry package. A Glock .40 would be comparable. My favorite hiking pistol is an S&W Model 66 with 125-grain CorBons. I have used that pistol and load to take several lions over dogs and to finish off wounded animals.

Of the two that you have, I would choose the .44 Special and load it with Hornady 180-grain XTP factory ammo. These rounds shoot very well in my 4-inch S&W. I would not hesitate to use it on lions, bears or for self-defense.
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#6840559 - 09/04/12 03:03 PM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: raverym14]
prairie_goat Offline
Campfire Tracker

Registered: 01/25/09
Posts: 6736
Loc: Montana
I would pack a 22 or 22 Mag if hiking the AP. Would work perfect for small game, maybe bring some "snake shot" rounds as well.
_________________________
"There is no honor in being simply being a shooter and every honor in stalking close to the animal."

Steve Timm


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#6840567 - 09/04/12 03:07 PM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: doubletap]
arffdog875 Offline
Campfire Regular

Registered: 08/19/09
Posts: 521
Loc: Grand Junction, CO
I have carried a Ruger Redhawk 5.5 44 mag while hiking and it did fine, but alittle heavy, lately I have been carrying my Glock 21 SF due to the fact I have had to deal with more of the 2 legged problems than the 4 legged ones! Good luck!

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#6840592 - 09/04/12 03:17 PM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: Siskiyous6]
chlinstructor Offline
Campfire Outfitter

Registered: 04/09/11
Posts: 8735
Loc: TX
Originally Posted By: siskiyous6

I think the next trail gun I buy will be a Kel-Tec PMR-30 in 22 Magnum. Then I wouldn't have to carry any extra ammo.


Love my new KelTec PMR-30 in .22 mag! I've been carrying it quite a bit for hiking around the ranch while checking fences & hunting arrowheads. it's super light & very accurate. With 2 30 round mags, I feel pretty well armed here in Texas, on private property.

That being said, if I'm bow huntnting in CO or NM, where I might encounter black bears or mountain lions, I like my Glock 20- 10mm w/ 15 rounds of Hornady 200gr XTP's.

In any area where my main concerns are two- legged varmints, I usually have my Glock 32- 357sig. It holds 13+ rounds of Speer Gold Dot 125 gr HP's. I have killed several feral hogs here in TX with it, & it puts them down on the spot!
Texas State Troopers here have used that same ammo for years to put down numerous bad guys. Even while shooting through car doors!

My last choice is my little S&W .38 BodyGaurd Revolver with Factory Lazer.
I mostly carry it around the house or while working out in my garage late at night. It doesn't pull down my jogging shorts, and it's loaded with Speer Gold Dot 125gr +P 38sp ammo.
I always carry a extra speed loader when jogging around our neighborhood at night.
_________________________
"Allways speak the truth and you will never have to remember what you said before..." unknown
Texans, "We say Grace, We Say Mam, If You Don't Like it, We Don't Give a Damn!"

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#6840598 - 09/04/12 03:20 PM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: arffdog875]
GF1 Offline
Campfire Guide

Registered: 11/22/08
Posts: 2668
A good part of comfort is more than sheer weight of the gun. I really like this holster:

http://www.montanaholster.com/

It's not fancy, but sturdy and carries beautifully. I find that I don't even use the belt snap, just let it hang, so to speak. Also, the shoulder rig is usable with other belt-style holsters (I use mine mostly with an old Bianchi flap holster holding a Model 57 S&W). Much more comfortable than either a belt or a typical shoulder holster. I can carry an N frame Smith and Wesson all day with no fatigue (at least from the gun and holster!).

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#6840616 - 09/04/12 03:26 PM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: prairie_goat]
Mathsr Offline
Campfire Ranger

Registered: 11/17/04
Posts: 2056
Loc: Georgia
I'll be hiking a piece of the Virginia AT in October. I don't plan on carrying a firearm even though I usually have one handy. Virginia and Georgia don't have a reciprocal carry agreement. For some unknown reason the Constitution only applies in your home state or those that decide that your home state has done enough checking on you to allow you to protect yourself. Evidently Georgia and Virginia don't see eye to eye when it comes to carry permits.
_________________________


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#6840661 - 09/04/12 03:39 PM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: Mathsr]
GF1 Offline
Campfire Guide

Registered: 11/22/08
Posts: 2668
Originally Posted By: Mathsr
I'll be hiking a piece of the Virginia AT in October. I don't plan on carrying a firearm even though I usually have one handy. Virginia and Georgia don't have a reciprocal carry agreement. For some unknown reason the Constitution only applies in your home state or those that decide that your home state has done enough checking on you to allow you to protect yourself. Evidently Georgia and Virginia don't see eye to eye when it comes to carry permits.



You will find that you can carry your handgun openly in Virginia, no permit of any kind.

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#6840703 - 09/04/12 03:48 PM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: GF1]
Mathsr Offline
Campfire Ranger

Registered: 11/17/04
Posts: 2056
Loc: Georgia
That was a question that just occurred to me. Thanks for answering it before I had the chance to ask! So as I understand it even though I am from out of state, it is legal to open carry in Virginia. I guess in areas where I would not want to open carry I would need to have the firearm inaccessible and unloaded so that it would not be considered a concealed weapon. I have never worried much about four legged critters or two legged critters either for that matter, but me having a firearm would offer some comfort to others that will be with me. (They know that I can out run them and there wouldn't be as much need to do so if I was armed.) Thanks again for the information.
_________________________


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#6840720 - 09/04/12 03:51 PM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: Mule Deer]
sbrmike Offline
Campfire Regular

Registered: 08/13/10
Posts: 303
Loc: Potter County, PA
I have not made my recommendation yet, but would recommend a lighterweight double action 357 Mag from Colt, Ruger, or S&W with 2 to 4 inch barrel.

I have killed a 250 pound black bear with a 4 inch S&W model 66 with 158 gn SJHP factory loaded Magtech ammo.

In the summer I load "Shot" Ball "Shot" Ball Ball Ball in the cylinder and have them loaded to fire in that order. I figure that a snake up close would need shot quick; a toothy critter should yield enough warning to cycle past the first "Shot" capsule or if that close the shot to it's face should help deter long enough to get a ball in it as a stopper. In fall/winter, I load straight ball ammo, i.e. 158 gn SJHP.



Originally Posted By: Mule Deer
How many of the people who've responded so far have actually shot a black bear, mountain lion or 2-legged varmint with their choice of "hiking revolver"?

Just curious, partly because of all the threads on the the perfect deer/elk/Cape buffalo/mongoose cartridge or bullet.
_________________________
PA Bear Hunter, NRA Benefactor Member

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#6840847 - 09/04/12 04:30 PM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: raverym14]
mnimrod45 Offline
Member

Registered: 01/24/10
Posts: 97
Loc: Eastern WA State
I can give you my opinions, which is based on some experience and actual observations for those who are wondering if I have any. Admittedly I have no experience on bear and cougar with a revolver. I would say just carry whichever is lightest and that you shoot well. If you want to buy another gun, so be it, it's a good excuse. As far as loads go, you will be much much more likely to need the gun on a human so I would go with an expanding type bullet like an XTP that can work on other critters as well if needed. Yes I have seen many people shot with expanding bullets, FMJ bullets and lead bullets from handguns, rifles and shotguns so I do have some experience. The expanding bullets have almost always done a better job of stopping a person because of more trauma, humans need comparatively little in the way of penetration like big game will.

I have seen many people who have been shot with many weapons, usually handguns, and have been in the middle of and actually witnessed a handful of shootings. Luckily I was armed with 00 buck for the most intense, very close range one. If I would have had just a handgun, I would have probably ended up very hurt or killed, even though he would have still likely been killed had I shot him many times with a handgun, he would not have been stopped by any handgun like the shotgun stopped him, which saved my butt.

Handguns are not death rays like on television and in fact in actual shootings, a human shot one time in the torso with a handgun has I believe (I am going from memory from a gunshot wound class from 3 years ago) a 97 percent chance of living. Additional rounds on target increase the chance of killing the subject exponentially. Remember, stopping power and killing power are two different things. Yes big bore revolvers with heavy cast bullets are very good killers even for very large animals, they however lack the high velocity that causes massive trauma that is usually what stops. This does not inclued a proper central nervous system shot, which will almost always stop even with a handgun, almost.

You have to take into account the motivation and state of the animal you are up against. Lucky for us, the vast majority of people who are shot will fall to the ground screaming with even a minor injury to an extremity, because humans are soft. This is where the high percentage of one shot stops comes from associated with the rating of handgun loads in actual shootings. Many of these people were still not killed, just stopped. If you take a motivated, demented, high, mental or deranged subject or just one who is dedicated to the cause, we have a different subject all together. In this case anything short of a central nervous system shot will do nothing until they bleed out or are broken down by hitting pelvis, major bones or other parts of their frame, which will drop them but still not always stop them as they will crawl or fight from the ground if they are dedicated enough.

All this said, I am definately not saying I'm an expert, just my experiences. Carry what you are most comfortable with and if in the unfortunate and unlikely chance that you have to shoot, shoot until your gun is empty or until someone is on the ground and no longer a threat.

We all have our opinions, some are based on experience, too many are based on internet forums. There are many answers on here for you to choose from. The most important thing is to have fun on your hike.

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#6840886 - 09/04/12 04:42 PM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: mnimrod45]
deflave Offline
Campfire Oracle

Registered: 08/16/07
Posts: 40499
Loc: Havre, Montana
Best hiking gun IN THE WORLD! (LCR 22LR)



Second best hiking gun IN THE WORLD! (S&W 396, note the holster)



Travis

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#6841258 - 09/04/12 06:14 PM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: raverym14]
bhemry Offline
Campfire Regular

Registered: 06/11/04
Posts: 1096
Loc: Medina county OH
As a person who grew up hunting and exploring in the foothills of Appalachia, and packed different handguns over the years, were I to choose a revolver as the OP stated, the 3" version of the S&W 360 would be my ideal choice. (Another poster posted a picture of one earlier in this thread.)

Full disclosure, I haven't had to actually use one on black bear, cougars, or the two-legged varmits, but I'm pretty sure a lightweight 3" .357 would work just fine. wink

I have no idea what all states the Trail goes through, and someone mentioned NJ, which reminds me of this Ayoob story: http://www.backwoodshome.com/articles2/ayoob105.html
about a lady carrying hollowpoints in NJ who nearly went to prison over the concealed weapon which was legal for her in CT, but not NJ. However, she got off lightly and was "only" fined $1000 per cartridge for carrying HP's.

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#6842112 - 09/04/12 10:26 PM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: bhemry]
idahoguy101 Offline
Campfire Guide

Registered: 03/28/08
Posts: 2687
Loc: Caldwell, Idaho
Goes to a Cabelas and get a large spray can of Bear Spray. I'd still bring a handgun but scumbags hate high concentration pepper spray. I've seen it used multiple times in prison riots. And being a "less lethal" weapon it'll show a jury that you were not inclined to shoot someone. This could save you a trip to prison for manslaughter if you'd ever need to use force.

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#6842120 - 09/04/12 10:33 PM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: deflave]
luv2safari Offline
Campfire 'Bwana

Registered: 12/31/06
Posts: 14322
Loc: NW NV & Far NW MT
S&W Mdl 43... wink
_________________________
Hunt with Class and Classics

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#6843318 - 09/05/12 10:37 AM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: raverym14]
Eremicus Offline
Campfire Kahuna

Registered: 03/01/01
Posts: 18881
Loc: Placerville,CA,USA
I've never killed a black bear or a lion, but I've had a few close encounters with both. I've had lots of "encounters" with two legged varmits and used a handgun in two such cases.
If you are more worried about two legged varmits, I wouldn't pack a revolver if I had a choice. I'd pack either a 1911 style semi auto or a SIG 220. That's because when you drop them on a hard surface, they work when you pick them up. 50% of the revolvers I've seen so dropped or used as a club in one case, would no longer fire.....
Do make sure you understand and obey the laws in the areas where you'll be. However, frankly, I can explain anything but my own death.
Will a .45 ACP or a 10mm work on a black bear or a Mtn Lion with common expanding ammo ? I understand they will. But, if you insist ona guy who has seen lots of them shot with such guns, ask JJHack. E

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#6843988 - 09/05/12 01:53 PM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: Eremicus]
nifty-two-fifty Offline
Campfire Regular

Registered: 11/22/05
Posts: 1319
Loc: Far Northstate Calif
Raver,

If you go with your .44 Special I recommend that you consider the Buffalo Bore 255 gr cast SWC load at 1,000 fps.

https://www.buffalobore.com/index.php?l=product_detail&p=88,

Penetration should be excellent. This is the load I carry in my M-329 on the Pacific Crest Trail. Good luck.
_________________________
Nifty-250

"If you don't know where you're going, you may wind up somewhere else".
Yogi Berra

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#6844999 - 09/05/12 06:47 PM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: nifty-two-fifty]
EdM Offline
Campfire Outfitter

Registered: 11/27/02
Posts: 7699
Loc: Counting the days...
When I bum around the place in north Idaho I carry an old Ruger Flattop 44 Mag cut to 4 5/8" loaded with 280 gr WFN's at 1050 fps in a pancake holster. Light enough in weight and easy enough to shoot well with right sized bullets from MBW.
_________________________
Conduct is the best proof of character.

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#6845244 - 09/05/12 07:51 PM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: noKnees]
Take_a_knee Offline
Campfire 'Bwana

Registered: 09/10/09
Posts: 13798
Originally Posted By: noKnees
its a little late to suggest buying a new gun.. but this is my answer to your question.



12 oz 357, I carry a full power 158g load in it.


Unfortunately no longer produced...but I got mine.

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#6848686 - 09/06/12 08:36 PM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: Take_a_knee]
meddybemps Offline
Campfire Regular

Registered: 01/31/08
Posts: 514
Loc: Mass and Maine
There is a reason Smith and Wesson made the Kit Gun.

Ok, so let's get real, cougars and bears on the AT? Only a problem in your most fevered fantasies. Two legged varmints will be more than impressed with anything pointed in their direction and even that is a stretch. . Keep it light because you will come to resent every extra ounce in your pack. The most likely use of your handgun will be in taking small game and trout.?????....trout? (The Statute of Limitatation has run out so I am safe in telling you to get close and aim low....trust me.) Take it from one who has been there.
_________________________
Downeast Maine by birth and choice, Massachusetts out of necessity

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#6849071 - 09/07/12 03:52 AM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: meddybemps]
jimmyp Offline
Campfire 'Bwana

Registered: 11/28/03
Posts: 11621
Loc: Georgia
Somehow I feel you would be better off with a LW 22 and a box of hollow points than your 3 pound bazooka's. No I have not killed anything or anybody so my comment is pure Internet malarky.
_________________________

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#6849545 - 09/07/12 07:19 AM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: Mule Deer]
noKnees Offline
Campfire Guide

Registered: 11/09/05
Posts: 4671
Loc: johnstown, NY/Bloomfield CT
Originally Posted By: Mule Deer
How many of the people who've responded so far have actually shot a black bear, mountain lion or 2-legged varmint with their choice of "hiking revolver"?

Just curious, partly because of all the threads on the the perfect deer/elk/Cape buffalo/mongoose cartridge or bullet.



Not me..I have now shot three eastern black bears, but all those bears where shot when unaware with rifles. I somehow expect that shooting an unaware blackie with a rifle is a bit different from shooting at an unhappy bear 15 feet away with a handgun.

My choice of gun in this thread, a 357 with 158's I have no doubts would be fine shooting the unaware bear from a tree stand, but would no doubt feel small and unimpressive standing 15 feet in front of a pissed off sow. Of course there is something to be said for 12oz handguns when walking for miles and miles. To be frank I am more concerned with threats like people, or unleashed aggressive dogs than with black bears. It wouldn't be my choice if I was in grizzly county, but I spend hundreds of hours in black bear country a year and if I am lucky a week or so in Griz country every year or three.
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The collection of taxes which are not absolutely required, which do not beyond reasonable doubt contribute to public welfare, is only a species of legalized larceny. Under this Republic the rewards of industry belong to those who earn them. Coolidge

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#6849750 - 09/07/12 08:10 AM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: noKnees]
Huntz Offline
Campfire Tracker

Registered: 10/28/07
Posts: 5672
Loc: N.E.Wisconsin
Carry what you feel comfortable with and can shoot good.Chances of being attacked by a bear are slim to none.I have shot quite a few bears with a revolver,but none were attacking me.
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The older I get,the better I wuz!!!!

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#6849766 - 09/07/12 08:14 AM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: Mathsr]
djs Offline
Campfire Kahuna

Registered: 01/18/06
Posts: 17813
Loc: Virginia
Originally Posted By: Mathsr
I'll be hiking a piece of the Virginia AT in October. I don't plan on carrying a firearm even though I usually have one handy. Virginia and Georgia don't have a reciprocal carry agreement. For some unknown reason the Constitution only applies in your home state or those that decide that your home state has done enough checking on you to allow you to protect yourself. Evidently Georgia and Virginia don't see eye to eye when it comes to carry permits.



It is a shame that there is not a National CCW permitting process that would allow national carry.

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#6849900 - 09/07/12 08:54 AM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: djs]
Mathsr Offline
Campfire Ranger

Registered: 11/17/04
Posts: 2056
Loc: Georgia
The Second Amendment would serve if we could elect some people that had read it and believed what it said.
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#6852591 - 09/08/12 08:23 AM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: Mathsr]
Huntz Offline
Campfire Tracker

Registered: 10/28/07
Posts: 5672
Loc: N.E.Wisconsin
Watch out you don`t stumble on a grow site.Things could get sticky and i would want to carry a man stopper.
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The older I get,the better I wuz!!!!

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#6859366 - 09/10/12 03:59 PM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: Huntz]
reflex264 Offline
Campfire Regular

Registered: 02/06/04
Posts: 946
How about a Charter Arms target bulldog? 23oz. I had to stop this critter with mine while hog hunting a couple of years ago. It wasn't my primery hunting gun. I carried it to have something to carry first day out while my son hunted. Using a 240-250grain cast bullet at anything around 800fps will deal with most problems in that neck of the woods and it is so light you won't even know you are packing. reflex264

_________________________


.264 barrel current number of shots:2122

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#6860136 - 09/10/12 07:39 PM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: shrapnel]
gaperry59 Offline
Campfire Regular

Registered: 10/18/10
Posts: 254
Loc: central Ohio
I've never shot a bear, but I did poleaxe a 1200 lb cow with a warmly loaded .45 Colt. My neighbor asked me to put down one of his cows that had a distended bowel, as all he had was a .22 rifle and he didn't want it to suffer. I just happened to be wearing a S&W 25-5 at the time, loaded with home-cast 270 gr RCBS SWC's over a fairly stout charge of Unique. Old Elmer was right, a .45 will go through the frontal plate on a cow, traverse the skull and go on back into the neck. In his autobiography he tells of having to rescue the East Helena butcher who had been treed by a bull. Elmer rode up on his horse and shot the bull in the forehead with his Colt SAA .45 as it charged him, dropping the bull right on his nose. In my case I felt bad for the cow, but at least she never knew what hit her.

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#6866411 - 09/12/12 06:07 PM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: raverym14]
Brad Offline
Campfire Kahuna

Registered: 10/31/00
Posts: 22518
Originally Posted By: raverym14
First time post. I am going hiking on the Appalachian Trail in 2 weeks, and wondering what some thoughts are on loads and guns for carrying along. I have a Smith 21 .44 Spl and a Smith 57 .41 Mag. I also have a Super Redhawk .480, but I am not considering it (too big and heavy). There is a very slim chance of black bear, which are fairly small in the Southern Mountains, and cougar. More worrisome are the two legged rats on the trail. I had a cousin and her boyfriend murdered in their tent on the trail back in the 80's. No rape, no robbery, just shot in their sleep for the @#$$ of it. No gun in the world would have helped them, but I am still taking one. I went back and re-read some old articles by Brian Pearce, and I am looking for opinions on which caliber and whether to go with some of the hot Buffalo Bore hard cast loads or something like the Hornady XTP loads. I also have my eye on one of the Ruger Blackhawks .44 Spl built on the .357 frame. ( I am basically just looking for a reason to buy it, it seems it would be less bulky to carry. Any help is greatly appreciated.


By the time I was 16 I'd walked just over 1,000 miles of the AT. Never, ever felt the need for a handgun. If I felt the need, I'd resist and carry bear spray. Damn effective on two and four legged beasts. FWIW, I never pack a handgun here in grizzly country, except when packing out bloody elk meat... then it's just a backup to bear spray.

Carrying a handgun is an awesome responsibility. If you've ever taken a human life you'll know what I mean. Unless you're thoroughly trained and have the right mindset, I'd not carry.
_________________________
Cartridges are more alike than different.

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#6866435 - 09/12/12 06:14 PM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: Brad]
David_Walter Online   content
Campfire 'Bwana

Registered: 09/07/04
Posts: 10157
Loc: TriCities, WA
Originally Posted By: Brad

Carrying a handgun is an awesome responsibility. If you've ever taken a human life you'll know what I mean. Unless you're thoroughly trained and have the right mindset, I'd not carry.


What Brad said....
_________________________
Of all tyrannies, a tyranny sincerely exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive.... those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end for they do so with the approval of their own conscience.
C. S. Lewis

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#6866453 - 09/12/12 06:18 PM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: David_Walter]
bigwhoop Offline
Campfire 'Bwana

Registered: 11/22/05
Posts: 13411
Loc: MN. - flyover socialism
Good points here by Brad and DW. While I can carry, I prefer the chemical irritants.
Pretty dam effective for man or beast and a lot less paperwork and court time.
For protection in my home, "Condition One" is the rule of the day.


Edited by bigwhoop (09/12/12 06:18 PM)
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#6866460 - 09/12/12 06:21 PM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: Brad]
Take_a_knee Offline
Campfire 'Bwana

Registered: 09/10/09
Posts: 13798
Originally Posted By: Brad


By the time I was 16 I'd walked just over 1,000 miles of the AT. Never, ever felt the need for a handgun. If I felt the need, I'd resist and carry bear spray. Damn effective on two and four legged beasts. FWIW, I never pack a handgun here in grizzly country, except when packing out bloody elk meat... then it's just a backup to bear spray.

Carrying a handgun is an awesome responsibility. If you've ever killed someone you'll know what I mean. Unless you're thoroughly trained and have the right mindset, I'd not carry.


I agree. Also, there is the problem of what to do with the gun while in town. You will also likely be violating a myriad of laws. UDAP bear spray weighs 9oz. Bears are an increasing problem in the SE, an AT section in GA now requires you to hike through or have a bear canister if you camp now.

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#6866696 - 09/12/12 07:23 PM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: David_Walter]
CoalCracker Offline
Campfire Regular

Registered: 08/23/10
Posts: 707
Loc: PA
Originally Posted By: David_Walter
Originally Posted By: Brad

Carrying a handgun is an awesome responsibility. If you've ever taken a human life you'll know what I mean. Unless you're thoroughly trained and have the right mindset, I'd not carry.


What Brad said....


I've never felt the need to carry a firearm or pepper spray when hiking along the AT in Pennsylvania. With that said, I am trying to understand the the train of thought with regard to whether people who are accustomed to using firearms not consider defending themselves with one unless they have received some expert level of training. I believe you and Brad may have experience in such matters that I do not, and so I would value your opinion.

Let's say that I have been in the woods along or near the AT many times since I was a kid carrying a firearm while hunting. Presumably, I would defend myself from a four-legged or two-legged critter with that firearm if the need arose, although honestly, I never really thought about such a far-fetched scenario.

What's the difference between a life-long hunter and shooter walking along/near the AT with a long gun during hunting season versus a life-long hunter and shooter hiking along the AT with a handgun, especially if the hunter/shooter has a fair amount of experience shooting the handgun? Does the difference come down to entirely one of a different mindset where in one instance the primary purpose for carrying a firearm is hunting while in the other instance the primary reason is self-defense? Can't there be some overlap where a person with years of experience handling weapons while hunting and shooting has at least the bare minimum experience needed to be able to defend himself with a firearm if necessary?

I ask this because I have seen threads in the handgun forum and elsewhere suggesting that your run-of-the-mill, life-long "gun guy" really shouldn't even consider self-defense with a firearm unless they have a high level of expensive civilian training or LEO/military training. But I am of the opinion that if I really needed a gun, nothing else would suffice, and I wonder whether being around guns since almost forever, coupled with a dose of common sense, would be "good enough".

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#6867000 - 09/12/12 08:40 PM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: CoalCracker]
gmsemel Offline
Campfire Tracker

Registered: 01/28/01
Posts: 5614
Loc: East Haddam, CT
I'm not a handgun guy, I would just take a 22 rifle like a ruger 10/22 and a couple of boxes of ammo along with an extra magazine. Most will be able to shoot a rifle a lot better than a handgun. Or a Marlin 336 in 30-30 plenty light and plenty for most pests either four or two legged. I understand the Idea of handguns, I carried one for 30 years. I still carry from time to time, I just can shoot a rifle better. In the end carry what ever it is you want to carry.
_________________________
"Any idiot can face a crisis,it's the day-to-day living that wears you out."

Anton Chekhov



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#6867018 - 09/12/12 08:49 PM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: bigwhoop]
shrapnel Offline
Campfire 'Bwana

Registered: 06/04/07
Posts: 12001
Loc: Bozeman, MT
Originally Posted By: bigwhoop
Good points here by Brad and DW. While I can carry, I prefer the chemical irritants.
Pretty dam effective for man or beast and a lot less paperwork and court time.
For protection in my home, "Condition One" is the rule of the day.


I'm sure Hugh Glass would debate the chemical irritant...
_________________________
Originally Posted By: deflave
If you want to fit in with a new crowd, ask them if they know shrapnel. There is no friggin' way they won't know who that man is. He is the Chuck Norris of Montana and you will have a nice icebreaker to discuss.
Travis



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#6867063 - 09/12/12 09:08 PM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: raverym14]
Take_a_knee Offline
Campfire 'Bwana

Registered: 09/10/09
Posts: 13798
Oh, Ravery, I forgot to apologize for the loss of your kin many years ago. We had this handgun topic come up many years ago on Whiteblaze. Someone researched the topic and the vast majority of the murders that have happened in the history of the AT have happened NEAR THE SHELTERS. Smart folks stay away from them. I use a hammock and typically hang somewhere out of view of the trail.

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#6867066 - 09/12/12 09:10 PM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: gmsemel]
Take_a_knee Offline
Campfire 'Bwana

Registered: 09/10/09
Posts: 13798
Originally Posted By: gmsemel
I'm not a handgun guy, I would just take a 22 rifle like a ruger 10/22 and a couple of boxes of ammo along with an extra magazine. Most will be able to shoot a rifle a lot better than a handgun. Or a Marlin 336 in 30-30 plenty light and plenty for most pests either four or two legged. I understand the Idea of handguns, I carried one for 30 years. I still carry from time to time, I just can shoot a rifle better. In the end carry what ever it is you want to carry.



EVERYBODY shoots a rifle better than they do a handgun. That isn't the point, and advising an AT hiker to carry a 30/30 marlin for "self-protection" is about the nuttiest thing I've ever read on the fire.

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#6867109 - 09/12/12 09:33 PM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: CoalCracker]
David_Walter Online   content
Campfire 'Bwana

Registered: 09/07/04
Posts: 10157
Loc: TriCities, WA
Originally Posted By: CoalCracker
I ask this because I have seen threads in the handgun forum and elsewhere suggesting that your run-of-the-mill, life-long "gun guy" really shouldn't even consider self-defense with a firearm unless they have a high level of expensive civilian training or LEO/military training. But I am of the opinion that if I really needed a gun, nothing else would suffice, and I wonder whether being around guns since almost forever, coupled with a dose of common sense, would be "good enough".


I can't speak for Brad or others, but I think the difference is consequence management. If you flub a shot on a deer, there's only minor consequences. Outside of sanctioned combat, the consequences of firing on another person are severe, even if you're vindicated, as a civilian. In uniform, we get a pass by the populace because we're shooting at "enemies" and not "people." In every case as a civilian, be prepared to face additional scrutiny from all corners on the use of lethal force.

As Heidi Smith, she of Thunder Ranch, likes to opine, "there's a lawyer attached to every bullet. How many lawyers to you want to let loose?"

I guess it's down to this, in a combat situation and I shoot the guy and its on the edge, it will be perceived to be a righteous shooting unless there's strong evidence otherwise. As a civilian, if I pull my weapon, there had better be a significant amount of evidence that I was in fear for my life or limb before I fire, and the "fear" bar is much higher. The statute of limitations on murder is forever, and if at any time any authority who may have had jurisdiction over the shooting determines there was foul play, you'll have to defend yourself in court again.

Double jeopardy, sadly, has been interpreted as a jurisdictional thing. Meaning, the City gets a shot at you, then the county, then the state, then the US for a civil rights violation.

Extensive training as a civilian is valuable if for no other reason than learning this, paraphrased from Jeff Cooper:

Did you shoot to kill?
"no"
Did you shoot to wound?"
"no."
Then why did you shoot XYZ ### number of times?
"He did ____ that put me in fear for my life."
So you shot him until he was dead?
"No. I shot him until he stopped doing that. Then I called 911 and rendered first aid."

Also, training teaches you to yell things like "Stop! Stop! Drop the knife! Someone call the police." And how to draw your weapon in a manner that causes the aggressor to correctly interpret your willingness to shoot them (not shoot at them, shoot them. They look different) and to cause the aggressor to retreat, which is better for everybody.

Frankly, it doesn't really matter if you shoot first or yell first (well, yell first is preferred), most witnesses will remember yelling and shooting, in that order. Thank God for preconditioning by cop shows.

In a civilian on civilian situation, you're never really done.

Don't even get me started on what happens when you try to return to your "normal" civilian life and everyone knows you shot someone. There's volumes and volumes to suggest you'll never get your life back.


Edited by David_Walter (09/12/12 09:51 PM)
_________________________
Of all tyrannies, a tyranny sincerely exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive.... those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end for they do so with the approval of their own conscience.
C. S. Lewis

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#6867128 - 09/12/12 09:45 PM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: David_Walter]
Jeff_O Offline
Campfire Oracle

Registered: 04/21/07
Posts: 26248
Loc: Wetter'n Oregon
Good post!
_________________________
Aim small, miss small
Think small, miss big

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#6867165 - 09/12/12 10:08 PM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: Take_a_knee]
Greenhorn Offline
Campfire Ranger

Registered: 02/25/01
Posts: 1978
Originally Posted By: Take_a_knee
Originally Posted By: noKnees
its a little late to suggest buying a new gun.. but this is my answer to your question.



12 oz 357, I carry a full power 158g load in it.


Unfortunately no longer produced...but I got mine.


Got mine too... perfect for bear country. I know everybody prefers spray.. but it's the last thing I want when something's got me down, chewing on me. Can't say Hi-V ammo is fun to shoot in this though - probably why it's not made anymore. It's got a bite.

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#6867561 - 09/13/12 05:57 AM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: Greenhorn]
KRD Offline
Member

Registered: 05/27/05
Posts: 30
Loc: Colorado
I have the pleasure to live in bear. lion and coyote country and walk my dog daily in it. She wears a bell and I carry a Ruger LCR in .38 Spcl with a max load.
The only issue that I have ever had was with some urbanized coyotes in a state park.
Where I go in the back country by my home my friend's Airedale jumped a mountain lion earlier this year. The lion is my biggest fear, more for the dog than me. With the bell, I seldom see anything but an occasional snake.
Last week I was hunting grouse in the Flattops and we came up on a cow and bull moose, the rut had started. Now that is a bigger problem than any black bear that I have ever encountered. Having three rounds of #6 shot is not very comforting. Fortunately, we were able to skirt around them before the bull got too agitated.

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#6868351 - 09/13/12 09:26 AM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: KRD]
JohnBurns Offline
Campfire Guide

Registered: 09/17/09
Posts: 2749
Loc: Wyoming
Count me as one who is not enamored with the thought of OC spray as a first line of defense. There are a lot of reasons for the popularity of the Taser these days and a big one is spotty results from OC. A meth head with his pain receptors burned out just might not fall to the ground from a shot of spray in his face.

It would also seem less than ideal if said bad guy, bent on destruction, did not have an aversion to firearms. If the bad guys would stick to just packing OC then I might reconsider but I sure would hate to show up at a gun fight with just a spray bottle of hot sauce to hide behind. shocked

Because the OP opened the door to a new gun my choice would be S&W MP in 9MM or the Gen 3 G19. Tupperware pistols are hard to stomach but 17 rnds of very effective ammo in a relatively small and light package seems to me to be the best answer to the question.

With the advances in what is termed Barrier Blind defensive ammo no bears skull is going to stop one of the new breed of 9MM +P loads. These loads were developed to not defect on intermediate barriers such as automobile glass and still deliver very good terminal results.

2 legged predators would be more of a concern but keep in mind even coons and skunks can be a problem. 40,000 people a year get treated for rabies here in the good old US of A, and the vectors are almost exclusively bites from wildlife. Hard to bring the skunk in that bit you if you only have OC spray.

I have packed a Scandium 329PD a few miles and it is hard to beat but more and more these days the Tupperware gets carried even in grizzly country.

I must need a different holster because my poor ol 329 sure has a lot of wear compared to some. cool
_________________________
John Burns


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#6868727 - 09/13/12 11:27 AM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: JohnBurns]
David_Walter Online   content
Campfire 'Bwana

Registered: 09/07/04
Posts: 10157
Loc: TriCities, WA
Originally Posted By: JohnBurns
I must need a different holster because my poor ol 329 sure has a lot of wear compared to some.


John, that looks like a carry gun and not a BBQ gun!
_________________________
Of all tyrannies, a tyranny sincerely exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive.... those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end for they do so with the approval of their own conscience.
C. S. Lewis

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#6871196 - 09/14/12 05:29 AM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: JohnBurns]
deflave Offline
Campfire Oracle

Registered: 08/16/07
Posts: 40499
Loc: Havre, Montana
Originally Posted By: JohnBurns
Count me as one who is not enamored with the thought of OC spray as a first line of defense. There are a lot of reasons for the popularity of the Taser these days and a big one is spotty results from OC. A meth head with his pain receptors burned out just might not fall to the ground from a shot of spray in his face.


While some of what you write here is true, I am inclined to ask how many times you've been sprayed. And how many time you've been tased?

Also, whether you intend to use it or not, having a can of bear spray on you is simply not a bad idea these days. At least you can spray the dead critter afterward... grin

Oh and since it is Friday, GFY...


Travis

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#6871246 - 09/14/12 05:46 AM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: deflave]
doubletap Offline
Campfire Tracker

Registered: 12/05/07
Posts: 5131
Loc: Atlanta
Originally Posted By: deflave

Also, whether you intend to use it or not, having a can of bear spray on you is simply not a bad idea these days. At least you can spray the dead critter afterward... grin

Travis

So, you season your game with pepper spray prior to cooking? grin
_________________________
He who joyfully marches in rank and file has already earned my contempt. He has been given a large brain by mistake, since for him the spinal cord would suffice.

- Albert Einstein

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#6871320 - 09/14/12 06:10 AM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: doubletap]
deflave Offline
Campfire Oracle

Registered: 08/16/07
Posts: 40499
Loc: Havre, Montana
Originally Posted By: doubletap
Originally Posted By: deflave

Also, whether you intend to use it or not, having a can of bear spray on you is simply not a bad idea these days. At least you can spray the dead critter afterward... grin

Travis

So, you season your game with pepper spray prior to cooking? grin


I wish. Bears are my white whale. The only ones I see are the size of my lab, or protected.

I guess I could try it on venison?


Travis

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#6871579 - 09/14/12 07:28 AM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: viking]
300stw Offline
Campfire Regular

Registered: 02/03/02
Posts: 862
Loc: NE Montana

just bought the exact gun, will be packing it theis weekend on a 3day backpack elk archery hunt




Originally Posted By: viking
How about that new Ruger SP 100? The five shot, 4 inch "kit gun". Take a few snake shot, a few 38's and a few full power 357's and hit the trail.

If I had to choose from what I have it would be my Taurus 44 mag tracker.

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#6871936 - 09/14/12 09:12 AM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: David_Walter]
CoalCracker Offline
Campfire Regular

Registered: 08/23/10
Posts: 707
Loc: PA
DW,

Thanks for the thoughtful response to my questions. There is a lot to process there.

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#6872295 - 09/14/12 10:44 AM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: deflave]
JohnBurns Offline
Campfire Guide

Registered: 09/17/09
Posts: 2749
Loc: Wyoming
Originally Posted By: deflave
Originally Posted By: JohnBurns
Count me as one who is not enamored with the thought of OC spray as a first line of defense. There are a lot of reasons for the popularity of the Taser these days and a big one is spotty results from OC. A meth head with his pain receptors burned out just might not fall to the ground from a shot of spray in his face.


While some of what you write here is true, I am inclined to ask how many times you've been sprayed. And how many time you've been tased?

Also, whether you intend to use it or not, having a can of bear spray on you is simply not a bad idea these days. At least you can spray the dead critter afterward... grin

Oh and since it is Friday, GFY...


Travis


Never been sprayed with real OC but have been in the gas chamber with out a mask and the old MACE. Never been tased.

Never been shot with a 9mm or .45 either if that was the next question. laugh

I fugure I got enough stuff to carry and if I have room for spray I have room for an extra mag instead.

I will take a pistol over spray especially when dealing with 2 legged critters that will most likely have a pistol of their own.
_________________________
John Burns


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#6872321 - 09/14/12 10:51 AM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: JohnBurns]
deflave Offline
Campfire Oracle

Registered: 08/16/07
Posts: 40499
Loc: Havre, Montana
My only point is that it is very effective. And there is a difference between being in actual backcountry and being in places like the AT and National Parks.


Travis

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#6872326 - 09/14/12 10:52 AM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: JohnBurns]
17ACKLEYBEE Offline
Campfire Kahuna

Registered: 11/04/07
Posts: 19664
Loc: A wash in the west.
Something big enough for things bigger than humans. I'll stay with my 3" barrel Model 629.
_________________________
NRA Lifetime Member

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#6872337 - 09/14/12 10:55 AM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: 17ACKLEYBEE]
Stormin_Norman Offline
Campfire Regular

Registered: 12/26/08
Posts: 1199
Loc: Kalispell MT
My favorite woods carry is a 2 1/2" .44 mag Taurus tracker. 300gr XTP's loaded "warm". Not a fun range gun :P

I have a few others, but it's the most comfortable for me to carry while hiking.
_________________________
"Life is tough, even tougher if your stupid"
John Wayne

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#6873077 - 09/14/12 03:18 PM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: CoalCracker]
David_Walter Online   content
Campfire 'Bwana

Registered: 09/07/04
Posts: 10157
Loc: TriCities, WA
Originally Posted By: CoalCracker
DW,

Thanks for the thoughtful response to my questions. There is a lot to process there.


Shooting people is a "think first" type of thing. I've already decided what would cause me to draw my weapon and fire on a person in combat and in civilian situations.

Civilian situations are a lot more complicated because they involve more variables. Like "it's going to cost me $100,000 to defend my self after shooting this jackss for stealing $25. Is that worth it?" In my mind, I've already decided to shoot before I would draw my weapon, and the only thing that would change that is some extremely positive development in the altercation. So, the bar for me to draw is pretty high.

Combat's more like "he's shooting or going to shoot at me or my people, and I need to prevent that." In that case, I'm carrying my rifle openly, and anyone who points a weapon at me is asking to get shot.
_________________________
Of all tyrannies, a tyranny sincerely exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive.... those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end for they do so with the approval of their own conscience.
C. S. Lewis

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#6873137 - 09/14/12 03:38 PM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: David_Walter]
MontanaMarine Offline
Campfire Outfitter

Registered: 09/25/01
Posts: 8500
Loc: Canyon Ferry, Montana
I've been sprayed in the eyes/face with OC in training a few times. After being sprayed, we were required to draw our PR-24 baton, administer a few jabs/strikes to a training bag, then handcuff a semi-compliant fellow student.

Bottom line, OC will make your eyes/nose burn and runny, make you wish to close your eyes, make it hard to breathe, irritate your mouth, throat, lungs, sinus.

But, if you have a strong combat mindset, and determination, it will not neutralize you.

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#6873184 - 09/14/12 03:59 PM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: MontanaMarine]
JohnBurns Offline
Campfire Guide

Registered: 09/17/09
Posts: 2749
Loc: Wyoming
Originally Posted By: MontanaMarine

But, if you have a strong combat mindset, and determination, it will not neutralize you.


Crap I screwed. grin
_________________________
John Burns


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#6873194 - 09/14/12 04:03 PM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: JohnBurns]
ingwe Offline
Campfire Oracle

Registered: 12/19/08
Posts: 54763
Loc: Southwestern Montucky
Originally Posted By: JohnBurns
Originally Posted By: MontanaMarine

But, if you have a strong combat mindset, and determination, it will not neutralize you.


Crap I screwed. grin


God..me too..


I dont think I could have a strong combat mindset when Im flopping around on the ground screaming like a little girl! cry


But I do think bear spray is a good idea, cause if the wind isnt with you, you'll get some in your face,and that way you wont be able to see what is about to happen to you... eek
_________________________
" I told my Pap and Mam I was comin' to the mountains Mother Gue I said,the Rocky Mountains are the marrow of the world. And by God I was right."
Delgue

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#6873205 - 09/14/12 04:05 PM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: JohnBurns]
MontanaMarine Offline
Campfire Outfitter

Registered: 09/25/01
Posts: 8500
Loc: Canyon Ferry, Montana
LOL.

I can just about guarantee that any human trying to defend their young from danger, would not be stopped by a blast of OC to their face.

Would a bear? I can't say, but it seems unlikely to me.

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#6873208 - 09/14/12 04:06 PM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: ingwe]
podunk Offline
Campfire Tracker

Registered: 03/09/10
Posts: 5042
Loc: Central Florida
No way in hell im pepper spraying Yogi...... Ive been subjected to it twice and it didnt "neutralize" "subdue" or "deter" me either time....
_________________________
The view one sees is his own
Practitioner of the ancient art of skank fu

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#6873213 - 09/14/12 04:08 PM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: podunk]
ingwe Offline
Campfire Oracle

Registered: 12/19/08
Posts: 54763
Loc: Southwestern Montucky
Dats cause you ain't right boy....

besides, all you need is that .22 mag derringer and some kerosene..... grin
_________________________
" I told my Pap and Mam I was comin' to the mountains Mother Gue I said,the Rocky Mountains are the marrow of the world. And by God I was right."
Delgue

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#6873217 - 09/14/12 04:10 PM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: ingwe]
podunk Offline
Campfire Tracker

Registered: 03/09/10
Posts: 5042
Loc: Central Florida
That will definitely,deter, neutralize or subdue a boar hog..... or so Im told....whistle
_________________________
The view one sees is his own
Practitioner of the ancient art of skank fu

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#6873223 - 09/14/12 04:12 PM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: podunk]
ingwe Offline
Campfire Oracle

Registered: 12/19/08
Posts: 54763
Loc: Southwestern Montucky
Plus...you can warm your hands on the fire...if he will hold still long enough... grin
_________________________
" I told my Pap and Mam I was comin' to the mountains Mother Gue I said,the Rocky Mountains are the marrow of the world. And by God I was right."
Delgue

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#6873237 - 09/14/12 04:17 PM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: ingwe]
podunk Offline
Campfire Tracker

Registered: 03/09/10
Posts: 5042
Loc: Central Florida
Not sure how itd work on ol Ephraim though.... May just wind up fighting a flaming bear... grin
_________________________
The view one sees is his own
Practitioner of the ancient art of skank fu

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#6873294 - 09/14/12 04:38 PM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: deflave]
toad Offline
Campfire Tracker

Registered: 02/01/09
Posts: 5663
Loc: Montana
interesting read: BEAR STUDY. i carry spray more often than not, even though i have most of the handguns mentioned in this thread.
_________________________
Guns don't kill people, drivers with cell phones kill people.

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#6873328 - 09/14/12 04:47 PM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: podunk]
Mule Deer Offline
Campfire Oracle

Registered: 07/24/01
Posts: 35416
Loc: Banana Belt, Montana
There have been numerous instances where bears have been stopped by pepper spray, and numerous instances where they've been stopped by handguns.

One of the instances that happened in Montana a few years ago involved a couple of guys bowhunting elk in a creek drainage not far north of Yellowstone Park. One guy had a .45 auto and and the guy had a big can of pepper spray.

They ran into a sow grizzly with cubs, about 50 yards away, according to their later estimates. She did the standard threat stuff--popping her jaws, bouncing on her front legs--and the guy with the .45 cut loose, apparently at what might have been too long a range for his skills. Dunno the load.

He wounded her, and she charged, got him down and started mauling him. The other guy drew his spray and applied it liberally. The bear ran off and stayed away. Luckily the spray-guy was a doctor and got his partner patched up and into a hospital.

This is an example of one, but educational. The guy with the handgun was evidently nervous and started shooting long before he should have, since the bear was threatening, not charging. And yes, pepper spray did drive off a wounded, angry mama grizzly.

I also know a few people who have pepper-sprayed black bears, and in every instance it worked, though none of the bears were mamas with cubs.

The most exprienced bear man I know, Phil Shoemaker, carries both pepper spray and a revolver when guiding fishermen during summer in Alaska. We had a big brown bear sow come galumphing up to us, because it was being chased by a dumb-ass woman with a point-and-shoot camera from another fishing party slightly upstream. The bear was not happy and at 15 feet away from us stood there trying to decide whether to charge. Phil had his right hand on his revolver and his left hand on the spray, which may be the belt and suspenders version of bear defense.
_________________________
John

The ultimate concern of a rifle loony is rifle trivia. And why not? What else is as distracting from the really important concerns of everyday life?

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#6873350 - 09/14/12 04:55 PM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: MontanaMarine]
Take_a_knee Offline
Campfire 'Bwana

Registered: 09/10/09
Posts: 13798
Originally Posted By: MontanaMarine
I've been sprayed in the eyes/face with OC in training a few times. After being sprayed, we were required to draw our PR-24 baton, administer a few jabs/strikes to a training bag, then handcuff a semi-compliant fellow student.

Bottom line, OC will make your eyes/nose burn and runny, make you wish to close your eyes, make it hard to breathe, irritate your mouth, throat, lungs, sinus.

But, if you have a strong combat mindset, and determination, it will not neutralize you.


And you knew it was coming, and you held your breath. If you'd never seen or heard of the stuff before and you were bellowing and snorting and running and somebody sprayed your face with about ten of those little squirts (like you recieved in training) all at once (equivalent to the UDAP) you'd have gone down like you took a 240 burst in the chest.

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#6873495 - 09/14/12 05:40 PM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: Mule Deer]
David_Walter Online   content
Campfire 'Bwana

Registered: 09/07/04
Posts: 10157
Loc: TriCities, WA
Originally Posted By: Mule Deer
Phil had his right hand on his revolver and his left hand on the spray, which may be the belt and suspenders version of bear defense.


I see an opportunity for a new Cabelas' product there...
_________________________
Of all tyrannies, a tyranny sincerely exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive.... those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end for they do so with the approval of their own conscience.
C. S. Lewis

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#6873527 - 09/14/12 05:54 PM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: Take_a_knee]
BillyGoatGruff Offline
Campfire Tracker

Registered: 11/16/08
Posts: 5631
Loc: North Central MT
Originally Posted By: Take_a_knee
Originally Posted By: MontanaMarine
I've been sprayed in the eyes/face with OC in training a few times. After being sprayed, we were required to draw our PR-24 baton, administer a few jabs/strikes to a training bag, then handcuff a semi-compliant fellow student.

Bottom line, OC will make your eyes/nose burn and runny, make you wish to close your eyes, make it hard to breathe, irritate your mouth, throat, lungs, sinus.

But, if you have a strong combat mindset, and determination, it will not neutralize you.


And you knew it was coming, and you held your breath. If you'd never seen or heard of the stuff before and you were bellowing and snorting and running and somebody sprayed your face with about ten of those little squirts (like you recieved in training) all at once (equivalent to the UDAP) you'd have gone down like you took a 240 burst in the chest.


I've been hit with OC and I've seen others get hit. Not a squirt, a sustained stream from less than 2 feet away after doing a fair amount of PT, i.e. you are sweating and breathing hard. No way to not get the "full effect". And in my case the fun just started. There was work to do while you were feeling the awesomeness.

Different people react differently, dunno about bears. But I do know that if the wind is wrong I'm phucked. I don't carry bear spray, but I do carry a 629 or a 586 stoked with rounds that will do what I need them to do.

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#6873561 - 09/14/12 06:05 PM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: BillyGoatGruff]
bigwhoop Offline
Campfire 'Bwana

Registered: 11/22/05
Posts: 13411
Loc: MN. - flyover socialism
You might as well add this tool to your anti-bear arsenal.
It might prevent any major internal damage when YOU wear it.

http://www.dickssportinggoods.com/product/index.jsp?productId=11916675&010=SKU-10922384&003=3934892&camp=CSE:Nextag:11916675
_________________________
Tikka: box to bench @ 200 yds. - no drama 270Win

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#6873592 - 09/14/12 06:22 PM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: David_Walter]
JCMCUBIC Offline
Campfire Tracker

Registered: 04/25/05
Posts: 5567
Originally Posted By: Mule Deer
Phil had his right hand on his revolver and his left hand on the spray, which may be the belt and suspenders version of bear defense.


I like that...spray and if that don't work..... I'd hate to shoot a bear unless it was the only alternative....but I'd hate it worse to not be able to shoot a bear if the only alternative was me getting chewed on.

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#6873598 - 09/14/12 06:25 PM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: JCMCUBIC]
Mule Deer Offline
Campfire Oracle

Registered: 07/24/01
Posts: 35416
Loc: Banana Belt, Montana
I'd also hate not being able to shoot a 2-legged varmint because it was more than 30 feet away--and 30 feet is about the outer limit for pepper spray.
_________________________
John

The ultimate concern of a rifle loony is rifle trivia. And why not? What else is as distracting from the really important concerns of everyday life?

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#6873605 - 09/14/12 06:29 PM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: Mule Deer]
Jim in Idaho Offline
Campfire Kahuna

Registered: 01/29/01
Posts: 16365
Loc: Idaho, USA
So what I'm getting from this is that the term "spray and pray" really originated with capsicum ursine repellants, not with nine millimeter pistols as is commonly believed.
_________________________
Gunnery, gunnery, gunnery.
Hit the target, all else is twaddle!

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#6873611 - 09/14/12 06:30 PM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: Jim in Idaho]
ingwe Offline
Campfire Oracle

Registered: 12/19/08
Posts: 54763
Loc: Southwestern Montucky
It was a combination of the two... grin
_________________________
" I told my Pap and Mam I was comin' to the mountains Mother Gue I said,the Rocky Mountains are the marrow of the world. And by God I was right."
Delgue

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#6873919 - 09/14/12 08:11 PM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: Take_a_knee]
MontanaMarine Offline
Campfire Outfitter

Registered: 09/25/01
Posts: 8500
Loc: Canyon Ferry, Montana
Originally Posted By: Take_a_knee
Originally Posted By: MontanaMarine
I've been sprayed in the eyes/face with OC in training a few times. After being sprayed, we were required to draw our PR-24 baton, administer a few jabs/strikes to a training bag, then handcuff a semi-compliant fellow student.

Bottom line, OC will make your eyes/nose burn and runny, make you wish to close your eyes, make it hard to breathe, irritate your mouth, throat, lungs, sinus.

But, if you have a strong combat mindset, and determination, it will not neutralize you.


And you knew it was coming, and you held your breath. If you'd never seen or heard of the stuff before and you were bellowing and snorting and running and somebody sprayed your face with about ten of those little squirts (like you recieved in training) all at once (equivalent to the UDAP) you'd have gone down like you took a 240 burst in the chest.


Keep guessing.

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#6874641 - 09/15/12 06:58 AM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: MontanaMarine]
deflave Offline
Campfire Oracle

Registered: 08/16/07
Posts: 40499
Loc: Havre, Montana
Originally Posted By: MontanaMarine
Originally Posted By: Take_a_knee
Originally Posted By: MontanaMarine
I've been sprayed in the eyes/face with OC in training a few times. After being sprayed, we were required to draw our PR-24 baton, administer a few jabs/strikes to a training bag, then handcuff a semi-compliant fellow student.

Bottom line, OC will make your eyes/nose burn and runny, make you wish to close your eyes, make it hard to breathe, irritate your mouth, throat, lungs, sinus.

But, if you have a strong combat mindset, and determination, it will not neutralize you.


And you knew it was coming, and you held your breath. If you'd never seen or heard of the stuff before and you were bellowing and snorting and running and somebody sprayed your face with about ten of those little squirts (like you recieved in training) all at once (equivalent to the UDAP) you'd have gone down like you took a 240 burst in the chest.


Keep guessing.


Quite obviously he is doing so.

I would never carry spray and not a firearm but I do carry spray. I've been OC'd no less than four times and Shane is correct, you can fight through it.

Although I have never had to spray a bear, I have sprayed a whole pile of canines. And it hurts them, bad. To the point that they will behave differently for extended periods of time.

It definitely does bad schit to critter's olfactory system.


Travis

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#6874666 - 09/15/12 07:05 AM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: Take_a_knee]
NH K9 Offline
Campfire Outfitter

Registered: 07/12/06
Posts: 8109
Loc: New Hampshire
Originally Posted By: Take_a_knee
Originally Posted By: MontanaMarine
I've been sprayed in the eyes/face with OC in training a few times. After being sprayed, we were required to draw our PR-24 baton, administer a few jabs/strikes to a training bag, then handcuff a semi-compliant fellow student.

Bottom line, OC will make your eyes/nose burn and runny, make you wish to close your eyes, make it hard to breathe, irritate your mouth, throat, lungs, sinus.

But, if you have a strong combat mindset, and determination, it will not neutralize you.


And you knew it was coming, and you held your breath. If you'd never seen or heard of the stuff before and you were bellowing and snorting and running and somebody sprayed your face with about ten of those little squirts (like you recieved in training) all at once (equivalent to the UDAP) you'd have gone down like you took a 240 burst in the chest.


TAK, I respectfully disagree. I'm one of the lucky ones that is impacted very little by OC. For example, I had one of my patrol guys surpise both the suspect and myself by basically emptying his "fogger" into a basement area (he might have been a little amped up). I was in said area and there was a baby in the back. I evacuated the baby and took the suspect into custody (my officer hated OC and got the hell out).
OC doesn't impact everyone the same. I've seen it be completely ineffective as many times as I've seen it work.

I can also state that we've walked our K9s through clouds of OC and CS (enough that the handlers wore masks). It only served to pizz them off more, not turn them.

George
_________________________
Out of every one hundred men, ten shouldn't even be there, eighty are just targets, nine are the real fighters, and we are lucky to have them, for they make the battle. Ah, but the one, one is a warrior, and he will bring the others back.

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#6874681 - 09/15/12 07:10 AM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: deflave]
shrapnel Offline
Campfire 'Bwana

Registered: 06/04/07
Posts: 12001
Loc: Bozeman, MT
If you read this whole thread, there isn't a very big % of actual encounters. Back and forth between spray and guns is the same as the age old argument of 9mm vs 45 ACP.

I have encountered Grizzlies near our cabin near Yellowstone, and I have seen false charges, no real attacks. Getting to bear spray or a firearm when a critter that big has you in his sights is scary and unnerving. I don't know if I could get to either without messing my pants.

Either way I hunt that area up there during bow season, I do my own thing and after a real encounter, I will report on whether or not my preferred carry is better than the other...
_________________________
Originally Posted By: deflave
If you want to fit in with a new crowd, ask them if they know shrapnel. There is no friggin' way they won't know who that man is. He is the Chuck Norris of Montana and you will have a nice icebreaker to discuss.
Travis



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#6874722 - 09/15/12 07:21 AM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: shrapnel]
deflave Offline
Campfire Oracle

Registered: 08/16/07
Posts: 40499
Loc: Havre, Montana
Bears charge shrapnel until they get a peek at who they're charging.



Travis

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#6874746 - 09/15/12 07:28 AM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: deflave]
Take_a_knee Offline
Campfire 'Bwana

Registered: 09/10/09
Posts: 13798
Well, OC works like a charm on Haitians. I fact, I never saw it NOT work on Haitians, and I oughta know cause I used it a BUNCH. Some of the little cretin thieves in Portau Prince did figure out how to use citrus (limes) to neutralize the spray in their eyes. They'd run off after you hosed 'em, get their eyes cleared up and be back at it in no time. They had long ago figure out TO HOLD THEIR BREATH though.

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#6874926 - 09/15/12 08:29 AM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: Take_a_knee]
MontanaMarine Offline
Campfire Outfitter

Registered: 09/25/01
Posts: 8500
Loc: Canyon Ferry, Montana
Yeah, OC works well....except when it doesn't.

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#6877906 - 09/16/12 09:39 AM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: MontanaMarine]
Royce Offline
Campfire Guide

Registered: 12/28/03
Posts: 4458
Loc: zip code 59602
Speaking of bears and hikes, saw these two yesterday morning on our way to a hike


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#6878001 - 09/16/12 10:13 AM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: Royce]
Royce Offline
Campfire Guide

Registered: 12/28/03
Posts: 4458
Loc: zip code 59602
I have no first hand knowledge of stopping a bear charge. Never had to thankfully. However, because I am occasionally in bear country, I try to be as prudent as possible. To that end, I try to gain information from more informed sources.
Two different reviews of bear attacks had similar findings. Bear spray was successful in stopping bear attacks about 90 % of the time, firearms about 60% of the time. If I remember correctly it took an average of 4 shots to stop a bear. The typical bear attack occurred something like 3 or 4 seconds after the bear was first seen.
Therefore, I always carry bear spray in bear country. And, a firearm, if possible.
Not knowing a lot about handguns and bears, I tried to follow Phil Shoemakers advice, and carry the most powerful handgun that has manageable recoil and in my case that is a S&W Mountain Gun in 44 Magnum with cast bullets.
I am not putting the above information out as my own or as being original, but as at least having some reasoning behind it.

Fred

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#6878688 - 09/16/12 02:33 PM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: Royce]
logcutter Offline
Campfire Tracker

Registered: 02/06/04
Posts: 5759
Loc: Central Idaho
Quote:
I have no first hand knowledge of stopping a bear charge.


I have and a 130 grain Nolser stopped it all.I would want nothing less and I also have been gassed several times and was taught how to work through it to take care of the matter at hand without a mask.

Life or death situation and someone prefers a spray over a bullet provided he or she is capable of making a good shot under the stress of the event?

Why not hair spray and a match or a flame thrower? laugh

Because if there that close, you already lost!

Jayco

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#6878716 - 09/16/12 02:41 PM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: logcutter]
toad Offline
Campfire Tracker

Registered: 02/01/09
Posts: 5663
Loc: Montana
'a good shot under the stress of the event' means a CNS shot on a wildly moving target the size of a grapefruit. there's been a few hunters killed lately BECAUSE they shot the bear.

and yes, i've killed bear at spitting distance.
_________________________
Guns don't kill people, drivers with cell phones kill people.

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#6878732 - 09/16/12 02:47 PM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: toad]
logcutter Offline
Campfire Tracker

Registered: 02/06/04
Posts: 5759
Loc: Central Idaho
Really...It takes a CNS shot to stop all Bears...Not!!!!!

You read to much!

Jayco

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#6878753 - 09/16/12 02:54 PM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: logcutter]
toad Offline
Campfire Tracker

Registered: 02/01/09
Posts: 5663
Loc: Montana
do ya really think bleeding out a charging bear is gonna do it? laffin...

_________________________
Guns don't kill people, drivers with cell phones kill people.

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#6878783 - 09/16/12 03:05 PM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: toad]
logcutter Offline
Campfire Tracker

Registered: 02/06/04
Posts: 5759
Loc: Central Idaho
I'm laughing too......You don't have to hit CNS to stop a fricken Bear.

How did this happen without a CNS shot?

"This grizzly was killed in Spatsizi Plateau Wilderness Park in the Eagle Nest Mountain Range of Northern British Columbia. He squared over 8 feet and the skull measured 23 13/16'', which is very good size for an interior mountain grizzly bear. When I shot the bear, he had started a charge from about 70 yards away, and by the time I had a sight on him, he was 40 yards. The 540 Hammerhead hit him right between the front legs, and he did a complete front-wards flip after the bullet hit him. That bullet completely penetrated him lengthwise and exited. I made a follow up shot (which was unnecessary, just instinct) after he rolled which angled through the chest, took out a section of spine, and exited the top of his skull (if you look closely at the photo you can see the exit hole in his head). Very impressive bullet performance."



Jayco

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#6878814 - 09/16/12 03:14 PM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: logcutter]
toad Offline
Campfire Tracker

Registered: 02/01/09
Posts: 5663
Loc: Montana
your google fu is great today. now read the title of the thread slowly so you understand.

then ask yourself what the .540 is that the guy in the picture is holding.
_________________________
Guns don't kill people, drivers with cell phones kill people.

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#6878829 - 09/16/12 03:21 PM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: toad]
logcutter Offline
Campfire Tracker

Registered: 02/06/04
Posts: 5759
Loc: Central Idaho
Use enough handgun like the 45-70 BFR and you will penetrate any Grizz stem to stern taking out all the crap in between.

I didn't Google anything...Randy Garrett is a good friend of mine and sent this little bugger to me via e-mail.

Use enough gun and aim strait.Use the spray for seasoning!

Jayco

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#6878848 - 09/16/12 03:28 PM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: logcutter]
toad Offline
Campfire Tracker

Registered: 02/01/09
Posts: 5663
Loc: Montana
and in what world is the 4#+ .45-70 BFR a 'hiking revolver'?

again, read THIS
_________________________
Guns don't kill people, drivers with cell phones kill people.

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#6878849 - 09/16/12 03:29 PM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: logcutter]
wildhobbybobby Offline
Campfire Ranger

Registered: 12/26/09
Posts: 2416
Loc: Michigan Yooper
It is fascinating that a newbie's first post on a subject that has been beat to death over and over again for years has resulted in 14 pages so far and no end in sight.

I wonder if the OP will ever appear to submit his third post (probably on the .270 vs. the .30/06 for 133 lb. Axis deer over a pile of rutabagahs at 4:30 PM from 227 yards on a Thursday afternoon during the second phase of the moon in October).


Edited by wildhobbybobby (09/16/12 03:30 PM)
_________________________
Life is like a purple antelope on a field of tuna fish...

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#6878851 - 09/16/12 03:31 PM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: logcutter]
k20350 Offline
Campfire Regular

Registered: 02/28/09
Posts: 572
Loc: Michigan
What is the old grisly alaskan quote. "Make sure you have your bear spray ready so you can spray him down after you shoot him 'cause they stink to high heaven."

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#6878873 - 09/16/12 03:37 PM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: toad]
logcutter Offline
Campfire Tracker

Registered: 02/06/04
Posts: 5759
Loc: Central Idaho
Originally Posted By: toad
and in what world is the 4#+ .45-70 BFR a 'hiking revolver'?


Your showing your stripes...A 4# revolver in a good bandoleer holster is ten fold better than a 3# holster/caliber on the side that won't do the deed.

Show me your handgun and how far it will penetrate a Grizzly.I will bet you,my handgun will out penetrate any rifle you own?


Jayco

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#6878890 - 09/16/12 03:42 PM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: logcutter]
Rancho_Loco Offline
Campfire Kahuna

Registered: 12/06/04
Posts: 19172
Loc: MONTANA
Watch it Toad! Next he'll challenge you to push ups!!

After that it's naked wrestling!!!
_________________________
Originally Posted By RichardAustin
Deleted

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#6878898 - 09/16/12 03:44 PM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: logcutter]
toad Offline
Campfire Tracker

Registered: 02/01/09
Posts: 5663
Loc: Montana
you see, unlike you, i get out of the truck and walk. places where your sneakers won't get you.
_________________________
Guns don't kill people, drivers with cell phones kill people.

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#6878922 - 09/16/12 03:51 PM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: toad]
logcutter Offline
Campfire Tracker

Registered: 02/06/04
Posts: 5759
Loc: Central Idaho
Originally Posted By: toad
you see, unlike you, i get out of the truck and walk. places where your sneakers won't get you.


Really....I will match you picture for picture this year on getting out.



Jayco

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#6878928 - 09/16/12 03:52 PM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: toad]
Mule Deer Offline
Campfire Oracle

Registered: 07/24/01
Posts: 35416
Loc: Banana Belt, Montana
Amazing. Somebody asks what handgun for hiking the Appalachian Trail, and now we have....
_________________________
John

The ultimate concern of a rifle loony is rifle trivia. And why not? What else is as distracting from the really important concerns of everyday life?

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#6878934 - 09/16/12 03:54 PM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: Mule Deer]
toad Offline
Campfire Tracker

Registered: 02/01/09
Posts: 5663
Loc: Montana
yep, and the OP already said his .480 SRH was too big and heavy...
_________________________
Guns don't kill people, drivers with cell phones kill people.

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#6878942 - 09/16/12 03:58 PM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: Mule Deer]
logcutter Offline
Campfire Tracker

Registered: 02/06/04
Posts: 5759
Loc: Central Idaho
They have some big Bears there......Don't be so condescending.



Jayco

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#6878944 - 09/16/12 03:59 PM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: logcutter]
NH K9 Offline
Campfire Outfitter

Registered: 07/12/06
Posts: 8109
Loc: New Hampshire
Quote:
Show me your handgun and how far it will penetrate a Grizzly


Have they moved the AT in the last couple months? I don't remember it running though griz country.

George
_________________________
Out of every one hundred men, ten shouldn't even be there, eighty are just targets, nine are the real fighters, and we are lucky to have them, for they make the battle. Ah, but the one, one is a warrior, and he will bring the others back.

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#6878958 - 09/16/12 04:05 PM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: Rancho_Loco]
SamOlson Offline
Campfire Kahuna

Registered: 02/01/06
Posts: 23101
Originally Posted By: Rancho_Loco
Watch it Toad! Next he'll challenge you to push ups!!

After that it's naked wrestling!!!



TFF!
_________________________
These are the Good Ol' Days

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#6878980 - 09/16/12 04:10 PM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: SamOlson]
toad Offline
Campfire Tracker

Registered: 02/01/09
Posts: 5663
Loc: Montana
eeewwwwww
_________________________
Guns don't kill people, drivers with cell phones kill people.

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#6879066 - 09/16/12 04:45 PM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: SamOlson]
logcutter Offline
Campfire Tracker

Registered: 02/06/04
Posts: 5759
Loc: Central Idaho
SamO..Your my hero!!!!

What do you have in common with Waylon?

I just do not see it...Correct me please.



Jayco

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#6879073 - 09/16/12 04:47 PM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: logcutter]
Rancho_Loco Offline
Campfire Kahuna

Registered: 12/06/04
Posts: 19172
Loc: MONTANA
Logsucker's posting pictures of half naked men again.

Why am I not surprised?
_________________________
Originally Posted By RichardAustin
Deleted

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#6879129 - 09/16/12 05:06 PM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: Rancho_Loco]
BillyGoatGruff Offline
Campfire Tracker

Registered: 11/16/08
Posts: 5631
Loc: North Central MT
I just spit High Life all over my mac. Thanks guys...................

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#6879172 - 09/16/12 05:17 PM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: Mule Deer]
idahoguy101 Offline
Campfire Guide

Registered: 03/28/08
Posts: 2687
Loc: Caldwell, Idaho
Originally Posted By: Mule Deer
Amazing. Somebody asks what handgun for hiking the Appalachian Trail, and now we have....


I observe that on 24hourcampfire.com that any posting that goes over four pages has veered off into tangents often well off the original. Now who most deserves that this new Law be named for?


Edited by idahoguy101 (09/16/12 05:22 PM)

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#6879301 - 09/16/12 05:51 PM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: idahoguy101]
logcutter Offline
Campfire Tracker

Registered: 02/06/04
Posts: 5759
Loc: Central Idaho
No....Not one person posted how large the Bears on the trail can be..This Bear took a 300 grain .458 Barnes solid copper through both shoulders and barely exited.

Not your .38 special type of bear.Size makes a difference.



Jayco

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#6879384 - 09/16/12 06:09 PM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: wildhobbybobby]
deflave Offline
Campfire Oracle

Registered: 08/16/07
Posts: 40499
Loc: Havre, Montana
Originally Posted By: wildhobbybobby
It is fascinating that a newbie's first post on a subject that has been beat to death over and over again for years has resulted in 14 pages so far and no end in sight.

I wonder if the OP will ever appear to submit his third post (probably on the .270 vs. the .30/06 for 133 lb. Axis deer over a pile of rutabagahs at 4:30 PM from 227 yards on a Thursday afternoon during the second phase of the moon in October).


On the internet, "Hiking"="World record grizzly attacking you every 100yds".


Travis

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#6879389 - 09/16/12 06:10 PM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: logcutter]
deflave Offline
Campfire Oracle

Registered: 08/16/07
Posts: 40499
Loc: Havre, Montana
Originally Posted By: logcutter
No....Not one person posted how large the Bears on the trail can be..This Bear took a 300 grain .458 Barnes solid copper through both shoulders and barely exited.

Not your .38 special type of bear.Size makes a difference.



Jayco


GD Jayco! You're prettier than I would have guessed.

Those BFR's are some great hiking revolvers. They go awesome with my 12lb. sack!


Travis

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#6879405 - 09/16/12 06:15 PM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: toad]
17ACKLEYBEE Offline
Campfire Kahuna

Registered: 11/04/07
Posts: 19664
Loc: A wash in the west.
Originally Posted By: toad
and in what world is the 4#+ .45-70 BFR a 'hiking revolver'?


The one where people want to live and not be desert.
_________________________
NRA Lifetime Member

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#6879408 - 09/16/12 06:16 PM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: logcutter]
deflave Offline
Campfire Oracle

Registered: 08/16/07
Posts: 40499
Loc: Havre, Montana
Originally Posted By: logcutter
SamO..Your my hero!!!!

What do you have in common with Waylon?

I just do not see it...Correct me please.



Jayco


Jayco! This is a family site! Clean this schit up!

Last warning.


Travis

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#6879410 - 09/16/12 06:17 PM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: 17ACKLEYBEE]
deflave Offline
Campfire Oracle

Registered: 08/16/07
Posts: 40499
Loc: Havre, Montana
Originally Posted By: 17ACKLEYBEE
Originally Posted By: toad
and in what world is the 4#+ .45-70 BFR a 'hiking revolver'?


The one where people want to live and not be desert.


You obviously do lots of hiking.


Travis

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#6879415 - 09/16/12 06:17 PM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: logcutter]
doubletap Offline
Campfire Tracker

Registered: 12/05/07
Posts: 5131
Loc: Atlanta
Originally Posted By: logcutter
No....Not one person posted how large the Bears on the trail can be..This Bear took a 300 grain .458 Barnes solid copper through both shoulders and barely exited.

Not your .38 special type of bear.Size makes a difference.



Jayco

How do you know it barely exited? Did you find it laying on the ground next to the bear?
_________________________
He who joyfully marches in rank and file has already earned my contempt. He has been given a large brain by mistake, since for him the spinal cord would suffice.

- Albert Einstein

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#6879427 - 09/16/12 06:20 PM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: Rancho_Loco]
deflave Offline
Campfire Oracle

Registered: 08/16/07
Posts: 40499
Loc: Havre, Montana
Originally Posted By: Rancho_Loco
Watch it Toad! Next he'll challenge you to push ups!!

After that it's naked wrestling!!!


Laughin' my ass off...


Travis

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#6879442 - 09/16/12 06:26 PM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: doubletap]
ingwe Offline
Campfire Oracle

Registered: 12/19/08
Posts: 54763
Loc: Southwestern Montucky
Originally Posted By: doubletap

How do you know it barely exited? Did you find it laying on the ground next to the bear?


I think he meant 'bearly' exited...but its tough to tell with the way he spells... grin
_________________________
" I told my Pap and Mam I was comin' to the mountains Mother Gue I said,the Rocky Mountains are the marrow of the world. And by God I was right."
Delgue

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#6879470 - 09/16/12 06:32 PM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: 17ACKLEYBEE]
BillyGoatGruff Offline
Campfire Tracker

Registered: 11/16/08
Posts: 5631
Loc: North Central MT
Originally Posted By: 17ACKLEYBEE
Originally Posted By: toad
and in what world is the 4#+ .45-70 BFR a 'hiking revolver'?


The one where people want to live and not be desert.


I'd rather be desert than dessert. That's jus phuking weak. At least if I'm desert I might be the sand in someones eye. Or vag......

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#6879479 - 09/16/12 06:35 PM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: BillyGoatGruff]
Brad Offline
Campfire Kahuna

Registered: 10/31/00
Posts: 22518
Once again, a thread where those that post can't read.

Perfect.
_________________________
Cartridges are more alike than different.

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#6879525 - 09/16/12 06:48 PM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: Brad]
Mule Deer Offline
Campfire Oracle

Registered: 07/24/01
Posts: 35416
Loc: Banana Belt, Montana
Yep, another example of the failure of American public education system. Either that, or a confirmation of the bell curve.
_________________________
John

The ultimate concern of a rifle loony is rifle trivia. And why not? What else is as distracting from the really important concerns of everyday life?

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#6879549 - 09/16/12 06:53 PM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: Mule Deer]
deflave Offline
Campfire Oracle

Registered: 08/16/07
Posts: 40499
Loc: Havre, Montana
Originally Posted By: Mule Deer
Yep, another example of the failure of American public education system. Either that, or a confirmation of the bell curve.


I love to hear myself speak, and I accept that about me. But I also force myself to listen. And when I find myself not listening I know I'm either completely in the right, or totally schitfaced.


Travis

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#6879623 - 09/16/12 07:13 PM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: deflave]
Mule Deer Offline
Campfire Oracle

Registered: 07/24/01
Posts: 35416
Loc: Banana Belt, Montana
Travis,

Another post worthy of quoting!

I can't remember a post of yours that didn't have a conscious and reasoning purpose, even if you were schitfaced.

Of course, some people on the Fire secretly want to be famous fiction writers. (Or even gun writers, God knows why.) And the Internet is the place to try.
_________________________
John

The ultimate concern of a rifle loony is rifle trivia. And why not? What else is as distracting from the really important concerns of everyday life?

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#6879671 - 09/16/12 07:25 PM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: ingwe]
PaleRider Online   content
Campfire Regular

Registered: 02/04/06
Posts: 901
Originally Posted By: ingwe
Originally Posted By: doubletap

How do you know it barely exited? Did you find it laying on the ground next to the bear?


I think he meant 'bearly' exited...but its tough to tell with the way he spells... grin


grin grin

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#6879689 - 09/16/12 07:30 PM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: PaleRider]
toad Offline
Campfire Tracker

Registered: 02/01/09
Posts: 5663
Loc: Montana
for a guy that can't spell 'too' and 'know', i'm shocked he got 'condescending' right
_________________________
Guns don't kill people, drivers with cell phones kill people.

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#6879734 - 09/16/12 07:39 PM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: PaleRider]
RandyR Offline
Campfire Regular

Registered: 11/09/08
Posts: 1055
Loc: Wi,
I learned today firsthand that a Ruger Bearcat is not what you want to be carrying. We left the woods after putting up a stand and had a very hair raising encounter with a voracious and maniacal escaped cow. We were at least able to keep her out of the corn until the red Heeler showed up!


Attachments
cow.jpg


_________________________
"Jerry is dead, Phish suck time to get a job "

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#6879735 - 09/16/12 07:39 PM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: toad]
PaleRider Online   content
Campfire Regular

Registered: 02/04/06
Posts: 901
Something about a broken clock & twice a day............ grin

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#6879739 - 09/16/12 07:39 PM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: deflave]
3040Krag Offline
Campfire Regular

Registered: 02/07/03
Posts: 253
Loc: Boerne, TX
Y'all are missing the big threat-what about running into a Bigfoot?
Does OC wotk on a Yeti?
What handcannon is effective on a Saquatch? (I think I would lean toward a Howdah double pistol in .577 Snider)
What about liability-would handloaded ammunition get you into trouble in court when you have to whack Bigfoot? In court would having your Howdah slicked up and tricked out make you look like you went looking to fight Yeti? What happens when the local news interviews the Man-ape's Mom, and she says her boy was good at heart and was just starting to turn his life around when a bloodthirsty evil gunowner slew him in cold blood?

To the poor OP if he is still with us-you stand about as much chance of being struck by lightning on the AT as you do being attacked by a black bear or a mountain lion. Get a good .22, shoot the hell out of it before you go, and enjoy your hike.
_________________________
"All I want is to enter my house justified."

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#6879827 - 09/16/12 08:08 PM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: 3040Krag]
Take_a_knee Offline
Campfire 'Bwana

Registered: 09/10/09
Posts: 13798
Originally Posted By: 3040Krag


To the poor OP if he is still with us-you stand about as much chance of being struck by lightning on the AT as you do being attacked by a black bear or a mountain lion.


Probably, no mountain lions in that area but don't discount the bears on the AT. In GA at the Blood Mountain shelter, a BIG blackie ran everyone out of the building (it looks like a Haitian jail) and helped himself to everyone's chow. Of course, they were all granola heads who'd been told they didn't need to ever worry about the bears.

They didn't install "bear cables" at the shelters in NC and VA for no reason.


Edited by Take_a_knee (09/16/12 08:09 PM)
Edit Reason: spellin'

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#6879960 - 09/16/12 09:01 PM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: raverym14]
Sycamore Offline
Campfire Tracker

Registered: 12/27/03
Posts: 7489
Loc: Arizona
Originally Posted By: raverym14
First time post. I am going hiking on the Appalachian Trail in 2 weeks, and wondering what some thoughts are on loads and guns for carrying along. I have a Smith 21 .44 Spl and a Smith 57 .41 Mag. I also have a Super Redhawk .480, but I am not considering it (too big and heavy). There is a very slim chance of black bear, which are fairly small in the Southern Mountains, and cougar. More worrisome are the two legged rats on the trail. I had a cousin and her boyfriend murdered in their tent on the trail back in the 80's. No rape, no robbery, just shot in their sleep for the @#$$ of it. No gun in the world would have helped them, but I am still taking one. I went back and re-read some old articles by Brian Pearce, and I am looking for opinions on which caliber and whether to go with some of the hot Buffalo Bore hard cast loads or something like the Hornady XTP loads. I also have my eye on one of the Ruger Blackhawks .44 Spl built on the .357 frame. ( I am basically just looking for a reason to buy it, it seems it would be less bulky to carry. Any help is greatly appreciated.


How far ya hikin'?

S&W mod 34 kit gun, 22lr, S&W mod 36 Chiefs special, 38spec, Charter Arms Bulldog, 44spec. or suit yourself.

Sycamore
_________________________
Originally Posted By: jorgeI
...Actually Sycamore, you are sort of right....

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#6879988 - 09/16/12 09:20 PM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: Mule Deer]
deflave Offline
Campfire Oracle

Registered: 08/16/07
Posts: 40499
Loc: Havre, Montana
Originally Posted By: Mule Deer
Travis,

Another post worthy of quoting!

I can't remember a post of yours that didn't have a conscious and reasoning purpose, even if you were schitfaced.

Of course, some people on the Fire secretly want to be famous fiction writers. (Or even gun writers, God knows why.) And the Internet is the place to try.


Thanks sir!

One of these days I'm gonna sober up, look through my notes, and either become a gunwriter, or the Penthouse-Forum-writer-guy.

Either way, I'd be havin' fun.



Travis

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#6880006 - 09/16/12 09:34 PM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: Sycamore]
Orchemo Offline
Campfire Guide

Registered: 08/24/07
Posts: 2609
Loc: Oregon
I carry a side arm while backpacking. Why? Because I feel better. Never needed it, but like the comfort of knowing it is there.

I carry while elk hunting if I know I am coming out after dark. Otherwise I do not like the extra weight. I hunt an area with an emerging wolf population. Not sure a pistol is any better than a rifle, but again, makes me feel better.

Use to carry a Ruger SP-101. Nice sized revolver, built like a tank. 5 shots with a hard cast bullet. Not too bad

I have the Ruger Refhawk in 45 colt. heavy loads good for "big" bears? maybe? But too much to carry too far. If I am really concerned about needing a gun for big bears.....guide gun

Now I carry a Glock 29 in 10 mm with hard cast bullets. Nice frontal area, 10 in the mag & an extra 15 shot mag in the pack I find my g29 easier to shoot than a SP-101. Also the extra mag carries my extra ammo supply.

Cheers








Edited by Orchemo (09/16/12 11:21 PM)

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#6880150 - 09/17/12 03:13 AM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: Mule Deer]
doubletap Offline
Campfire Tracker

Registered: 12/05/07
Posts: 5131
Loc: Atlanta
Originally Posted By: Mule Deer

Of course, some people on the Fire secretly want to be famous fiction writers. (Or even gun writers, God knows why.) And the Internet is the place to try.

The why is easy. They want to be rich and famous, a legend in their own time. grin


Edited by doubletap (09/17/12 06:41 AM)
Edit Reason: Decided to add a grin, in case someone takes me seriously.
_________________________
He who joyfully marches in rank and file has already earned my contempt. He has been given a large brain by mistake, since for him the spinal cord would suffice.

- Albert Einstein

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#6880193 - 09/17/12 04:13 AM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: deflave]
jimmyp Offline
Campfire 'Bwana

Registered: 11/28/03
Posts: 11621
Loc: Georgia
I like that LW 44 you have, no fiction there, but I don't think they make it anymore do they? Seems like a nice concept with 44 specials.
_________________________

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#6880396 - 09/17/12 05:47 AM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: jimmyp]
deflave Offline
Campfire Oracle

Registered: 08/16/07
Posts: 40499
Loc: Havre, Montana
Originally Posted By: jimmyp
I like that LW 44 you have, no fiction there, but I don't think they make it anymore do they? Seems like a nice concept with 44 specials.


Thanks, I love it too. I have the 310 as well, but it is on the N-Frame. Will likely go down the road sooner than later.

And to answer your question, they stopped making the 396.

Travis


Edited by deflave (09/17/12 05:48 AM)
Edit Reason: Forgot to answer the man's question.

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#6880740 - 09/17/12 08:06 AM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: doubletap]
Mule Deer Offline
Campfire Oracle

Registered: 07/24/01
Posts: 35416
Loc: Banana Belt, Montana
doubletap,

Now THAT makes sense, somehow--unlike some of this thread.

But in my experience there's more fame (or maybe notoriety) than riches in being a gun writer. In fact my wife often says, "To hell with fame, gimme money."
_________________________
John

The ultimate concern of a rifle loony is rifle trivia. And why not? What else is as distracting from the really important concerns of everyday life?

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#6880747 - 09/17/12 08:10 AM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: deflave]
CoalCracker Offline
Campfire Regular

Registered: 08/23/10
Posts: 707
Loc: PA
The last time that I hiked along the AT, I ran into a group of Mennonite (aka "car Amish") families at one of the more popular scenic overlooks. They had to walk close to four miles, one way, to get there. Some of the mothers, wearing full-length dresses, were even carrying babies that were too young to walk on their own, and there were plenty of other children along, too.

I'd have felt pretty stupid if I showed up wearing an 8" barrelled .44+ caliber cannon strapped across my chest. YMMV.

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#6880890 - 09/17/12 09:00 AM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: Mule Deer]
doubletap Offline
Campfire Tracker

Registered: 12/05/07
Posts: 5131
Loc: Atlanta
Smart woman. You better hang on to her.
_________________________
He who joyfully marches in rank and file has already earned my contempt. He has been given a large brain by mistake, since for him the spinal cord would suffice.

- Albert Einstein

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#6880893 - 09/17/12 09:01 AM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: CoalCracker]
deflave Offline
Campfire Oracle

Registered: 08/16/07
Posts: 40499
Loc: Havre, Montana
Originally Posted By: CoalCracker
The last time that I hiked along the AT, I ran into a group of Mennonite (aka "car Amish") families at one of the more popular scenic overlooks. They had to walk close to four miles, one way, to get there. Some of the mothers, wearing full-length dresses, were even carrying babies that were too young to walk on their own, and there were plenty of other children along, too.

I'd have felt pretty stupid if I showed up wearing an 8" barrelled .44+ caliber cannon strapped across my chest. YMMV.


Exactly. Same with the NP's. I know I can, I just choose to be discreet.


Travis

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#6880927 - 09/17/12 09:10 AM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: deflave]
17ACKLEYBEE Offline
Campfire Kahuna

Registered: 11/04/07
Posts: 19664
Loc: A wash in the west.
Originally Posted By: deflave
Originally Posted By: 17ACKLEYBEE
Originally Posted By: toad
and in what world is the 4#+ .45-70 BFR a 'hiking revolver'?


The one where people want to live and not be desert.


You obviously do lots of hiking.


Travis


I used to and there a lots of other ways to shave weight without putting you life on the line.
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NRA Lifetime Member

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#6880938 - 09/17/12 09:14 AM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: 17ACKLEYBEE]
deflave Offline
Campfire Oracle

Registered: 08/16/07
Posts: 40499
Loc: Havre, Montana
Yeah, it's called scandium.

Give "dramatic" another go. You're almost there.


Travis

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#6880966 - 09/17/12 09:19 AM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: deflave]
17ACKLEYBEE Offline
Campfire Kahuna

Registered: 11/04/07
Posts: 19664
Loc: A wash in the west.
Originally Posted By: deflave
Yeah, it's called scandium.

Give "dramatic" another go. You're almost there.


Travis


Well I'll let you look for a 475 Limbaugh in Scandium.
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NRA Lifetime Member

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#6880979 - 09/17/12 09:23 AM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: 17ACKLEYBEE]
deflave Offline
Campfire Oracle

Registered: 08/16/07
Posts: 40499
Loc: Havre, Montana
I'll let you tell me which portion of the Appalachian phucking Trail requires a .475 Linebaugh.

I'm all ears.


Travis

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#6880994 - 09/17/12 09:26 AM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: deflave]
17ACKLEYBEE Offline
Campfire Kahuna

Registered: 11/04/07
Posts: 19664
Loc: A wash in the west.
Originally Posted By: deflave
I'll let you tell me which portion of the Appalachian phucking Trail requires a .475 Linebaugh.

I'm all ears.


Travis


So you've move to phucking Appalachian area now LOL. Travis you're a dick.
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NRA Lifetime Member

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#6881003 - 09/17/12 09:29 AM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: 17ACKLEYBEE]
deflave Offline
Campfire Oracle

Registered: 08/16/07
Posts: 40499
Loc: Havre, Montana
The OP is asking about a revolver for the AT.

A dick? What are you, captain obvious today?


Travis

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#6881193 - 09/17/12 10:37 AM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: raverym14]
MontanaMarine Offline
Campfire Outfitter

Registered: 09/25/01
Posts: 8500
Loc: Canyon Ferry, Montana
Originally Posted By: raverym14
First time post. I am going hiking on the Appalachian Trail in 2 weeks, and wondering what some thoughts are on loads and guns for carrying along. I have a Smith 21 .44 Spl and a Smith 57 .41 Mag. I also have a Super Redhawk .480......



Out of those three, I'd roll with the M21 44 Spl.

Buffalo Bore makes a 255gr SWC at 1000 fps. That wouldn't be horrid, if you don't roll your own.

https://www.buffalobore.com/index.php?l=product_detail&p=88

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#6881233 - 09/17/12 10:51 AM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: luv2safari]
johnw Offline
Campfire Outfitter

Registered: 05/25/02
Posts: 8551
Loc: old gap grove
Originally Posted By: luv2safari
S&W Mdl 43... wink


This, then...

If.. If a guy just had to carry a gun on the AT, this would be ideal...

Highly accurate, very lightweight, and will do all that needs doing with a handgun on any AT trip.

The threat of aggressive dogs or rabid critters is real, if slight.
The protection offered by such a revolver as the original Model 43 is just as real as the threat, and handily carried, as well.

I'd still have along the battery operated motion detector alarm, as an aid to sound sleep. And the canister of OC would still and always be my preferred protective device.
_________________________
"Chances Will Be Taken"

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#6881259 - 09/17/12 11:00 AM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: johnw]
Jeff_O Offline
Campfire Oracle

Registered: 04/21/07
Posts: 26248
Loc: Wetter'n Oregon
I'd still go Kahr P45 (very flat, very light, 7 rounds) or Glock M22 (can't hurt the damn thing, massive firepower) if people and digs and "critters" were the main worry.

If it's bears, especially large ones, you need to tool up for that a little different, I'm told.

But 7 rounds of .45 ACP in a pistol you forget it's even there because it's so light is pretty cool.
_________________________
Aim small, miss small
Think small, miss big

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#6881298 - 09/17/12 11:10 AM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: 17ACKLEYBEE]
prairie_goat Offline
Campfire Tracker

Registered: 01/25/09
Posts: 6736
Loc: Montana
We are not talking about a romp through a Kodiak Island alder thicket or a trek over the Khyber Pass of A-Stan, this is the phucking Appalachian Trail. Cannons are not needed, nor is fire superiority, despite what you crazy bastards might imagine.
_________________________
"There is no honor in being simply being a shooter and every honor in stalking close to the animal."

Steve Timm


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#6881580 - 09/17/12 01:08 PM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: doubletap]
David_Walter Online   content
Campfire 'Bwana

Registered: 09/07/04
Posts: 10157
Loc: TriCities, WA
Originally Posted By: doubletap

The why is easy. They want to be rich and famous, a legend in their own time MIND. grin


Fixed it for ya...
_________________________
Of all tyrannies, a tyranny sincerely exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive.... those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end for they do so with the approval of their own conscience.
C. S. Lewis

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#6881895 - 09/17/12 03:06 PM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: prairie_goat]
Take_a_knee Offline
Campfire 'Bwana

Registered: 09/10/09
Posts: 13798
Originally Posted By: prairie_goat
We are not talking about a romp through a Kodiak Island alder thicket or a trek over the Khyber Pass of A-Stan, this is the phucking Appalachian Trail. Cannons are not needed, nor is fire superiority, despite what you crazy bastards might imagine.


You can tell who's done time under a heavy load or two. I spent some time in Bob Marshall this summer. Didn't mind the weight of a Glock 20 one bit. There it's justified. On the AT, I'd carry something a bit lighter, but I have several to choose from. A S&W 360 357mag Scandium Kit Gun is about perfect, unfortunately they no longer make them.

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#6882055 - 09/17/12 03:54 PM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: prairie_goat]
George_De_Vries_3rd Offline
Campfire 'Bwana

Registered: 02/19/04
Posts: 10621
Loc: Iowa
Originally Posted By: prairie_goat
We are not talking about a romp through a Kodiak Island alder thicket or a trek over the Khyber Pass of A-Stan, this is the phucking Appalachian Trail. Cannons are not needed, nor is fire superiority, despite what you crazy bastards might imagine.


Ha! Jeepers-creepers, it's the AT for crying out loud! I've been to "one" of the two--not A-stan or Kodiak, but the upper reaches of the Kuskoquim River in AK where we saw brownies every day, some considerably within 100 yds. I've also spent time in the Bob
Where I saw a bear (blacks, though there are obv griz there too) for every two days there.
That's all.. smile. I agree with those who stated the first greatest challenge with carrying a side-arm is deciding when and how you'd use it, not the WHAT you'd carry, then your skill level, then the armamentarium.


Edited by George_De_Vries_3rd (09/17/12 04:00 PM)

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#6882060 - 09/17/12 03:56 PM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: Take_a_knee]
tjm10025 Offline
Campfire 'Bwana

Registered: 06/28/05
Posts: 11269
Loc: Central IN

You guys do realize, don't you, that Ravery, the OP, hasn't posted since the day he started this thread and he hasn't been on-line for more than a week?
_________________________
I've got a rifle, a horse and eight dollars. It'll hold.

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#6882141 - 09/17/12 04:20 PM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: tjm10025]
MontanaMarine Offline
Campfire Outfitter

Registered: 09/25/01
Posts: 8500
Loc: Canyon Ferry, Montana
He's probably on the AT. He said two weeks.

Hope he makes it out alive, however unlikely that may be without all the essential knowledge/wisdom shared here......grin

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#6882158 - 09/17/12 04:27 PM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: MontanaMarine]
prairie_goat Offline
Campfire Tracker

Registered: 01/25/09
Posts: 6736
Loc: Montana
Originally Posted By: MontanaMarine
He's probably on the AT. He said two weeks.

Hope he makes it out alive, however unlikely that may be without all the essential wisdom shared here......grin


Ha! Hope he makes it back in one piece. If he hasn't been eaten by an 800 lb. black bear, or sexually molested by a gang of toothless hillbilly meth addicts he should consider himself lucky.
_________________________
"There is no honor in being simply being a shooter and every honor in stalking close to the animal."

Steve Timm


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#6882182 - 09/17/12 04:33 PM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: prairie_goat]
MontanaMarine Offline
Campfire Outfitter

Registered: 09/25/01
Posts: 8500
Loc: Canyon Ferry, Montana
Reminds me of a local news story. A hiker went missing in the Bob Marshall about a year ago. He was a former Marine, LEO guy. Found his remains just recently.

The newspaper story said he had a 38 revolver. They think the weather got him though. Bad early storm rolled in on him, and it looked like he made a makeshift shelter under some boulders.

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#6882234 - 09/17/12 04:51 PM Re: Hiking revolver [Re: MontanaMarine]
tjm10025 Offline
Campfire 'Bwana

Registered: 06/28/05
Posts: 11269
Loc: Central IN

Day hiker? No tent?
_________________________
I've got a rifle, a horse and eight dollars. It'll hold.

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