Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Savage Collectors Wes Adams auction question???

Lot 1162 121100 Leader grade 300 Savage 24 inch barrel

Lot 1163 121107 Leader grade 300 Savage 24 inch barrel

Neither of these guns should be 300 Savage. Biggest question would be why would anyone restoring a high quality gun stick a modern barrel on it.
It would have made more sense to letter each gun and then find a vintage rifle of same caliber and install the barrel on the high grade frame.
Wonder if Wes knew these were rebarreled?
BillR

are you sure the catalog did not get it right and they are 303s?

Also, seeing as the serial numbers are only 7 guns apart, possible that both were originally ordered by the same person... who may also have sent them back to the factory for "upgrade" to 300 years later when the 300 came out??

Both just speculations on my part... I like the second idea better...

Looking at the pictures both guns have raised front sight ramps from a later period so I suspect both are really later barrels in 300 Savage.
This would mean there was also a significant number of changes inside the receiver as well.
Likely still well beyond my price range!!
BillR

I looked at pictures again of 1162 and see the bluing is actually very grey. The wood metal finish is also not great.
Compare to other engraved guns shown from that time period and you see perfect wood/metal finish and high gloss bluing.
BillR

6 days of auction will put most people on total overload. The Julia auction and it's contents will be FAR out of my reach. I will, however, be at the Poulin auction for the 3 days preceeding the Julia offerings. I would like to be fortunate enough to sneek a peek at the Adams collection and snap a few pictures.

Anyone else going to be there?

You might be right. Would be nice to see the barrel address. Also butt plates are listed as serated so probably restocked, as well. Hard telling what configuration they were originally.

Looking in my data I find an 1899-SR, "A" engraved .303 one number higher than the first and an 1899-H, "B" engraved .303 one number higher than the second that went through the auction houses in past years.

except that is suppose to say 30 years later and not 300 years later!

it does seem odd that the serials are that close, the guns are together and both have the same "anomaly"... sure seems to lend credence to the idea that someone decide it was time to "upgrade" his early factory special guns... I also should admit that I have not looked at these listings since well before this post started so have not reviewed the specifics or pictures.

Did anyone note what these two rifles sold for at the auction?
BillR

Lot 1162 121100 Leader grade $3000+J

Lot 1163 121107 Leader grade $4500+J

These two guns along with 7 more done never left the factory, some are Leader some are Crescent grade, the serial numbers on all 9 I have seen are blank in the factory books how come so many people who never held one of these guns or looked at one be so sure they are wrong, if you took time to study and understand why they were built you would know they are factory done, I should have bought them, one of the best buys !!!!!!!!!

I never have seen such a rifle in person and probably never will...but if you would like to share WHY they were built and WHY they never left the factory and HOW they surface without ever having been sold, I would love to listen and learn! I am not being a wise ass...I seriously am interested in the history/story and I would love to learn more of their story.
Thanks in advance!

Nobody said you're being a wise a$$. BUT if you REALLY wanted to learn all it took was a little over two hours of driving and WAY less than a tank of gas you could have been BLOWN AWAY by the array that was under that roof. There was WAY more than just Savages that were phenominal. I had that very discussion with several people. HOW do some people say that they can tell so much from just a picture. In most discussions, but not all, the consensus was that they REALLY know more about "power talking" and speculation than actual facts. One of these people was employeed by Julia and was a college student, (not that that matters) majoring in cultural anthropology and SHE was able to answer most of the questions we had and then some. I went there KNOWING I couldn't afford to buy. BUT in reality I really SHOULD have been on the bidder's list rather than bid in the "other" auction. You certainly can't be sure looking at a picture and you MAY even be fooled by looking directly at the item. BUT, being on the low end of the scale and having a limited cash flow, the pictures I took and the documentation I was given is priceless to me. There's another Wes Adams auction in March, I believe. You should try to be there.

Questions for Doug....

"These two guns along with 7 more done never left the factory, some are Leader some are Crescent grade, the serial numbers on all 9 I have seen are blank in the factory books"

Doug, are you saying that these were early receivers that were assembled later after 1926? Or, that they were rebuilt? If the log is blank then how do we know what the story behind them is?

Are they all in the same serial range or random? Are they all .300 Sav? Are there more than just the 9?

"...how come so many people who never held one of these guns or looked at one be so sure they are wrong, if you took time to study and understand why they were built you would know they are factory done..."

I never questioned that they were factory work. I just questioned when and why it was done. Good to know that the log is blank.

Don't you have a couple of this type rifle? Seems that yours have barrels with the "SAP" proof. That was only used for a short period of time, from what I have seen. Are they all from that same time period?

There is always more to learn. That is what makes the Savage levers so interesting. You can't just go look it up in a book.

Rick
Yes I have two of these rifles one is in Leader Grade with full
Stippled receiver Flame checked forarm and butstock engraved crown on the top of the receiver fine line checking on the cheek pads and is a Take Down all parts are numbered to the gun and is
in 300 12XXXX

# Two is in Crescent grade 3 point Checking Forarm and Butstock Cheek Pads are Fine line checked
numbered to the gun and had a Takedown Barrel on Solid Frame gun
Barrel is numbered to the gun 300 also 11XXXX
Sould have owned all 4

I'm not sure that seeing those guns in hand would have changed my opinion to much.... I fully suspected they were likely factory work but how they got into the exact configuration still would have escaped me even seeing them in hand.

You obviously had some back up info going into this which certainly helped.

What can you tell us about them other than the record book for these is blank? Any idea why a decent number of receivers all in close serial range were set aside?

I like to dream up ideas of how these sorts of guns came to be... maybe they were each done up with different engraving/ checkering combos on a mix of solid frames and take downs as display pieces aka sales tools and then years later when they stopped offering that level of engraving, they barreled them with the much more desirable 300 Savage barrels and just sold them off.

on a side note, I have seen a pretty fair number of receivers around this same serial number range that have had much later barrels on them... one would initially "assume" they were guns sent back to the factory for new barrels by a later owner but... while I have not kept detailed records on most, I have noted that most I have seen fall into the 110,000 to about 125,000s range.

Last I knew Cabelas had one in 303 with acid etch engraving similar to what is seen on Fox Model Bs but I recall that one has lettered with no info to support and the record was not blank. The serial on it was 122924.

I also recalled Steve (1899sav) sold one in 22HP not long ago with a serial that I have recorded as 1230xx (less than 200 serials from the cabelas gun)

Anyone remember what the serial number was on Archerykings 303H BB, that was sold some 20 years after the serial number would suggest?