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Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 37,243 Likes: 11
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 37,243 Likes: 11 |
JGRaider- the OP is talking about 3-18X42, so apples to apples......man, you would fit in over on opticstalk AND could run for Senator as a Democrat........why would the price of a 2-12X42 even be an issue here?
Take your own advice.......READ posts SLOWLY. Man, that's a low blow, throwing JG in with the politicians. You could have said some really bad stuff about him, kinder than that... DF
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Joined: Aug 2005
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 28,309 Likes: 21 |
He's on the warpath isn't he Dirt? I've already told him it's not worth arguing about. Yeah, calling me a politician is a cheapshot for sure! Sky, I'm just trying to show you why I've said the things I've said, that's all. If you're in love with the Z5 that just tickles me to no end. BTW, next time call me an azzwhole or something besides a politician, please.
It is irrelevant what you think. What matters is the TRUTH.
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Joined: Nov 2010
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Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 37,243 Likes: 11 |
Yeah, "politician" is the "nuclear option" of insults, the lowest of all possible low blows... DF
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Joined: Sep 2004
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
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Yeah, "politician" is the "nuclear option" of insults, the lowest of all possible low blows... DF He coulda said politician from New Yawk city
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Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 37,243 Likes: 11
Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 37,243 Likes: 11 |
Yeah, "politician" is the "nuclear option" of insults, the lowest of all possible low blows... DF He coulda said politician from New Yawk city
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Joined: Jan 2009
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Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
Joined: Jan 2009
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I'm only messin fellas........I thought that was kinda funny....u know you got a chuckle out of it.
New Yawk City.....I didnt go that far..............
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Joined: Nov 2010
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Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 37,243 Likes: 11 |
I'm only messin fellas........I thought that was kinda funny....u know you got a chuckle out of it.
New Yawk City.....I didnt go that far.............. Yeah, low is low. But that one...! Scraping the bottom of the barrel... DF
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Joined: May 2003
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 23,130 Likes: 16 |
Skywalker: Yes check your prices again and then correct your posting. And the other reason I disagree completely with your posting - I would much rather own and use the American made scope that supports American jobs and the American economy! Your posting: "Sorry, but I'm not paying 1100 for a Leupy. Not when a Swaro or Zeiss high end is just a few 100 more". Reconsider your misguided stance, please - American jobs depend on it. ESPECIALLY when the REAL unemployment rate in America is just above 14%! Long live Leupold & Stevens Corporation - an American Company! Hold inot the wind VarmintGuy
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Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 4,742 |
JG. He likes the Z5 a much as you like the Slc-hd :-)
"Every record has been destroyed or falsified, every book rewritten, every picture has been repainted, every statue and street building has been renamed, every date has been altered." ― George Orwell, 1984
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Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
Joined: Nov 2010
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Higher end Swaro glass may edge the VX-6, but not by enough to justify the difference in cost. Not sure the Z3 beats out the VX-6. The Z6's plex is very thin. Much too thin for my taste. And the Z3 glass does not beat out the VX6. I've compared them side by side in failing light. Interestingly we also had a VX-II at the range that evening and, after looking and shooting through the Z3 and VX6 the view through the VX-II was like looking through ginger-ale.
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Campfire Regular
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Reconsider your misguided stance, please - American jobs depend on it. ESPECIALLY when the REAL unemployment rate in America is just above 14%! Long live Leupold & Stevens Corporation - an American Company! Hold inot the wind VarmintGuy You know, my friend and I were just talking about this at lunch today. It seems that most people know the price of almost everything and the value of very few things. Sure, there are some high tech Chinese companies putting out good glass these days, and the price is very low. BUT, I'd rather save my pennies and try to keep the middle class manufacturing jobs as close to home as possible.
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Joined: Aug 2005
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Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 28,309 Likes: 21 |
JG. He likes the Z5 a much as you like the Slc-hd :-) Got it. Truth be known though, I really, really like that Meopta HD, and the GR HD. I could be just as happy using those two instead.
It is irrelevant what you think. What matters is the TRUTH.
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Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 4,742
Campfire Tracker
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Campfire Tracker
Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 4,742 |
"Every record has been destroyed or falsified, every book rewritten, every picture has been repainted, every statue and street building has been renamed, every date has been altered." ― George Orwell, 1984
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Joined: Nov 2010
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Campfire 'Bwana
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Campfire 'Bwana
Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 37,243 Likes: 11 |
It seems that most people know the price of almost everything and the value of very few things. Good one. DF
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Campfire Regular
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So all Leupold products are made in the USA? Hmmm......might want to check your facts on that.
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Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 8,801 Likes: 7
Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 8,801 Likes: 7 |
quote = Terry Cross
I apologize in advance but I have to rant for a second.
I have always been a huge, huge Leupold advocate. They were always my benchmark for quality, innovation and U.S. workmanship. I own an awful lot of their product and continue to use it regularly.
However. . . . In the last few years, I have seen a change in the way Leupold does business and delivers product to the market. As they have grown, they have embraced many less than admirable traits that seem to define too many parts of American businesses. While their pricing has been steadily increasing at a faster rate than inflation, their quality has dropped. They are still capable of producing a sharp, repeatable optic but not as dependably.
My biggest aggravation with Leupold is the fact that less than 5% of their product line that can be legally stamped "Made in U.S.A." and I'm not even sure that those few are !!! What started out with a few of their Wind River imports has blown into an all out effort to prostitute their name brand for a dollar.
I just received 18 RX-4 range finders, 18 Mk4 10x50 Patrol Binoculars and 18 LR/T 4.5-14x50mm TMR Illum. scopes for a package deal I have to ship. This is pretty much suppossed to be their better gear. Guess what? Range finders "Made In CHINA". Binoculars "Made In China". Scopes have no country of origin marked on the packaging, instructions or product. Call back from Leupold informs me that the scopes are assembled in Oregon but so many of the parts and sub-assemblies are made over-seas (mostly China except for some of their lenses)that they do not qualify for the Made in USA stamp!
I can assure you that sourcing their components and products from China has dropped their costs very, very dramatically while they have continued to raise market prices. You know, honestly, it isn't even the price/profit thing that burns me. It is the fact that they chose to move their sourcing and manufacturing (I do consider "manufacturing" and "assembly" two different beasts in this instance) out of the country and specifically China. Why couldn't they keep most of their production here and just up their pricing 10%? Jesus, I could drop my selling price and triple my profit on freakin Pod-Loc kits if I used components from outside the U.S., but I refuse to go there. Guess that is why I still drive a 10 year old truck.
While they may still have satisfactory product performance and at least attempt innovative ideas occaisionally, I believe that they are straying from their roots, pumping a ton of money into foreign factories and putting yet another hole in the bottom of the lifeboat that retains at least a small fraction of our ability to domestically support our police and military logistics in the event of any serious conflict. I remain firmly convinced that we shall sorely curse the day that we wake up and realize that we need to raise our military to a task only to find out we have cut off our own legs. I aim this statement not only at Leupold but other textile, steel, electronics and molding industries based in the U.S. You don't just start that [bleep] back up inside the U.S. borders overnight.
I will continue to use my original Leupold products but I shall migrate away from giving their company blanket support. I will, instead continue to give more and more support to companies that take risks, accept slightly lower margins and consciously make the effort to strengthen our own economy and workforce. As you purchase your gear or spec out the equipment for your agency bids, please consider more than F.O.V. and click value.
I would seriously love to debate the execs at Leupold in front of their Board about some of this.
DISCLAIMER: I know that some out there will have personal budgets at home that restrict your choices to imports and I totally respect that. A non-US product is better than no product at all in some cases.
DISCLAIMER #2: Yeah, that was more than a second. Sorry.
dave
Only accurate rifles are interesting.
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Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 28,309 Likes: 21
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 28,309 Likes: 21 |
Old news, about the 10th time you posted it, but you're the cut and past king dave, taking top honors from E. Congrats!
It is irrelevant what you think. What matters is the TRUTH.
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Joined: Nov 2010
Posts: 1,015
Campfire Regular
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Campfire Regular
Joined: Nov 2010
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So all Leupold products are made in the USA? Hmmm......might want to check your facts on that. Maybe I missed it somewhere, but who said all Leupold products are made in the USA?
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Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 8,801 Likes: 7
Campfire Outfitter
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Campfire Outfitter
Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 8,801 Likes: 7 |
quote = Terry Cross
I apologize in advance but I have to rant for a second.
I have always been a huge, huge Leupold advocate. They were always my benchmark for quality, innovation and U.S. workmanship. I own an awful lot of their product and continue to use it regularly.
However. . . . In the last few years, I have seen a change in the way Leupold does business and delivers product to the market. As they have grown, they have embraced many less than admirable traits that seem to define too many parts of American businesses. While their pricing has been steadily increasing at a faster rate than inflation, their quality has dropped. They are still capable of producing a sharp, repeatable optic but not as dependably.
My biggest aggravation with Leupold is the fact that less than 5% of their product line that can be legally stamped "Made in U.S.A." and I'm not even sure that those few are !!! What started out with a few of their Wind River imports has blown into an all out effort to prostitute their name brand for a dollar.
I just received 18 RX-4 range finders, 18 Mk4 10x50 Patrol Binoculars and 18 LR/T 4.5-14x50mm TMR Illum. scopes for a package deal I have to ship. This is pretty much suppossed to be their better gear. Guess what? Range finders "Made In CHINA". Binoculars "Made In China". Scopes have no country of origin marked on the packaging, instructions or product. Call back from Leupold informs me that the scopes are assembled in Oregon but so many of the parts and sub-assemblies are made over-seas (mostly China except for some of their lenses)that they do not qualify for the Made in USA stamp!
I can assure you that sourcing their components and products from China has dropped their costs very, very dramatically while they have continued to raise market prices. You know, honestly, it isn't even the price/profit thing that burns me. It is the fact that they chose to move their sourcing and manufacturing (I do consider "manufacturing" and "assembly" two different beasts in this instance) out of the country and specifically China. Why couldn't they keep most of their production here and just up their pricing 10%? Jesus, I could drop my selling price and triple my profit on freakin Pod-Loc kits if I used components from outside the U.S., but I refuse to go there. Guess that is why I still drive a 10 year old truck.
While they may still have satisfactory product performance and at least attempt innovative ideas occaisionally, I believe that they are straying from their roots, pumping a ton of money into foreign factories and putting yet another hole in the bottom of the lifeboat that retains at least a small fraction of our ability to domestically support our police and military logistics in the event of any serious conflict. I remain firmly convinced that we shall sorely curse the day that we wake up and realize that we need to raise our military to a task only to find out we have cut off our own legs. I aim this statement not only at Leupold but other textile, steel, electronics and molding industries based in the U.S. You don't just start that [bleep] back up inside the U.S. borders overnight.
I will continue to use my original Leupold products but I shall migrate away from giving their company blanket support. I will, instead continue to give more and more support to companies that take risks, accept slightly lower margins and consciously make the effort to strengthen our own economy and workforce. As you purchase your gear or spec out the equipment for your agency bids, please consider more than F.O.V. and click value.
I would seriously love to debate the execs at Leupold in front of their Board about some of this.
DISCLAIMER: I know that some out there will have personal budgets at home that restrict your choices to imports and I totally respect that. A non-US product is better than no product at all in some cases.
DISCLAIMER #2: Yeah, that was more than a second. Sorry.
dave You can make it 11 now.... dave
Only accurate rifles are interesting.
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Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 28,309 Likes: 21
Campfire Ranger
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Campfire Ranger
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 28,309 Likes: 21 |
Get back to us when you have something relevant to say E, I mean dave.
It is irrelevant what you think. What matters is the TRUTH.
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