Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Ask The Gunwriters What is a magnum cartridge?

The subject of a "true" magnum came up on the thread about the 7mm Remington Magnum. Didn't want to break that one up so am starting a new thread. Since it's obviously between major hunting seasons both in North America and Africa, and a lot of people are bored (the reason they're posting so much), I thought I'd troll a little and see what trouble we can get into.

A 'true' magnum has the initials H&H behind it...



Accept no substitutes....

Magnum , anything that kicks harder than the 30-06 and shoots a Big Game bullet over 2800 FPS

Years ago Wootters had an article that discussed "trajectory" magnums and "power" magnums. I haven't seen anyone define it better.

Anything that's louder, kicks more and doesn't kill anything more deader..

What is a 222Remington Magnum? All of it is marketing I think.

I can't define it, but I know what one is when I shoot it.

If you'd of asked me this 15 years ago I would of said anything with a belt except the 240 Roy.Today who knows?

What a can of worms. Used to be the presence of a belt. Now it is what ever a manufacturer decides to name it. There isn't a single good answer to your question.

1.5 liters instead of 750 ml. +1 on the H&H .

The only "magnum" is a bottle of bubbly...after that they are all cartridges!

+10 grs of propellant + 100fps + wishful thinking.

The word magnum refers to something that is larger than normal or average objects of it's type.

If we count the whitetail or muley as being our average game, then larger stuff like elk could be considered as magnum game.

Now, I'd never say that larger, or magnum game can't or shouldn't be taken with normal or average rifles. But clearly, and by their designers claims, some cartridges were meant for larger stuff. I would count rifle cartridges that were designed for larger species as magnums.

The 30-06 Springfield was designed to kill horses, thus it qualifies as a magnum by my reasoning.

Lots of people believe if the case is Bigger and kicks more then it has to kill a animal deader than the Smaller case that kicks less ,like the 06 or 308. My opinion the only real world advantage of a Magnum is that it will push a Heavier and Bigger Cal Bullet the same speed or maybe a little faster than the Standard Case's will push a lighter bullet.

I'd say a "true magnum" is one to which the manufacturer added "Magnum" in the name.

Let's not forget the .22 Winchester Magnum Rimfire!

I think the more easily defined "true magnum" involves large bottles of champagne...

More seriously, I would have said centerfire magnums generally involve being a certain amount overbore in powder capacity, but it turns out that's not a very good way to look at it:

http://bulletin.accurateshooter.com/2011/04/overbore-cartridges-a-working-definition/

Note the "mighty" 458 Win Mag is second from the bottom of the list...and the 243 Win is near the top! (Probably explaining the 243's reputation as a barrel burner...) Surprisingly (to me) the 338 Win Mag isn't very overbore either, it's pretty close to a scaled-up 30-06.

So, I'll just go back to my original statement. I think there's something to the "velocity" versus "power" magnums distinction though...

I don't think it's a "true troll" when one can actually learn something from it! Thanks!

Yes, and/or a magnum will push a similar bullet wt noticeably faster, therefore it will FLATTEN the trajectory at extended ranges.

The advantages of that 'should' be obvious.

OTOH - sometimes round 'here', that is either ignored or belittled.

225 Win Mag & up ?

Let's throw a few more worms into the can:

A bunch of people will bring up a "magnum" of wine. This comes from the Latin word magnus, meaning "great" or "large." And even then magnum didn't always refer to a bottle of wine, as in "magnum opus," or major work.

We're discussing cartridges. Here are some firearms--applicable definitions from quick web search of various on-line dictionaries:

1) A thing of a type that is larger than normal.
2) Of or relating to a cartridge containing a larger explosive charge than other cartridges of the same size
3)A large powerful gun

So far the dictionaries are all over the place, just like us, but the most common definitions relate to relative size, as in "a thing of a type that is larger than normal."

Of course, all dictionary definitions are based on what's called "common usage," meaning a general agreement among speakers of the same language. Does "a type that is larger than normal" refer to a specific caliber, such as .270, or to all rifle cartridges?

If the former, then the .270 Winchester can't be considered a magnum, as somebody suggested in the other thread. It was the first .27-caliber cartridge, so wasn't larger than normal. But the .270 Weatherby would be considered a "true magnum," since it's larger than normal--normal being the .270 Winchester.

According to the same definition the .17 Hornady Rimfire Magnum also isn't a true magnum, since it was the first rimfire .17 cartridge, so defined "normal." But the new .17 Winchester would be a true magnum, since it's larger than the .17 HMR. The same would be true of the .22 Magnum.

Or is a magnum cartridge simply larger than "normal" rifle cartridges? If so, what is a normal rifle cartridge? The .22 Long Rifle? The .30-06?

Evidently one of the problems here is "common usage." The Campfire has gotten into this before in the Big Bore forum. Some insist on the circa-1900 British definition of "big bore," .45 caliber or more. But we're not British and this is 2013. A Pennsylvania deer hunter might consider a .35 Whelen a big bore. Certainly my hunting companions in Montana when I was growing up considered any big game round much over .30 caliber a "big bore"--and in that context their opinion would certainly be "common usage."

Or is a magnum cartridge like one of the old definitions of pornography: "I know it when I see it."?

The 30/06 sort of sets the "baseline" for bullet weight,speed, trajectory,powder capacity, etc.,or some combinations of these factors.

Anything that goes faster with the same bullets, or starts substantially heavier bullets at the same velocity,is a "magnum"...therefore, we have the 300 magnums,and the 338 WM and 375 H&H are both "magnums"because they start 250 and 270 gr bullets at about the same speed the 30/06 does a 180 gr....ditto if you compare a 200-210 in the 338 with a 150 in the 30/06; or a 235 or 250 gr in the 375.

(I don't know what to do with the likes of the 458 and 460 Weatherby.Both are magnums for sure....as is the 416 Rigby and that ilk) .

In both cases, it takes larger cases than the 30/06 to accomplish this in anything 30 caliber and up.

If we want to substantially improve 30/06 trajectory ,we start the same bullets faster from larger cases; or smaller caliber,lighter bullets,at higher velocity,also from cases of large capacity.Then we end up with things like the 264,7RM,257 Weatherby,STW, etc.

So, whether the objective is moving heavier bullets at 30/06 velocities; or the same or lighter bullets at higher velocities,both these objectives require cases of generally larger capacities than the 30/06.

Of course we can find exceptions and ask, is a 6mm/06 or 25/06,or 270 a "magnum"? Sure! Under this criteria , they are,even though all are from the 30/06 case...but all three do shoot "flatter" than the 30/06,with smaller diameter and lighter bullets.

If we think harder, we might find exceptions to any of this...with so much cartridge overlap it's hard to draw hard and fast rules.

But if you use the 06 as the baseline,it isn't hard to categorize a magnum,at least when you're bored and have nothing better to do on a Saturday morning.


Edited to Add: We can also toss in whatever cartridge the marketing agency of arms and ammunition manufacturers decides to call "magnum".

Here's another little item: If definitions are based on common usage, why does "magnum of wine" always come up in these discussions? I can't ever remember ever hearing anybody in a store asking for a magnum of Pinot Noir or Chardonnay.

Actually, I'd guess that most rifle loonies wouldn't even know about "magnum" bottles of wine if they hadn't read an article by some gun writer mentioning them while writing about magnum cartridges. We're probably the only people who keep the wine term alive.