Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Africa caliber question

For African hunters/PH's,I have a question about whether or not a caliber is suitable for Africas large dangerous game including cape buffalo,rhino,and maybe elephant.
Is a rifle that propels a .585 caliber,650 grain FMJ to 16-1700 fps suitable for any animal in Africa?
It will propel a 480 grainer to 2000 fps also.

Would it be better if it propelled the .585/650grainer to 2000-2100 fps, or is 1700 fps enough to do the job?

The shape of the bullet and distance to target may dictate that your impact velocity will be in the lower area within your question so there is really a lot more to it before a definitive answer could be given.

FYI
A 650 grain bullet at 1700fps generates 4172 FPE
A 480 grain bullet at 2000fps generates 4264 FPS.

Not much in it on paper, but in the field the 650 grainer would have a higher Sectional Density and with common bullet design for 'usual" FMJ's would also out penetrate the lighter bullet.

A seasoned rifleman would never choose the lighter option for any dangerous game that required an FMJ.

John

i understand.Im asking because as of now the closest thing to a safari rifle i have is a .585 short and can launch 650's at 1700 fps. The established safari rifles like the nitro expresses and Rigbys etc run at 2200-2400 fps.

My question was if .585/650 grains going 1700fps would be efficient on rhino,buff,elephant??

If you have the cheque book to accommodate those interests, why not consider a new rifle?

Sometimes it is better not to look at option that "might" work when relatively little extra cost can redirect your attention to the hunting experience itself.

i really do appreciate your input.If i was going on safari, i would take a .416 Rigby or a .585HE. I was imquiring of people who have experience with African game.Such a combination i proposed has a higher TKO rating than established safari calibers,but i wanted to hear peoples opinion about a .585,650 grain projectile going 1700fps and how they thought it would perform on DG.

Geoff McDonald, the owner of Woodleigh Bullets once told me he had never chronographed a single Nitro round that lived up to factory specs. This simply means that many of those larger bore caetridges which were designed in pre chronograph era's likely had ballistic claims rounded up or perhaps, well up.

There is a momentum factor you can see in the field with heavy caliber, heavy weight bullets and if construction is adequate, then placement will trump.a few more FPS the same as a few extra yards will have little detriment to performance again, if placement is optimum.
John

Is 1700 FPS enough to do the job? Yes, probably, maybe. Truthfully it should work fine on everything, although I would be very nervous with an elephant and would want a buffalo to be very close in.

Is 2000 FPS better? IMO definitely.

Many things play a factor in penetration. Bullet design and construction being among the most important. Proper velocity that matches bullet design is also critical.

Keep in mind a 20% increase (from 1700 to 2040) in velocity equals approximately a 50% (from 4172 to 6007) increase in energy.

thank for your input,i appreciate it

interesting.thank you for your input

Another thought, when trying to understand penetration on large game, remember that the lowly .45/70 and .500 S&W have both generated history in penetration on the largest African game.

The reason is directly related to bullet construction and placement which always was/is the major factor.

John

In years gone by, many African animals were killed with large bullets of about this velocity, and perhaps slower.

A black powder rifle, either a cartridge or a muzzle loader, would not produce speeds now used in smokeless powder rifles.

Hunters of that time period used bullet weight and diameter to increase energy, because the black powder rifles would not give as much velocity as needed.

Also, consider that for the most part, hunters of that time period used solid lead round balls and I doubt that a .450 lead round ball at 1500 to 1800 FPS would be very effective on elephant and/or cape buffalo. I don't see a sold lead bullet of .50 and larger being about to penetrate to an elephants brain at those velocities.

I have read, but not experienced it, that there were many incidents of the .600 not penetrating enough, because of the 1800-1900 FPS and the round nose bullet. Of course, the majority of these heavy bullets were jacketed, but they still did not give as much penetration as needed.