Home Forums Hunting & Shooting Express Rifles and Big Bores Only 416 Rigby Vs 458 Win Mag

I've owned a CZ .416 and fired a few .458's. My CZ had good bedding and just needed a trigger re-build. I also had the bolt handle straightened and bent out a bit more for easier cycling.

For me they are two different animals. The .458 has less perceived recoil for me.

To come close to the .416 Rigby you really need to step up to a hot loaded 458 Lott.

Before you buy, try to put five or ten rounds through each.

Penetrate anything = .416 Rigby.
Easy on the shoulder and wallet = .458WM.

Oh, and everyone has a a .458, that's why they are cheap to run.

I am a 416 man myself, just like Harry Selby

I chose the 416 Rigby when I was building my idea of an ultimate DGR and African hunting rifle partly due to its greater flexability with loads etc but largely because it IS different than what most people have and the cartridges just look and sound so danged COOL! That, and the fact that I can (and do) load it up to be 416 Weatherby Equivalent makes the choice a good one, for me.

With 350gr TTSX's at 2750fps I do not feel horribly overgunned or undergunned going after any and all of the bears, used it at the 24hrcf TN hog hunt last March, and have a rifle that shoots pretty flat out to however far away I care to try a shot. Yet at the same time, with 400gr Banded Solids can penetrate to the brain or heart or anything else I want top perforate on any game animal that roams the planet.

I am fortunate that my particular 416 Rigby (could be partly due to the really heavy barrel these came with or the fact that I full length bedded it) shoots the 400's and the 350's close enough to the same POI that I do not need to change sight settings or scopes to use either round and loading.

If I was a full time Elephant PH, I would probably have a 458 Lott, but for my use the last 20 years my warmly loaded 416 Rigby has been a wonderful partner on many hunts both locally, in Alaska and in Africa.

It DOES kick some, though. Just ask new member "scope eye 416" who joined our forums last March after test firing my rifle and loads exactly ONCE

With factory level loads, the heavy CZ rifle is fairly easy in the shoulder, IMO.

Harry Selby used several rifles over his career, including some doubles and a .458 Winchester. He firmly stated a couple of years ago that the .416 Rigby was his preferred caliber and rifle, and that if starting all over today he'd get a .416 Rigby and not bother with anything else.

I hunted in Tanzania a couple of years ago with old pro Luke Samaras, and Luke said much the same thing, mostly because the .416 works fine on elephant (Luke's favorite game) even in the thick cover they're usually found in today--but it also shoots flat enough to stop wounded eland, lion or buffalo at 200+ yards. Oh, and Luke has also used a wide variety of rifles in his nearly 50-year career, including several nice doubles.

I got my .416 Rigby CZ in 2000, mostly due to Ruark's book HORN OF THE HUNTER, setting it up to match the 9-1/4 pound weight of Selby's rifle. Luke's rifle is another Rigby, though a little fancier than Selby's (which I've fired),and weighs just about the same. My rifle has done quite well on buffalo, even when I wasn't perfect, and it's gratifying to know that a couple of top African pros with LONG experience feel it's ideal.

I took my first Tanzania Masailand buffalo with a CZ 550 in 416 Rigby, and my second...
The second was one a hunter had gut-shot and had been shot 4 more times with a 9,3X64 Brenneke. It was still going strong and came out behind us after we lost it in heavy bush. One shot from the 416 put it down at last. A 458 most assuredly would have had the same effect at 8 feet.

I also took two with a 9,3X74R; they both died. BUT, the 416 Rigby hits with authority, and it was a good choice for PG with my second scope and 350 Speers.

Exactly! Sums up my feelings perfectly on the 416

hello,
Fews years ago I have owned a Parker Hale .458WM, I disliked it cause first the stock, second the .458WM ... missing penetration.
Today I have a Winch 70 Safari Express cal .416RM, powders now have no problem with african heat! This cartridge never has had any problem,in spite of high pressure. Balisticaly speaking it's very closed to the .416 Rigby , a clone and it's cheaper !!! I love it!!

Nowadays, an other possibiliy, you can look at the .458Lott ...

My PH believes that the .375 H&H is the best DG hunting cartridge. He personally carries a .500 Nitro Express. Why? It's a stopping rifle, not a hunting rifle (he says).

My own limited experience, consisting of of one hippo, one elephant bull, and one buffalo each with the .375 and the .458 WM makes me tend to agree with him. Make a fair shot with either and you've got dead game.

I personally feel the .416s are sort of like 16 gauge shotguns. There is so much overlap with 12 and 20s that 16s have no purpose. As for the Lott, about all I think it would add would be a slightly heavier rifle, more recoil, more flinch likelihood, and a longer bolt throw.

Given a choice between .458 and .416, though, I'd pick .416 due to slightly less recoil and better long range performance on plains game.

I can't quite agree with you on recoil, the 416Rigby is somewhat sharper than the 458WM (I guess because similar projectile weight, similar velocity but slightly more powder in the 416).

your talking about the choice between two rather different yet similar in some respects ,calibers and rifles designed for different uses.
now theres no question the 416 rigby is a bit more versatile, and will work rather well , but its NOT designed as a STOPPING RIFLE.
the 458 win was designed to duplicate the ballistics and hitting power of a British dangerous game rifle in the 450-470 caliber range, these mostly throw a 480 grain-to-520 grain bullet at between 2100fps and 2400fps, and by design mostly use or at least are intended to use solids that penetrate an elephants skull or bust both shoulder on a cape buffalo, the 458 is designed as a STOPPING rifle for use in stopping a charge at under 60 yards.
the 416 rigby , like the 375 H&H is fully capable of killing anything in Africa, but its not designed specifically as a stopping rifle.
theres a difference between being able to kill with a single shot (which the 375 H&H and 416rigby do well)and stopping a charge of a truly pissed off dangerous animal at pistol shot ranges for which the added caliber (diameter & impact area) and bullet weight of the 458 calibers 500-510 grain slug have over time proven to have a sight advantage.
read AFRICAN RIFLES AND CARTRIDGES
by JOHN TAYLOR

IF YOU CHOOSE TO RELOAD
458 win brass $56 for 50 cases
http://www.midsouthshooterssupply.com/item.asp?sku=000038694
$46 for 50 bullets
http://www.midsouthshooterssupply.com/item.asp?sku=000034507
http://www.handloads.com/loaddata/d...mp;Weight=All&type=Rifle&Source=

416 rigby brass $75 for 25
http://www.midsouthshooterssupply.com/item.asp?sku=0001320210605
$46 for 50 bullets
http://www.midsouthshooterssupply.com/item.asp?sku=000034167
http://www.handloads.com/loaddata/d...;type=rifle&Order=Powder&Source=

personally I think the 458 wins a better choice as lower velocity 405 grain and various cast bullet loads make it a good deal more fun to hunt with especially if you already own a 375H&H

Have had both, still have the 458 WM.

Gunner

The nice thing about the 416 Rigby is you can always rebarrel to a 450 Rigby should you want more ...

Now, Gunner, tell the rest of the story...

If I remember correctly, it was your .416 Rigby you shot until the barrel was toast. Then you had it re-bored to .505 Gibbs.

Am I pretty close with the details of that story? If so, one could say you were so fond of the .416 Rigby, you shot it out, whereas you never shot out your .458 WM, not yet at least...

Guys who have actually shot out a DG rifle barrel would have to be few and far between...

DF

Currently have 2 458's one 416Rigby and 3 375 H&H's I have taken game in Africa with the 375's and the 416Rigby but have never used either 458 in Africa. Actually at one time I owned 5 375H&H's. I rather like them.

Well there is that , bought the Rigby in '94 and the 458 in '09.

Gunner

You just haven't had the .458 long enough...

DF

I have a CZ 550 Magnum in 416 Rigby and a BRNO 602 in 458wm. Both rifles are accurate and function flawlessly.

The Rigby, for me, is easy to shoot and the BRNO kicks like a mule. Go figure - stocks I guess.

I have not killed anything with the 458, the Rigby has potted a couple of bears. Worked well.

I do think one can load the Rigby up way past what the 458 does if one was so inclined. I bought 50 Norma brass a few years ago and I can't wear this stuff out, probably last the rest of my days.

If I were to do it again, knowing what I know now, I would probably just have the Rigby.

No one mentioned the .404J.

It doesn't require a big action like the .416 Rigby, can be built on a std mag action, generally a lighter and less bulky rifle. It shoots a slightly larger diameter bullet (.423") and can be loaded to run pretty close to the Rigby. It's an easy to shoot round for a DG gun. What's not to like?

BTW, I don't dislike the Rigby. Just like the .404J better. I don't have much use for a .458.

IMHO,

DF

There is a whopping .025 inch difference in case length of the 2 cartridges , no practical difference. Harry Selby's 416 Rigby was built on a standard 98 Mauser action. So it can be done

Not as easy as a .404J build.

If you look at one of those vintage .416's, the box mag is cut away except for the back wall. The stock inlet becomes the box mag, which seems to work. A good bit of cutting has to be done on the feed ramp to accommodate the longer round.

Those old craftsmen made it work. I don't know how many today would tackle such a project, whereas, the .404J conversion is a piece of cake. The fewer alterations, the lower the conversion cost. The Rigby builds I see are on the big Mauser actions, so that must be considered the most economical way to build a .416 Rigby.

DF